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Orion .. why do people say its so hard?

#41
TheInsane said:
Well, thats the case with all music. The main point is that technically Orion isnt all that hard to play. I can play everything except the solo. However, of course I cant duplicate the exact feeling that Cliff had. The point of saying Orion is fairly easy to play is that compared to other songs in the metal genre it is fairly easy to play. But sure, its harder to play than alot of "root-note-on-bass" songs as well.

When I was a beginner bass player I often confused things that sounded good with things that were hard to play. I think this is common. With little knowlege of actually playing something people very often think that something that sound good or sounds fast (like tremolo) is something thats hard to do. Of course we all know that isnt always the case. The hard part would more often to actually write such riffs.
Click to expand...
Yup - good points. This place is so cool, huh?

Yeah - don't I know it: I could pretty-much sum-up one of your points for myself by saying "when I was a beginner (1977), it was hard to play anything that sounded good"!

I've never learned - or even played-along with or really concentrated on the Orion bass part (I guess that's really saying something about how beautiful I think it is: I'd commonly - as a 'bassist' - isolate-out a bass part in my mind, but when THAT song's playing, I don't even think of my self as a bassist - just a music lover!).

Joe
 
#46
I've never actually heard anyone say that Orion is a hard song to play on bass. This is usually because nobody is aware that at 6:35, it's bass (as was mentioned).

That solo at 6:35 is quite tricky. Pretty fast pull offs, and it's easy to get a crappy sound by not getting the distortion right. If you plan on learning it, it's no secret that you need a METRONOME!

Took me a while to get it right, I was a very happy chappy once I was able to play it properly.
 
#51
from an interview with Newsted.

"What's your favorite Metallica song?

Orion.

Why is that? Is it because it has a very powerful bass line?

Yea.

Is it your favorite to play too?

I can't play it worth ****. The lead bass line in that, and I heard it seven-hundred thousand times, every time I hear it, it still gives me huge goose bumps. In the [imitates the high bass solo] part I just go "oh ****."
 
#52
Sorry to drag up an old thread with my first post, but i joined the forum as it was something i've been meaning to do for years. i was searching for threads on cliffs tone as i have been a cliff fan for long before the internet was around. i decided to transcribe the orion solo as i never found a tab online that was accurate.

the offical tab book has the solo as guitar. the tab book is wrong.

It was always bass.

Code: 
PLEASE READ BEFORE PLAYING!!!


A lot of the tabs for this solo are very close, either they have the notes in different positions or wrong notes,
but i've never seen a tab that includes the obvious: there are TWO basses in this solo 
(if you count the clean rhythm bass there are three, but i digress)
The second bass harmonises at the start and end of the solo

Cliff most likely played this on his 24 fret aria, as the solo opens
with a pre bend on the 23rd fret on Bass 1

Whats a pre bend? its where you bend the note with your fretting hand
BEFORE you play the note with your picking/fingering hand.
So to explain it we'll take Bass 1's part.

1. Fret the note at the 23rd fret
2. Bend the note up a 1/2 step (24th fret)
3. Strike the note
4. Slowly release the bend.

To explain my tab: (23)^24- v -21
(23) = starting note (fretted but not played)
^ = bend up
24 = pitch of the note you want, not the fret!
V = release bend
\ = slide down
/ = slide up 

And thats how you play a pre bend!



Standard tuning, distortion, possible wah as filter, played with fingers.


6:35

Bass 1

[--(23)^24-v-21-----14-14-14-----------------14-16--]
[----------------------------14--17-14-16-17--------]
[---------------------------------------------------]
[---------------------------------------------------]

Bass 2
[----------------]
[--(20)^21-v-17--]
[----------------]
[----------------]


Bass 1 ctd.

[--17p16p14h16-17p16p14h16-17p16p14h16-17p16p14h16----]
[--------------------------------------------------17-]
[-----------------------------------------------------]
[-----------------------------------------------------]


[--16h17h19-17-16h17-16h17p16----16h17-16h17---]
[-----------------------------19---------------]
[----------------------------------------------]
[----------------------------------------------]



Bass 1

[--19-------19----------------------------------------------------------------]
[-----21-------21-----21-------21-------22-19----22-19-----19----------19-----]
[--------22-------22-----22-19----22-19-------21-------21-----21----21----21--]
[----------------------------------------------------------------22-----------]

Bass 2

[--16-------16----------------------------------------------------------------]
[-----17-------17-----17-------17-------19-16----19-16-----16----------16-----]
[--------19-------19-----19-------19----------17-------17-----17----17----17--]
[---------------------------20-------20--------------------------20-----------]



Bass 1

[--23^24v23-21-23-21h23-21h23p21\19h21-19-21-19h21p19\17-19-17\16-17-16\14h16-14\12-12-12--]
[------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]

Bass 2

[--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[--16^17v16-14-16-14h16-14h16p14\12h14-12-14-12h14p12\10-12-10\9-10p9----9-------------]
[---------------------------------------------------------------------10---10-9--7--7--]
[--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]




The last decending part is hard to break up into its two parts, due to the way the song is mixed,
but i'm pretty sure thats it. apart from positioning, which is up to the individual player, i think this tab is 99% correct.

I belive cliff played it this way in the studio.

I dont have powertab or similar programs so i dont know if this is anything like the ones already posted.
 
#53
I don't really know how hard or easy it is, we do a cover of it in my band because it's fun. I play it fretless too. We do a little "accoustic" intro to it as well where I do some Mick Karnesq stuff.

There are two bass parts on that piece that most people think are guitar. The parts at 1:45 and the "solo" at 6:37. I double both of those with one of my guitarists, mainly because I don't use distortion and it gives it a bit more sonic depth.

Is it hard? It's about as hard as anything when you take into consideration that playing it tight and evenly with a band is a different thing to just being able to play the notes.
 
#55
I have been playing about 5 months, and I learnt how to play it a few months ago. Turned out the tab was wrong and I thought the Interlude (which I find very easy) wasn't the actual solo. Now that I have found a proper tab, I will one day attempt to play it properly, with all the awesome solos. It's probbaly my favourite song of all time.
 
#56
TheInsane said:
Yeah, the mellow part is bass. The distorted parts are guitars though (I believe, it sounds like it). The mellow part is what most people think is the bass solo in Orion.
Click to expand...

6:35 - 6:53 is the bass solo... not the interlude. giver another listen... if cliff did one thing is was play the bass like a guitar, i always thought it was a guitar solo, but after listening to the tone, it's totally fuzzed out bass... there is a little bit in the begining also, but i think it's a unison with the guitars at 1:42 also to around 2:11or12. actually, as i'm listening to it as i type this, it sounds like the guitars are just doing the holds behind that, and i think that is all bass... i dunno, i may be wrong though!!
 
#57
Bassmingo said:
Sorry to drag up an old thread with my first post, but i joined the forum as it was something i've been meaning to do for years. i was searching for threads on cliffs tone as i have been a cliff fan for long before the internet was around. i decided to transcribe the orion solo as i never found a tab online that was accurate.

the offical tab book has the solo as guitar. the tab book is wrong.

It was always bass.

(tabs were here, i removed themto keep it smaller)

I dont have powertab or similar programs so i dont know if this is anything like the ones already posted.
Click to expand...

that looks waaaaay to high up the neck to me... i thought cliff played ricks and whatnot... do they have a 24th fret? i usually play the opening bend around the 9th fret...
 
#60
mvw356 said:
i had another listen to orion, i'm pretty convinced that the lead bit from 3:45 to 4:04 is bass too. any opinions?
Click to expand...

That little part is the beginning of the "interlude" if you can call it that. Cliff plays a very classical-ish bass line all the way through up until the solo often mistaken for guitar. Its a pity the guitar covers up so much of his playing in the interlude.

I also quite like the lead bass part from 1:42-2:12.
 

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