JeezyMcNuggles
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- Feb 23, 2018
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- I suck, but nobody really notices
Use 100k pots if you want it deep and dark. 250k is standard.
For cap, you could try a .065uf. It's deep and dark.
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- Thread starter THRobinson
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For cap, you could try a .065uf. It's deep and dark.
Unless you like like to keep your volume at something other than 10 or 0, the taper doesn't much matter for a single pickup bass. So an audio taper pot is just fine. For the tone control to work properly (with a nice wide sweep), it needs to be an audio taper pot. The cap value determines how much treble gets bled to ground; the higher the value, the more signal is lost when the tone control is turned all the way down.
Worth noting: the cap value doesn't matter until the last bit of the tone pot's rotation. So if you only turn your tone control to, say, 5 or 6, don't worry about the cap. If you like to turn the tone down farther, it does. My take (when the tone control is turned to 0): .022 uF can impart a somewhat honky character; .047 uF is dark and round (still with some mid presence); .1 uF is dub territory (mids are diminished along with highs). Also, the material of the cap is, well, immaterial. Don't spend more than a couple bucks; maybe look for 10% tolerance, so you're actually getting the electrical value you're expecting.
Worth noting: the cap value doesn't matter until the last bit of the tone pot's rotation. So if you only turn your tone control to, say, 5 or 6, don't worry about the cap. If you like to turn the tone down farther, it does. My take (when the tone control is turned to 0): .022 uF can impart a somewhat honky character; .047 uF is dark and round (still with some mid presence); .1 uF is dub territory (mids are diminished along with highs). Also, the material of the cap is, well, immaterial. Don't spend more than a couple bucks; maybe look for 10% tolerance, so you're actually getting the electrical value you're expecting.
For volume and tone: you can use Audio or Linear taper, but note that Audio taper is used more often on a regular basis on most wirings, that means, it's a safe option, so it is the taper Value, 250Kohm is the standard as well and should be fine, unless you have enought time to order different values and try them out one by one (it will depend mostly on personal tastes) Note that different values will make the "volume sweep" faster or shorter, even sometimes, so fast that will be kind of like an "on-off switch", So:
25K: Value used on active basses (active pickups or with the volume a tone controls placed after the preamp).
100K: Will sound too dark, softer volume sweel and less output.
250K: Standard, it will work and perform fine, specially on Audio taper, some people say that's the most usefull range.
500K: Brighter and a bit more output, but if you use Audio taper, the volume sweep will be slightly more abrupt, so some people use Linear taper to tame that.
1Meg: Even brighter and a bit more abrupt than 500K, also a bit more output.
(Be sure the Tone pot is audio taper).
There's some missundertunding about wich value to choose on P-basses because the pickups are called sometimes as "humbuckers", and they are but the construction are very different from a typical guitar humbucker pickup, that needs 500K to perform well because you have 2 complete coils on them, (this is a quite complext to explain), but the P-bass pickup is technically a split-coil, even having that humbucker effect, the coil lenght is just slightly longer than on a J-bass, so 250K will perform better.
Then, the Cap Value: Higher the value of the cap, lower the cut-off frequency, (and darker the sound when messing with the tone), also note that the instrument have an usefull filtering range (right before it gets too muddy to be mainly usefull), that's why the value is different for each type of pickups that use different pot values, just to keep balanced that usefull range, so:
.022uF: Commonly used on 2 complete coil humbucker (with 500K pots) for a most usefull range. if you use it with standar P or J pickups (250K pots), the it won't cut as highs as desired.
.047uF: It will work as desired on P or J pickups (250K pots), on typical 2 complete coil humbucker, it will cut even more highs, getting muddier.
.1uF: Commonly used on active pickups (and/or with the preamp placed before the V/T controls), on standard P/J pickups will get muddier, but with 2 complete coil humbucers, the sound can get even more muddier that using .047uF.
So, normally you will see:
.022uF with 500K (humbuckers, specially on Gibson Basses).
.047uF with 250K (single coil, split coil, but sometimes on G&L and Musicman humbuckers).
.1uF with 25K (actives).
So, unless you have enought time to try several values in order to find what you trully like, keep it basic and simple (all of this is kind of a rabbit hole! hahaha), also for the tone cap type, you can use mylar or ceramic, it will be fine, but even the fanciest and most expensive cap on the market will make just a small, tiny, negligigle difference, so paying 20 bucks for a "posh cap" is not worth it.
So the last thing to mention is the Potentiometer brand, both CTS, Bourns and Alpha (taiwan) are very reliable quality-wise, the only thing is that Bourns use to have normally a super-soft turn, CTS use to be a bit harder than Bourns, and Alpha, somewhere in between.
25K: Value used on active basses (active pickups or with the volume a tone controls placed after the preamp).
100K: Will sound too dark, softer volume sweel and less output.
250K: Standard, it will work and perform fine, specially on Audio taper, some people say that's the most usefull range.
500K: Brighter and a bit more output, but if you use Audio taper, the volume sweep will be slightly more abrupt, so some people use Linear taper to tame that.
1Meg: Even brighter and a bit more abrupt than 500K, also a bit more output.
(Be sure the Tone pot is audio taper).
There's some missundertunding about wich value to choose on P-basses because the pickups are called sometimes as "humbuckers", and they are but the construction are very different from a typical guitar humbucker pickup, that needs 500K to perform well because you have 2 complete coils on them, (this is a quite complext to explain), but the P-bass pickup is technically a split-coil, even having that humbucker effect, the coil lenght is just slightly longer than on a J-bass, so 250K will perform better.
Then, the Cap Value: Higher the value of the cap, lower the cut-off frequency, (and darker the sound when messing with the tone), also note that the instrument have an usefull filtering range (right before it gets too muddy to be mainly usefull), that's why the value is different for each type of pickups that use different pot values, just to keep balanced that usefull range, so:
.022uF: Commonly used on 2 complete coil humbucker (with 500K pots) for a most usefull range. if you use it with standar P or J pickups (250K pots), the it won't cut as highs as desired.
.047uF: It will work as desired on P or J pickups (250K pots), on typical 2 complete coil humbucker, it will cut even more highs, getting muddier.
.1uF: Commonly used on active pickups (and/or with the preamp placed before the V/T controls), on standard P/J pickups will get muddier, but with 2 complete coil humbucers, the sound can get even more muddier that using .047uF.
So, normally you will see:
.022uF with 500K (humbuckers, specially on Gibson Basses).
.047uF with 250K (single coil, split coil, but sometimes on G&L and Musicman humbuckers).
.1uF with 25K (actives).
So, unless you have enought time to try several values in order to find what you trully like, keep it basic and simple (all of this is kind of a rabbit hole! hahaha), also for the tone cap type, you can use mylar or ceramic, it will be fine, but even the fanciest and most expensive cap on the market will make just a small, tiny, negligigle difference, so paying 20 bucks for a "posh cap" is not worth it.
So the last thing to mention is the Potentiometer brand, both CTS, Bourns and Alpha (taiwan) are very reliable quality-wise, the only thing is that Bourns use to have normally a super-soft turn, CTS use to be a bit harder than Bourns, and Alpha, somewhere in between.
If the current pots aren’t scratchy, you should know that better ones won’t sound different. Also, 500K pots will make things a bit brighter when the volume control is all the way up. When you turn the volume down, 500K pots will actually make the bass darker than 250K pots - higher value volume pots make the volume control work less like a pure volume control.
“upgrading” pickups to gfs ones may or may not make your bass sound better. The same is true of any pickup swap, but the chances that you’ll like a pickup better improve a bit when you move up in cost some.
“upgrading” pickups to gfs ones may or may not make your bass sound better. The same is true of any pickup swap, but the chances that you’ll like a pickup better improve a bit when you move up in cost some.
I just recently disassembled my FrankenSquier and sold the stock bass and the individual upgrades. The pots in that bass were awful (as were the tuners and the pickups). I wish I’d had this post. I might have been able to get that bass to my liking, since it did have a decent neck.
I know nothing about pots, so consider this bookmarked for future reference.
@THRobinson I'm planning a similar rewiring of a bass. I'm going to do a push/pull for volume (series/parallel) and a Nordy Tone drop (push/pull pot with .047 and .047 wired to get one or both caps). This will require a pickup that has 4 wires coming from the P. There are a few out there. Dimarzio has a split P that's rails that I was considering.
Good luck!
And definitely come back and post what you did, and your results.
Good luck!
And definitely come back and post what you did, and your results.
LoveThatBass
Supporting Member
definitely go with 250k as they load the pickups more causing a darker warmer tone plus more usable control
I just recently disassembled my FrankenSquier and sold the stock bass and the individual upgrades. The pots in that bass were awful (as were the tuners and the pickups). I wish I’d had this post. I might have been able to get that bass to my liking, since it did have a decent neck.
I know nothing about pots, so consider this bookmarked for future reference.
LOL I'm glad that my post helps people somehow, as I said, guitar electronic are such a rabbit hole, you can find lots of PARTIAL info, or even some things that are generally missunderstood.
Just want to clear out a couple of things, pay attention about what the pickup's manufacturers wiring instructions, some values may vary depending on the pickup's construction and betweenanufacturers.
Also generally speaking, the pot's values use to be relates to the impedance of the pickups so:
Low-Z pickups: active ones, needs Low-Z pots (25kohm) and "High farads" caps (0.1uF).
Also this kind of pickups naturally tend to capture the sound in a more "full range" and "extrabrights" way, but not always (mostly, higher the impedance of the pickup, darker the sound),
*A little thing, there is a lot of general missconceptions about active pickups and systems like preamps, and also general believes about them, that, even if they are not completely false (sometimes), people still doesn't know nothing about them (the actual technical facts), but that's a story for another time
High-Z pickups: single coils, split coil (P-bass) and some humbuckers, like some G&L and Musicman) needs High-Z pots (250kohm) and "lower farads" caps (like 0.47uF). This ones are less "full range", but still bright.
Higher-Z pickups: Like the ones on some gibson basses and mostly, on humbucker guitar pickups, need Higher-Z pots (500kohm), with "lower farads" cap, like 0.22uF. Also this pickups are darker than single coils (because of the high impedance they use to have).
There are also more things, like the relations between different values that pickups have, like reactance, but that's quite complicated to explain propperly and in a rush (and I'm NOT a master at all on the subject!).
But anyway, read the manuals! You can find singles coils out there that needs whatever weird pot and cap values to work efficiently and as desided.
Hmm... just curious. Does your Obsidian harness have the treble bleed mod in it? Not sure if they are necessary or effective in a single-pickup instrument. A few months ago, I bought an Obsidian hardness for Jazz bass that includes the treble bleed. I installed it, and did not like the tone when I turned down either volume knob. It didn't stay in very long - I took it out, ordered pots, an output jack, a tone cap, and built my own.
I understand how treble bleeds work, and I've used them in the past (but not Obsidian's version). This was different, in a bad way. I also understand that with a passive bass you can only cut frequencies, not boost. The Obsidian sounded, to me, like a high-pass filter with the cutoff frequency fairly high - as if all the lower frequencies were being filtered out - and again, very much unlike any other treble bleed I've used.
I DO like the solderless concept, and how Obsidian uses it - very well thought out. It was the treble bleed that turned me off to it.
Boo... hisssssss LOL
I have wired more the one Bass pickup directly to the output jack until i determined which configuration of pots and caps I wanted to use, if any.
Cave Puppy
"Humph Bo, he's wond!" - John Lennon
Emerson also make a P bass drop in wiring kit. Lots of folks do. Look up solder-less p bass wiring kit. The only aspect different levels of resistance do for a potentiometer is amount of high end bled to ground. the higher the resistance, more top end is perceived. That's why there are 500k pots on humbuckers as humbuckers are usually darker than single coils so the higher resistance provides a bit more top end.
This is not exactly what you are asking for, but I’ve gotten really great results with an eBay “KellingSound” varitone harness matched with a set of Fender CS ‘62 P Bass pickups on a very cheap Chinese bass.
Having fixed, repeatable tone control options has me wanting to also do this to some of my more expensive basses.
I like Fralin's with a 500k linear taper volume and 500k audio taper tone with .047 cap. You can always go darker by changing the cap value. If you start out dark with the 250s you ceiling out there. Also, my tone is push-pull for series. I don't play the series card too often...
The Fender Pure Vintage 63 pickup is the deepest/darkest P pickup I've tried, should you want to venture down the pickup rabbit hole
Cave Puppy
"Humph Bo, he's wond!" - John Lennon
Replying to myself as I can't edit - The Emerson is not solder-less. There are lots of p bass drop in electronics options that are soldered and solder-less.
