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Playing 5-piece songs as a 4-piece

Outshined91

Outshined91

Supporting Member
Aug 23, 2019
1,808
2,336
US of A
#1
Not sure where to post this so mods, please move if in the wrong section.

Anyway, I'm in a standard 4-piece band (singer, guitar, drums, me on bass) and we're doing mainly covers. We have been tossing around the idea of adding "Black" by Pearl Jam to our set, and this being a song originally by a 5-piece band, I've always thought that the arrangement was pretty big sounding; I'm worried that with having only one guitarist, if we take on this song it may sound a little sparse. Getting someone else to play guitar with us would be hard as we would have to find someone and fit them in before a gig we have in about a week, and since they would play only on this one song, it would be highly impractical. Does anyone have any suggestions for how we can tweak our playing/arrangement of the song to fill the space better? Granted, we haven't rehearsed this song yet but I have a feeling this may be an issue as we have a similar problem during the guitar solo section of "Hotel California."

P.S. I am the one who suggested this song, as we all have pretty equal says on what goes. Me and the guitarist really want to do this tune and the rest of the band are down, so I would appreciate it if people held off with the "just pick another song" type responses, thanks. If it really does not sound good, we will drop the song anyway haha. :)
 
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#4
Just figure out how you're going to play the tune and do that. Don't try to duplicate the record.

I played for several years in a band with 1 guitar, bass, sax, drums, and singer. We did tunes from 1955 through about 1980 (this was about 1984-1988 or so). We played Motown tunes where the original recordings had two guitarists, piano, Hammond organ, a full horn section and four backup singers; and we played rock tunes recorded with a three piece band and no sax parts. We played country tunes that originally had a pedal steel. We performed the Rolling Stones' "It's All Over Now" as a reggae number. We played numbers by Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, and Fats Domino without even the faintest suggestion of a piano. When we played Elvis and Johnny Cash tunes the bass player did NOT use an upright. We had males singing songs originally done by females and we had a female singing songs originally done by males.

I never, not once, heard anyone complain that "it wasn't like the record". Yeah, they complained about other things, but not that.
 
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#5
ArtechnikA said:
This version is so muddy you can't really even pick out the individual guitars very well, so maybe there is hope:

Turn up the bass, delay/reverb on everything, maybe chorus. Can guitar guy play a 12-string ?
Click to expand...

Haha yeah, I'm a huge PJ fan and on many of the live versions I have heard, the guitars turn into a wall of sound that basically just provide the harmony. Guitarist has never pulled out a 12-string at rehearsal, not sure if he has one, but if he does, I expect he's pretty good at it. I am playing fretless on this song, so chorus on my bass may sound weird, but we will try that on the guitar.

turf3 said:
Just figure out how you're going to play the tune and do that. Don't try to duplicate the record.

I played for several years in a band with 1 guitar, bass, sax, drums, and singer. We did tunes from 1955 through about 1980 (this was about 1984-1988 or so). We played Motown tunes where the original recordings had two guitarists, piano, Hammond organ, a full horn section and four backup singers; and we played rock tunes recorded with a three piece band and no sax parts. We played country tunes that originally had a pedal steel. We performed the Rolling Stones' "It's All Over Now" as a reggae number. We played numbers by Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard, and Fats Domino without even the faintest suggestion of a piano. When we played Elvis and Johnny Cash tunes the bass player did NOT use an upright. We had males singing songs originally done by females and we had a female singing songs originally done by males.

I never, not once, heard anyone complain that "it wasn't like the record". Yeah, they complained about other things, but not that.
Click to expand...
We actually have a sax player playing on a couple songs ourselves! Yes, we will just try the tune out and see how it sounds. Maybe we will try acoustic as well - I'll suggest that we experiment with it at the next rehearsal, and will report back.
 
#8
If the guitar player can hit most of those repeated melody lines and quickly get back to rhythm then you are probably golden. I play in a power trio and this issue comes up, in one way or another, with many if not most covers (mainly an originals band). I often find it useful to pump it up a fair bit when guitar man goes for single notes (or a solo). I dig in, give a volume tweak, gritty boost/dirt, fuzz, phase, chorus or whatever combination sounds good. If that alone doesn't solve the issue, and there is no will or idea towards reimagining the arrangement, then it is time to pick a new tune.
As an aside: I'd love to luck into/borrow an 8 string bass for long enough to see if I could make use of that for some covers that didn't work out with what I had already tried (and maybe for some of our originals as well).
 
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#11
Outshined91 said:
Not sure where to post this so mods, please move if in the wrong section.

Anyway, I'm in a standard 4-piece band (singer, guitar, drums, me on bass) and we're doing mainly covers. We have been tossing around the idea of adding "Black" by Pearl Jam to our set, and this being a song originally by a 5-piece band, I've always thought that the arrangement was pretty big sounding; I'm worried that with having only one guitarist, if we take on this song it may sound a little sparse. Getting someone else to play guitar with us would be hard as we would have to find someone and fit them in before a gig we have in about a week, and since they would play only on this one song, it would be highly impractical. Does anyone have any suggestions for how we can tweak our playing/arrangement of the song to fill the space better? Granted, we haven't rehearsed this song yet but I have a feeling this may be an issue as we have a similar problem during the guitar solo section of "Hotel California."

P.S. I am the one who suggested this song, as we all have pretty equal says on what goes. Me and the guitarist really want to do this tune and the rest of the band are down, so I would appreciate it if people held off with the "just pick another song" type responses, thanks. If it really does not sound good, we will drop the song anyway haha. :)
Click to expand...
It would interesting to see your set list, but I would bet that most of the songs you're already playing have two, or more, guitar parts. It can work for many songs if the guitar player plays the more prominent part.
 
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#14
Outshined91 said:
Not sure where to post this so mods, please move if in the wrong section.

Anyway, I'm in a standard 4-piece band (singer, guitar, drums, me on bass) and we're doing mainly covers. We have been tossing around the idea of adding "Black" by Pearl Jam to our set, and this being a song originally by a 5-piece band, I've always thought that the arrangement was pretty big sounding; I'm worried that with having only one guitarist, if we take on this song it may sound a little sparse. Getting someone else to play guitar with us would be hard as we would have to find someone and fit them in before a gig we have in about a week, and since they would play only on this one song, it would be highly impractical. Does anyone have any suggestions for how we can tweak our playing/arrangement of the song to fill the space better? Granted, we haven't rehearsed this song yet but I have a feeling this may be an issue as we have a similar problem during the guitar solo section of "Hotel California."

P.S. I am the one who suggested this song, as we all have pretty equal says on what goes. Me and the guitarist really want to do this tune and the rest of the band are down, so I would appreciate it if people held off with the "just pick another song" type responses, thanks. If it really does not sound good, we will drop the song anyway haha. :)
Click to expand...
It'll be great
 
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#15
As the sole guitar player who faces this situation a lot, I'm confident you guys can pull this off by not sweating every detail. Yes, there are two guitars split stereo and there is also piano in the chorus, so forget about reproducing every phrase. What I do (and probably most sole guitars in this situation) is I pick out the most important parts and the tastiest parts and see how much I can squeeze in there without sounding like I'm over-playing or making it stressful.

"Black" is the kind of song that can be performed well with one guitar, especially if the bass/drums and singer are nailing it. Just let your guitar player know you have confidence and trust in him to pick out the best parts while maintaining the integrity of the chord progression, it will work out fine.
 
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#16
I've done a number of songs as a trio that were originally recorded/performed with four pieces. For example, Have A Cigar by Pink Floyd. (When I first tried it, I thought I'd miss the keyboards a lot more than I eventually did, and we ended up pulling it off pretty darn well.) If you do the parts you can do really well, the audience will forgive not all the parts being there.
 
#17
You could always get something like the T-Rex Quint set it up how it sounds best and kick it in during the empty spots. It actually works Pretty well. Another more expensive way would be to use an Electro-Harmonix HOG2 Many more sound options and Programable so you don't have to mess with sliders during songs.
 
#18
Outshined91 said:
Not sure where to post this so mods, please move if in the wrong section.

Anyway, I'm in a standard 4-piece band (singer, guitar, drums, me on bass) and we're doing mainly covers. We have been tossing around the idea of adding "Black" by Pearl Jam to our set, and this being a song originally by a 5-piece band, I've always thought that the arrangement was pretty big sounding; I'm worried that with having only one guitarist, if we take on this song it may sound a little sparse. Getting someone else to play guitar with us would be hard as we would have to find someone and fit them in before a gig we have in about a week, and since they would play only on this one song, it would be highly impractical. Does anyone have any suggestions for how we can tweak our playing/arrangement of the song to fill the space better? Granted, we haven't rehearsed this song yet but I have a feeling this may be an issue as we have a similar problem during the guitar solo section of "Hotel California."

P.S. I am the one who suggested this song, as we all have pretty equal says on what goes. Me and the guitarist really want to do this tune and the rest of the band are down, so I would appreciate it if people held off with the "just pick another song" type responses, thanks. If it really does not sound good, we will drop the song anyway haha. :)
Click to expand...
There is a difference between a cover band and a copy band. Do the song with what you have and enjoy coming up with your own arrangement.
 
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#20
I play in a four-piece lineup (2 guitars, bass, drums). When one guitarist left (he got a real job), we decided not to rush into finding a replacement. So we played for a year as a trio. At first we were concerned about it--"How can we make a bigger sound?"--but in the end we decided to embrace sparseness, and enjoy the flexibility of the trio. Didn't hurt our ability to draw, at all. So...like any other new tune, just play it. Ideally, you'll find a way to make it work. Then play it out and see what reaction it gets. (We've had any number of songs that we were enthusiastic about, but did not work on the dance floor. You win some, you lose some.:D)
 
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