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Old Sunn O))) cab

#21
Sartori said:
I haven't been back to the warehouse since last weekend and won't be able to get back there until next weekend. So no, I did not measure.

The drivers must be less puny than one might think, because the bassist in the guitarist's other band mainly uses that cab, and it doesn't sound like any of the speakers are blown, to me.

I'll take the back panel off and look inside the next chance I get. Is it a sealed cab, originally? It's impossible to tell from the outside, as the grill cloth isn't transparent really.
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure the factory drivers should be these;

DSC00049.jpg


Probably rated at about 25 watts. Pretty impressive motor structure, huh? :rolleyes:
They qualify as "puny" in my book, what do you think? :D

Of course, if it is in fact a 1200S cab, it's 40+ yrs old and could have had several speaker changes over the last four decades.

You need to perform exploratory surgery for an accurate diagnosis Dr. Sartori!

Yeah, IIRC it's a sealed cab.
 
#22
Hmm... now I'm not sure again. The grillcloth makes it hard to tell much about the cab besides that there are six speakers (even the size is hard to tell because only the centers are really visible), but they didn't look like they were arrayed diagonally like that. Next weekend I'll be able to take the back off and get to the bottom of things. I'll bring a tape measure and post height, width and depth, and if I can't get pictures of the inside, I'll at least describe what I see.

The cab needs work anyway, because I REALLY don't like the fact that there's no input jack plat and the input wiring is just kinda hanging out the back and taped in place. Seems like an easy way for bad things (injury, possibly death) to happen.

On a semi-related note, something I've been wondering. There's a lot of talk on this forum about the dispersion characteristics of drivers laid out in horizontal rows vs. vertical. Some cabs, like the one pictured, have the drivers arranged diagonally. How does that affect things? Is it the same as horizontally or somewhere between?
 
#23
For some reason, I couldn't find photos with the head on top of this cabinet, nor any rear photos. But the following is a 6x12 Sunn cabinet.

6x1202.gif


6x1201.gif


Later models were slightly taller and had a port at the bottom front (still behind the grill). This is sealed, with front loaded drivers, and the back did not open. Better highs with the original Sunn alnico speakers. I'm certain I swapped the OE drivers for Carvin 12s (Eminence) that were "meant" for PA, not specifically for bass (sometime in the mid 80s)... Sounded great with the Sunn 200S though! I can understand why Squire would like 'em!

Here's my 200S (long gone, unfortunately!!!):

200Sfr-1.gif


OK, my 6x12 Sunn had different handles... This was at a practice space my blues band used in the 80s... I just asked the guitarist/bandleader... He claimed my cab had a pair of handles (like Fender amps) on one "long" side, and no casters... Memories fade over time I guess... Great guitar cab too!!! When "bigger is better" was the rule, this cab was dyn-o-mite!!!
 
#24
I don't think it's one of those angled baffle cabs, as it's not very deep at all, and the handles on the side (ha ha, only on one side) look more like previous pictures.

I of course was running my Mesa/Boogie D-180 through it, set for lots of growl and it sounded pretty nasty (in a cool way). Cut through very well.

The bassist for the other band that rehearses at our place uses an old Peavey head through it (Mark IV I think?). While not putting out a lot of low end, the speakers don't seem to be busted yet.

I will let you all know what I find when I open the cab up next weekend.
 
#25
Sartori said:
Hmm... now I'm not sure again. The grillcloth makes it hard to tell much about the cab besides that there are six speakers (even the size is hard to tell because only the centers are really visible), but they didn't look like they were arrayed diagonally like that. Next weekend I'll be able to take the back off and get to the bottom of things. I'll bring a tape measure and post height, width and depth, and if I can't get pictures of the inside, I'll at least describe what I see.

The cab needs work anyway, because I REALLY don't like the fact that there's no input jack plat and the input wiring is just kinda hanging out the back and taped in place. Seems like an easy way for bad things (injury, possibly death) to happen.

On a semi-related note, something I've been wondering. There's a lot of talk on this forum about the dispersion characteristics of drivers laid out in horizontal rows vs. vertical. Some cabs, like the one pictured, have the drivers arranged diagonally. How does that affect things? Is it the same as horizontally or somewhere between?
Click to expand...

The 1200S drivers aren't diagonal. The cab I posted is a Sceptre, not a 1200S. I'm pretty sure the drivers are the same ones that came in the 1200S, I posted the pic to illustrate how wimpy the 12" AlNiCo Sunn transducers were.

I can't imagine that dispersion was a factor in the design of either cab, I’d imagine that the issue was simply fitting the drivers in existing boxes.
The 40”X 24” X 15” Sceptre cab was the same box as the 100S, 200S, Sentura ll, etc., just like the 1200S was the same box as the 2000S, 1500S, etc..
In the late 60’s Sunn wanted to capitalize on the growing popularity of British 4X12 cabs (Marshall, Hiwatt, etc.) with one of their own, and the easiest, cheapest, and quickest to market way was to convert their existing 40”X 24” X 15” cab to a 4X12 configuration.
The only way they could get four 12’s in that box was diagonally.
 
#26
Well how was I supposed to know that? Again, I'm definitely no expert in vintage Sunn gear.

About the dispersion thing, I was mostly speaking from a more general perspective than wondering why that specific cab had diagonally arranged speaker.

I'll have further information on the cab a week from now. It seems likely that it is in fact a 1200S cab.
 
#27
One of the best bass sounds I ever got was a Mesa prototype 4x10 which was deeper than their guitar 4x10's but shallower than the bass models at the time. It was loaded with Mojo tone speakers. Sounded awesome until I exceeded the rating on those poor guys and blew all 4 of em at once. Had to limp thru the rest of the gig on my ampeg 4x10 by itself.
I think guitar speakers sound marvelous on bass if you like a little grind in your tone. If you are going for piano-tone they arent your thing!

Love that pick of the one with the V shaped baffle. Used to have one at my old rehearsal studio in west Oakland.
 
#30
Update:

As suspected, it is a guitar 6x12. It's in rough shape. Opening it up wasn't hard, as only six of the 50 screw holes had screws in them.

The speakers all had those stickers that said "guitar transducer" on them. Definitely explains why this cab has almost no low end.

So, now, what to do? I like the suggestion of simply making a new baffle board and putting in two 15" speakers. It needs work anyway.

What 15" speakers would work best in a sealed cab this size?
 
#32
What an unhelpful comment. Don't be such a killjoy party-pooper.

I've got two bass cabinets, a 1x15 and a 2x10. However, converting this cab seems doable, especially since the other bassist who uses the rehearsal space would probably be down for helping cover the cost.

I didn't ask if I should just not use this cab. I asked what would be good 15" speakers to put in it. If you aren't going to help me arrive at that answer, then please kindly keep your unhelpful comments to yourself.
 
#33
Sartori said:
Update:

As suspected, it is a guitar 6x12. It's in rough shape. Opening it up wasn't hard, as only six of the 50 screw holes had screws in them.

The speakers all had those stickers that said "guitar transducer" on them. Definitely explains why this cab has almost no low end.

So, now, what to do? I like the suggestion of simply making a new baffle board and putting in two 15" speakers. It needs work anyway.

What 15" speakers would work best in a sealed cab this size?
Click to expand...

Well, as I mentioned you can probably get $50 or so each for the old drivers to help cover the cost of new ones. I'm sure there's a 12" driver that will get the job done for bass in a big sealed box like that, but off the top of my head I don't know what to suggest.
As far as 15's, I have several 2000S cabs and I've used dozens of different drivers in them, truthfully nothing really sounds bad. It depends on what sound you want to get. I have no idea what your personal taste is, but on general principle I would suggest porting the cab.
I can get some measurements from a 2000S for you if you want, but like I said earlier, it's basically two baffle boards with a 4.5" (I think) gap between the acting as a port.

But... based on this you might want to keep the cab in original condition. For $2100 I'm sure someone will gladly sell you a loaded 2000S cab, and even deliver it to you! ;)
 
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#35
Oh wow. Unfortunately it's not in anything close to that good of condition. As mentioned, it's missing 44 of the 50 screws for the back board, which is slightly warped. The input jackplate is also missing (the jack is just kinda hanging out the back).

Selling it is not really an option.

If I just made a new baffle board, we could simply store the old one with the old speakers still on it, right?

If I try to make it ported, I just know I'll screw it up somehow. Are there any 15" speakers that would work with it in a sealed configuration? I know that will limit low end, but that's okay, my sound is mostly mids. Sealed will also limit power handling, I think, but as long as it handles 400 watts, it should be pretty safe.
 
#39
Do you need an extra bass cab? Can you run an extra bass cab, or would this be a replacing one of your existing cabs? I can't imagine it would sound better than either cab you've already got.

But, if you're down to do this, I've heard wonderful things about the Eminence Kappalite 15's. Not very cheap, though.
 
#40
It would be giving the option for a different rig, enabling me to keep a cab at home to play through and a cab (the Sunn cab) at the rehearsal spot.

As it is, it's being used for bass all the time by one band and some of the time by my band (my guitarist is in both bands). It'd be able to serve this purpose way better if it had actual bass speakers in it, and two 15" speakers would probably not be as expensive as getting six 12" ones. I've also been wanting a 2x15 recently.

If I'm brave enough to attempt a ported baffle board, the Kappalites would probably work, I've thought about that. I might go for just a sealed configuration though, so as not to make things too complicated, and also because I've had a curiosity as far as a sealed 2x15". What 15" might work well in a sealed cab?
 

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