That makes perfect sense. When I was hanging with Wilburt De Joode I had a chance to play steel with gut. He gets an amazing sound out of his Cole. I couldn't really make it sing.
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Double Bass Pros and cons to Gut Strings?
- Thread starter NDBass
- Start date
That makes perfect sense. When I was hanging with Wilburt De Joode I had a chance to play steel with gut. He gets an amazing sound out of his Cole. I couldn't really make it sing.
That is an interesting thing. When I played Kowald's bass I realized it was easier for me to sound like him on my bass than his!
Yeah. His bass is a small 5/8ths. His guts are worn and scraggly and high off the board. He played it and it sang. We truly develop drawing sound. It's all the micro adjustments.
My two cents (what I wrote on Jason's for sale thread in the classifieds):
Not to derail a sale thread, but I too have been doing the gut Bach experiment the last three months- Goezt plain GDA with a Jargar Forte E/C. Since I'm strictly amateur I'm working off the Peters edition mostly. Making my way through the first three without Bach rising from his grave.
My 1810 Tyrolean has never sounded as warm, happy or loud. The guts make me play with more intentionality and really think about each note and phrase in a way that I never did with modern strings. The Arcus and an old Tom Owen bow seem to be the best matches. Who knew!
Somebody buy these before my wife finds out I even looked.
Not to derail a sale thread, but I too have been doing the gut Bach experiment the last three months- Goezt plain GDA with a Jargar Forte E/C. Since I'm strictly amateur I'm working off the Peters edition mostly. Making my way through the first three without Bach rising from his grave.
My 1810 Tyrolean has never sounded as warm, happy or loud. The guts make me play with more intentionality and really think about each note and phrase in a way that I never did with modern strings. The Arcus and an old Tom Owen bow seem to be the best matches. Who knew!
Somebody buy these before my wife finds out I even looked.
As with everything, I'm half hoping no one wants them so I can put them on again someday soon and give it another go. I love everything I buy, research the hell out of it, only get the best. I am constantly trying to find new sounds to explore. These solos were a big leap in a pandemic but I really think they are special.
So I strung my ply w/ Evah guts, and LOVED them - tho I found them difficult to bow. But for pizz/slap, I cannot overstate how much I liked them. Then I got a hybrid strung w/ EP Weichs and started lessons and working on arco. The bowing is SO MUCH better. I'm assuming the majority of that was due to the strings, rather than my very early lessons/efforts. Pizz/slap on the weichs is fine - but not as fun as the guts.
This discussion had me wonder when/if it would be worth trying the guts on my hybrid and seeing how they bow? Should I maybe wait until I've practiced arco for another half year or so? But I was pretty much figuring I had 2 very different basses set up very differently. And changing strings isn't exactly my favorite activity!
This discussion had me wonder when/if it would be worth trying the guts on my hybrid and seeing how they bow? Should I maybe wait until I've practiced arco for another half year or so? But I was pretty much figuring I had 2 very different basses set up very differently. And changing strings isn't exactly my favorite activity!
So I strung my ply w/ Evah guts, and LOVED them - tho I found them difficult to bow. But for pizz/slap, I cannot overstate how much I liked them. Then I got a hybrid strung w/ EP Weichs and started lessons and working on arco. The bowing is SO MUCH better. I'm assuming the majority of that was due to the strings, rather than my very early lessons/efforts. Pizz/slap on the weichs is fine - but not as fun as the guts.
This discussion had me wonder when/if it would be worth trying the guts on my hybrid and seeing how they bow? Should I maybe wait until I've practiced arco for another half year or so? But I was pretty much figuring I had 2 very different basses set up very differently. And changing strings isn't exactly my favorite activity!
I think guts can really help your bowing technique. They communicate directly. If you are doing something wrong they will tell you. But when you get it right they will also reward you with a vocal quality that is hard to beat.
Yes, bowing guts is exacting, and Evahs do bow nicely. But how much of the "SO MUCH better" is the strings, and how much the solid top?
I'm not suggesting you put guts on the hybrid ... the best thing is "what works."
Back in my pre-family days and when six-night-a-week steady gigs still existed, I popped for a set of Pirastro Eudoxas(steel-wrapped-gut-or some other metal wrapping), the most expensive strings I knew about at that time, for my supper club gig. They sounded phenomenal and I was very happy until I came in one night in the summer and in the course of setting up had not one but TWO strings snap right on the stand before we had even started to play! I had to go home, grab my other bass, and hustle back to the club. That put me off them for quite a while, and while I still get the urge to try them occasionally, I remember reasons that I don't do it.
Sounds like they were binding somewhere as they swelled in the summer humidity, the bridge or the nut. They do need to be constantly monitored...
Bruce, I had Eudoxas on this bass a couple of years ago and had nothing but problems (pitch stability etc) and I finally gave up on them after a couple of months. The Götz are maybe a third of the price and much more satisfying.
Hi to Louis and AG,
You're right about the silver wrapping. I just remember they felt and sounded great. The problems for me were always two things: I needed reliability without hassles. As a freelancer, I didn't feel I had the option or inclination to worry about babying or messing with strings on top of everything else there was to deal with. If I found some that worked for me I was happy. Secondly,
the expense and relatively short life of guts were frankly just not worth it over time. As with many other things in life, high maintenance gets really old.
My own $0.02 (It's Canadian so it's only worth $0.015) -
I love guts. If I never have to take them off again, I won't (I only have one or two modern orchestra gigs where it might be an issue). I'm rocking four plain guts right now, and while the E string can be a total bear, I absolutely can't argue with the sound of them, especially the top three. I have a Smittel B on, mostly because I own it and I'm too cheap to buy a gut one, but also because it sounds nice.
I wish that the E I had was made to the calibre of the others I have - They're made by a group of folks in the UK who sell under George Stoppani Strings - But they've not been able to get together during the pandemic, and all they had in available stock was described as "not our best work". That said, I knew what I was getting into, and they gave it to me for half price, which was a total steal.
It's taken time to adjust to being a musical string and not a bridge cable, but the sound has really developed pleasantly. I'd never recommend it as a pizz string, but the bowed sound is great. I wish I had a better way of getting a recording with what limited setup I have, because the playback from my phone (via headphones or my car's audio) has a lot more really low end that I hear when I play, but it just disappears when I put it onto Soundcloud. I imagine it's a data compression issue or something like that.
cheers
A
I love guts. If I never have to take them off again, I won't (I only have one or two modern orchestra gigs where it might be an issue). I'm rocking four plain guts right now, and while the E string can be a total bear, I absolutely can't argue with the sound of them, especially the top three. I have a Smittel B on, mostly because I own it and I'm too cheap to buy a gut one, but also because it sounds nice.
I wish that the E I had was made to the calibre of the others I have - They're made by a group of folks in the UK who sell under George Stoppani Strings - But they've not been able to get together during the pandemic, and all they had in available stock was described as "not our best work". That said, I knew what I was getting into, and they gave it to me for half price, which was a total steal.
It's taken time to adjust to being a musical string and not a bridge cable, but the sound has really developed pleasantly. I'd never recommend it as a pizz string, but the bowed sound is great. I wish I had a better way of getting a recording with what limited setup I have, because the playback from my phone (via headphones or my car's audio) has a lot more really low end that I hear when I play, but it just disappears when I put it onto Soundcloud. I imagine it's a data compression issue or something like that.
cheers
A
Man, I really hate you guys!
Put in a decent bowing session on the ply/guts last night for the first time in the last couple mos since I got the new bass. My guess is that my recent arco practice/lessons have really corrected some HUGE problems, because the guts bowed just fine. Tho the sound was nothing like the hybrid, I LOVED the way the guts felt - both under the left hand and the bow.
I'm really not a fan of changing strings, and I REALLY DON'T wanna leap down that rabbit hole, but I may need to see how the EP guts sound on the hybrid... CRAP!
Put in a decent bowing session on the ply/guts last night for the first time in the last couple mos since I got the new bass. My guess is that my recent arco practice/lessons have really corrected some HUGE problems, because the guts bowed just fine. Tho the sound was nothing like the hybrid, I LOVED the way the guts felt - both under the left hand and the bow.
I'm really not a fan of changing strings, and I REALLY DON'T wanna leap down that rabbit hole, but I may need to see how the EP guts sound on the hybrid... CRAP!
Man, I really hate you guys!
Put in a decent bowing session on the ply/guts last night for the first time in the last couple mos since I got the new bass. My guess is that my recent arco practice/lessons have really corrected some HUGE problems, because the guts bowed just fine. Tho the sound was nothing like the hybrid, I LOVED the way the guts felt - both under the left hand and the bow.
I'm really not a fan of changing strings, and I REALLY DON'T wanna leap down that rabbit hole, but I may need to see how the EP guts sound on the hybrid... CRAP!
Ed, although guts on a plywood bass are like beans and cornbread, a solid-top bass may expose the challenges of bowing naked guts to a greater degree. I had the same experience with guts on a plywood bass - bowing them was pleasurable and fairly easy... then I put them on a carved-top bass. The ability of the top to transmit more of the string's sound faithfully meant that more of the sound that I didn't want came through... and I'm challenged enough already. So I compromised with Oliv D & G, which bow quite nicely. If I ever achieve some degree of arco mastery, I'll probably try the naked guts again.
