Opinions on drum mic'ing

[jaywa]

The hi hat is tricky. It can be obnoxiously loud and also overly subtle. Compressing is an option but you lose dynamics.

Yeah... to me, how the hi-hat sits in the mix is one of those things that really differentiates between an "OK" mix and one that's truly a cut above. I also understand it can be a hard piece for the FOH engineer to get a handle on because a lot of drummers don't seem to have very good technique on that piece of their kit. Which may be why it's not mic'd in the first place.

 

[LiamPodmore]

Best drummer I ever played with could play so quietly we could rehearse with out a PA (he could also bash and crash like any good drummer.

My band rehearse using acoustic guitars, 25w bass amp for me, drummer on a full umuted acoustic kit using standard wood tip sticks. I can hear everything clearly. When we get to a gig, we rarely mic any of the kit (Mostly pub gigs) and can still hear him fine along with everything else.

Back on topic, your drummers kit is huge, a venue of that size over here, you would take up the whole stage with that, if there is even a stage in the first place. The most i would really mic in a venue like that is kick, snare and hihat, MAYBE use an overhead depending on sound levels, but i'm not a sound engineer, so what do i know?

Liam

 

[rtslinger]

Overkill small club like that I would say just the kick to tighten the union with the bass guitar maybe in a 300-500 room I would add the two toms and I would not do anything to the snare unless outdoors and then add overheads for the cymbals

 

[mixtapelove]

Unless his dynamics are terrible, getting by with four mics (kick, snare, stereo OHs) should be plenty. Even on a large kit. I have a kit with five toms and I get by just fine with a pair of overhead stereo condensers.

 

[KingRazor]

I have a related question:

At my church we have two overheads, a kick mic, a snare mic, and two tom mics. The tom and overheard mics pickup a lot of snare drum. If I have the volume up high enough for the cymbals to be coming through the mains, the snare will come through them also. Same with the toms.

Any solutions to that?

 

[groooooove]

im a part time drummer..

two overheads, snare, and kick, is all i could ever want. especially in those size clubs, just the kick would be fine.. maybe just a hair of support on the snare- but you dont want to drown his cymbals, nor do you want to mic them..

 

[Rockmusician]

I prefer to have a mic on everything. You shouldn't have a problem if you have a good system and a soundman who knows what they are doing.

 

[lowendisthebest]

Hey quick question. What are GATES. We just caged our drummer. The venue holds about 100-200 people though we get about 100 through the door. I'm the soundman and I switch out with another guy playing the bass. I miked 5 of the drums and an over head mic. We found that we didn't have to turn up everyone else b/c we could turn the drummer down.

 

[lowendisthebest]

Oh I miked ( I'm not a drummer so I don't know what all the drums are called) the floor tom, 2 other toms, bass drum, snare with an over head

 

[walterw]

google "noise gate". they control the ring, sustain, and bleed-through of drums.

 

[walterw]

We now use a Presonus board for monitors and I set the gate on each mike fairly high to help block out leakage.

i hope you're not gating the drums in the drummer's IEMs; he'll hate that.

 

[KingRazor]

I have a related question:

At my church we have two overheads, a kick mic, a snare mic, and two tom mics. The tom and overheard mics pickup a lot of snare drum. If I have the volume up high enough for the cymbals to be coming through the mains, the snare will come through them also. Same with the toms.

Any solutions to that?

I don't like to quote myself to get answers like this, but I don't want this to get buried. Any advice?

 

[JMacBass65]

There are lots of really good answers here. I agree with the "kick maybe, and nothing else" AND "mic everything and use what you need to fill out the sound".

Howzat?

My favorite answer of all when it comes to sound……it depends.

My little bar band, I like to keep it simple, kick maybe in the clubs. But that’s partly ‘cuz I’m setting it up and running sound from the stage while playing. I hate that but it’s our reality. I would prefer to just play bass. If I wanted to run sound, I’d pick up some sound gigs. However, I am the only one in the band that has a clue, so it's my job.

Which gets me to my next point. My band would sound better with everything mic’d up and seasoned to taste. I’m just not going to deal with all that from the stage, nearly impossible to do well if you ask me, and I know what I am doing (I worked as an AE for over ten years).

Which gets me to my last point – who’s running your sound and does he know what he is doing? And FWIW, I think whoever it is running sound should have the last call on how to deal with the drums. If having all the drums in the PA is an issue, maybe the drummer should be the one charged with sorting it when all hell breaks loose. I have a hunch he'd change his tune then.

 

[JMacBass65]

I don't like to quote myself to get answers like this, but I don't want this to get buried. Any advice?

Well, do you need the cybals in the mains to cover the room? If so, use them first, and dump the snare mic, then bring up the snare to fill out some of the lower, woodier sound of the snare. Or dont bring it up in the mix at all if it isn't helping in a musical way, but use a pre-fader send to use it to feed a reverb on the snare.

 

[JMacBass65]

You shouldn't have a problem if you have a good system and a soundman who knows what they are doing.

This might be the root of the issue right here.

I skimmed around so maybe I missed it - I assume that this is a "band member running sound from stage" situation. Likely also a guy who just kinda figured out how to plug everything in and twiddle the knobs/push faders, rather than someone who actually knows how to go about it.

No offense meant by that, by the way. It's the best many bar bands can do, I get that.

 

[KingRazor]

Well, do you need the cybals in the mains to cover the room? If so, use them first, and dump the snare mic, then bring up the snare to fill out some of the lower, woodier sound of the snare. Or dont bring it up in the mix at all if it isn't helping in a musical way, but use a pre-fader send to use it to feed a reverb on the snare.

Alright, I'll give that a try.

 

[Munjibunga]

impactwrench does what I was going to recommend: mic the kick and a pair of overheads for the rest of the kit. If you really want to get zany, you could mic the snare, but you certainly don't need it in a small/medium room.

Sounds like your drummer's got a bit of a Neal Peart complex....

This is what we do. Sometimes we mic the kick and snare and put a Rode NT3 overhead or a Rode NT4 stereo mic.

 

[DonovanBankhead]

No offense taken, as you are exactly right. We don't have a soundman - we run the sound from the stage.

What I've taken from this thread is that really, since we aren't selling tickets at $65 a pop, it's not important that we mic every bit of the kit. For most venues, the drums are more than loud enough unamplified, except for the kick. Maybe I will take my H2n out and record the next soundcheck with all of the drum mics off except for the kick and see how that sounds...

This might be the root of the issue right here.

I skimmed around so maybe I missed it - I assume that this is a "band member running sound from stage" situation. Likely also a guy who just kinda figured out how to plug everything in and twiddle the knobs/push faders, rather than someone who actually knows how to go about it.

No offense meant by that, by the way. It's the best many bar bands can do, I get that.

 

[ga_edwards]

The acoustic level of the drums should be the bar for volume level for average bar gigs.
Mic the kick, OK I can see that but otherwise......................................
The only reason I would mic the drums is if PA support was being used for everything (or if the guitarists were just too effing loud), or the drummer was a Nancy

+1. Acoustic drums in an average bar, even function room are plenty loud enough. People seem to forget that not everyone at a bar/pub gig is there to see the band. For a lot of people, it's their local boozer where they want to chat and socialise with their friends over a few jars.

Too many bands think they have to fill every inch of the venue with sound, when in reality, you only need to fill about half the room. Aim to fill the dancefloor area, not the room. If people want to engage with you and dance, then there's space directly in front of the band, if they want to chat, then move to the sides of the room.

Sure, there are venue bars where people are only there to see the band, if so, go for it, mic up and fill the room. Otherwise, just play at reasonable, pleasant levels whilst doing what's necessary (ie, mic kick drum) to keep the sound balanced.

 

[HotelX]

+1. Acoustic drums in an average bar, even function room are plenty loud enough. People seem to forget that not everyone at a bar/pub gig is there to see the band. For a lot of people, it's their local boozer where they want to chat and socialise with their friends over a few jars.

Too many bands think they have to fill every inch of the venue with sound, when in reality, you only need to fill about half the room. Aim to fill the dancefloor area, not the room. If people want to engage with you and dance, then there's space directly in front of the band, if they want to chat, then move to the sides of the room.

Sure, there are venue bars where people are only there to see the band, if so, go for it, mic up and fill the room. Otherwise, just play at reasonable, pleasant levels whilst doing what's necessary (ie, mic kick drum) to keep the sound balanced.

Words of wisdom.