Well of course he could change the whole pickup like anyone can.
Just saying that you can't take the top covering part of that particular design of pickup off, as it's part of the pickup. If you did, it wouldn't work anymore.
Ya dig?
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Played a 4003 this weekend...
- Thread starter bannerman
- Start date
Well of course he could change the whole pickup like anyone can.
Just saying that you can't take the top covering part of that particular design of pickup off, as it's part of the pickup. If you did, it wouldn't work anymore.
Ya dig?
The most sane post I've ever read in a Rickenbacker thread.
FWIW I remove pickup covers off Fenders but when I had a 4001 I loved the cover. It allowed me to play with a plectrum up near the neck with my wrist resting on the cover.
Indeed!
I also removed the pup cover on my 4003, but then the Ric looked less like a Ric and I've felt almost that I've been a bit chicken for removing it. So, I put it back and gave it a long go. I've got used to it to a point I really like it. I've learned new things about picking technique (as I play with a pick) and it helps me picking close to the neck and it is really easy now to wrest my hand on the pup cover in this position.
I almost feel like keeping the pup cover is part of being a "Rickenbacker player".
When I think of palm muting I think of just lightly resting my hand on the part of the bridge where the strings stretch over the bridge to give it a muted tone with very low sustain. I don't see how I would do that with this bridge. The strings seem to come straight out of a hole which you can't really access with the side of your hand. Muting them so far away from the actual functional part of the bridge would silence them, but that's not really what I'm looking for.
I agree with bannerman and electracoyote.
Palm muting is possible on a Ric, for sure, but with the stock tailpiece you can't utilize it all the different ways people do. You can really only get the most dubby sounds because of the tailpiece blocking access to the area right in front of the saddles which is how people get more articulate PM sounds. So in a way both of you are right.
Palm muting is possible on a Ric, for sure, but with the stock tailpiece you can't utilize it all the different ways people do. You can really only get the most dubby sounds because of the tailpiece blocking access to the area right in front of the saddles which is how people get more articulate PM sounds. So in a way both of you are right.
Well, you guys had me going for minute there. Made me bust out one of my Rics with the stock bridge and check myself.
For me, palm muting on a 4003 isn't much more difficult or different than with other basses and bridge designs. I could go from wide open to a slight mute to a very dubby mute like thiocyclist referred to, with relative ease.
I guess I'll go this far: There may be other bridges that facilitate this better for some players, but it's a slim margin, and if you've gotten really good with palm muting in your playing career, you shouldn't have much trouble doing it on a Ric.
Of this I'm certain: It's far from "impossible."
I can never palm mute on a Ric the same way I can on other basses with a Fender-style bridge with easy access to the saddles. It depends on what you want in terms of sound. You can get really dubby sounds with a Ric no prob, but "articulate palm muting" is indeed impossible on the stock bridge for me. I have tried plenty enough to know.
Eh, to each his own. I have no trouble getting something a bit more articulate than "dubby."
There is clearly a scale that goes from dubby to articulate; and the Rick does not allow you to reach the far articualte side of the scale. It's simply impossible to reach the strings at the point near the saddles with your palm. When I play with a "Fender" style bridge and palm mute I rest my hand literally on the saddle and then apply slight pressure to allow my palm to touch more or less of the string. Can't do that with the Rick bridge. Not saying the Rick bridge isn't fantastic for some people, but it's not as functional for me.
SirMjac28
Patiently Waiting For The Next British Invasion
I think we're saying the same thing mate.
But that's a refreshing change of pace from saying it's "impossible" as you did in the OP. It is possible, perhaps not to the extent you'd like, or not with the ease you would prefer (because I can still get a fairly articulate palm mute and pretty good range from my 4003), and we are now officially splitting hairs.
You made a great point: Palm muting isn't as much about hand position as it is about how much of your hand touches the strings and how much weight is used. I admit, I have to adjust my technique a bit with a Ric, but I still get the same amount of palm mute range as on any other bass. I think anyone could if they stayed with it long enough.
Rics are a love hate thing and I totally get that. It's impossible to tell which camp you fall into until you get some quality time with one. They're quirky and make you play a little differently than other basses. If you are expecting it to play like a Fender, then get ready to be disappointed - the Ric isn't for you.... but if you're an adaptable player then you'll be rewarded. The pickup cover is a great example. It's in the way for a lot of players, but for me it allowed a technique that I don't do on other basses.
YMMV
I've had a love/hate thing going with the pickup cover for years.
I love the look, but it is right in the tension sweet spot where you get the best tone/tension blend much of the time, using pick or fingers that's the spot where you'll want to spend a lot of time with your plucking hand.
All of mine have the cover removed.
The bridge is another issue, it can be pretty awkward, but it doesn't have to be.
I don't use a pick all that much any more, so palm muting is not an issue very often.
It is different, but certainly not impossible.
The Hipshot is a pretty good design, not perfect, but quite good.
Shallow break angle is the only serious issue with the Hipshot.
The saddles can wobble, supposedly that's corrected now I hear.
Intonation, saddle height and spacing are all easily adjustable, top marks for that.
I love the look, but it is right in the tension sweet spot where you get the best tone/tension blend much of the time, using pick or fingers that's the spot where you'll want to spend a lot of time with your plucking hand.
All of mine have the cover removed.
The bridge is another issue, it can be pretty awkward, but it doesn't have to be.
I don't use a pick all that much any more, so palm muting is not an issue very often.
It is different, but certainly not impossible.
The Hipshot is a pretty good design, not perfect, but quite good.
Shallow break angle is the only serious issue with the Hipshot.
The saddles can wobble, supposedly that's corrected now I hear.
Intonation, saddle height and spacing are all easily adjustable, top marks for that.
I've removed every cover I've had, until the last 4003 I bought in '06, which is still on. Took a bit of adjustment, but now I'm glad I put forth the effort. As to muting, the Ric has the handy mute pad that can be dialed in anyway you like. No need to use your palm at all if you don't want to.
The palm has a much quicker 'set up' time so to speak, and of course is infinitely variable while playing.
Personally I've never used palm muting for a whole song or even the majority of a song, unless it was for more of a muted upright kind of effect, which the mute bar does fairly well on a Rick.
It's just not something I've ever had a lot of use for.
Personally I've never used palm muting for a whole song or even the majority of a song, unless it was for more of a muted upright kind of effect, which the mute bar does fairly well on a Rick.
It's just not something I've ever had a lot of use for.
I think we're saying the same thing mate.
But that's a refreshing change of pace from saying it's "impossible" as you did in the OP. It is possible, perhaps not to the extent you'd like, or not with the ease you would prefer (because I can still get a fairly articulate palm mute and pretty good range from my 4003), and we are now officially splitting hairs.
You made a great point: Palm muting isn't as much about hand position as it is about how much of your hand touches the strings and how much weight is used. I admit, I have to adjust my technique a bit with a Ric, but I still get the same amount of palm mute range as on any other bass. I think anyone could if they stayed with it long enough.
I've been experimenting and I think the position is pretty crucial. I don't think it's possible to get the type of palm muting that I want without being able to get my palm closer to the saddles. It sounds different no matter how lightly I touch the strings. I do think it's literally impossible to get what I want with that bridge; but even if a more experienced hand is able to do it, I don't think it's worth the effort for me. I'd rather focus on playing than on some mechanical skill for something that seems like a poor design (at least, for what I'm doing).
Yeah... I've tried a Hipshot bridge before and it was way easier to palm mute to get that articulate sound instead of just an inarticulate thud. I have to go with bannerman ultimately, even though I would never call it impossible to palm mute and get certain sounds on the stock bridge. It's too bad we can't just sit down and compare techniques.
Yeah, me too. But hearing what other people are doing it helps make my perception of things less isolated and helps me make better decisions and stuff. So, thank you to everyone who has weighed in here. You're quite helpful people.
I Like the pickup cover on,mostly for resting said palm when pick playing. I have the hipshot bridge,mostly i just appreciate it for its greater contact area with the wood,it sounds a bit fuller to me,like there is a better sound transfer happening. The reason i got it in the first place was lack of being able to get the intonation set up on my bass with the (lifting) stock bridge. I have played plenty of Stock Rics that were fine,i probably would just leave the bridge alone if there were no issues,altho i never use the mute assembly,and don't like the adjstment knobs sticking out where i usually play fingerstyle. I always end up selling my slab bodied basses,which in the past included a 4001,4002,Tele bass,and just recently a Danelectro Hodad.
Being a Fender guy most of my life, I had the same issues with Rics, especially palm muting. I've owned 2 previous Rics but dumped them for the same reasons. I got another one a few years back because I needed "that" sound.
So I made a new pick guard using all the original holes & screws, installed a cover on the bridge pickup. Bought a replacement bridge (to keep the orig in tact) and ground out the metal protrusions between the strings above the mute, which is still there and functional. Completely transformed the bass..... for the better. Sounds exactly the same but now playability is very similar to the Fenders. I can palm mute & my fingers don't get stuck in the absurd huge chrome surround for the back pick up. It was a very time consuming project but quite worth it. Best of all it is a non destructive mod & can be put back to original- not that that will ever happen in my life time! e-mail if you want some detail shots[email protected]
Link Removed
So I made a new pick guard using all the original holes & screws, installed a cover on the bridge pickup. Bought a replacement bridge (to keep the orig in tact) and ground out the metal protrusions between the strings above the mute, which is still there and functional. Completely transformed the bass..... for the better. Sounds exactly the same but now playability is very similar to the Fenders. I can palm mute & my fingers don't get stuck in the absurd huge chrome surround for the back pick up. It was a very time consuming project but quite worth it. Best of all it is a non destructive mod & can be put back to original- not that that will ever happen in my life time! e-mail if you want some detail shots[email protected]
Link Removed
