So how do you guys reconcile this with how you sound live? You feel like it's OK to have a sound live that you would never record with your name on it?
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Double Bass Recording: To DI or not to DI
- Thread starter Pat Harris
- Start date
So how do you guys reconcile this with how you sound live? You feel like it's OK to have a sound live that you would never record with your name on it?
A live gig is a moment in time and can be anything from a crowded bar with blenders going off at random to a concert situation with good sound, a sound guy and good acoustics. The point is, not all live gigs are the same and they cannot all be approached with a "one size fits all" mentality.
The studio,on the other hand, is not a moment in time. It is a recorded representation of a certain performance that will live on way past the initial recording date. The studio is an artist's chance to represent himself in the best possible light, given whatever the current technology is, in a very controlled setting.
Obviously, this is not always the case when playing live. I choose to have a flexible outlook. When the live situation is a concert and there is ample control, I most definitely use a mike, in the studio, always a mike, in a bar or small club, whatever works best in that particular situation. BTW, I have a Phil Jones Flightcase 300 and it sounds awesome for live!
I'm going through this situation right now. I'm recording with my band in a top notch studio. I've got a RCA 44 ribbon and a Neumann U-47 on my bass. It captures the sound great. However, this band is a rock band and it take a lot of growl to make the bass come through. My bass does not have a really cutting type of tone and I had a hard time hearing my bass come through the mix. I finally had the engineer mix in a DI send off the Underwood pickup and presto! now you can hear the bass in the mix.
Ok- it's not a pure sound. But this is not a sonic situation that a 'pure' DB tone will work in, but when you hear it in the songs it still sounds like one.
Ok- it's not a pure sound. But this is not a sonic situation that a 'pure' DB tone will work in, but when you hear it in the songs it still sounds like one.
Most things I would record under my name I'd play acoustic live as well. Live and recordings are very different, though. A gig goes by quickly but a recording gets revisited (hopefully!) more often. That fact alone calls for different approaches for both situations.
As an improvisor, what I do live is often quite different than what gets recorded anyway. Many subltites that translate beautfully on a recording you listen to in your living room on a good system get washed over in the excitment of a live performance. Dramatic silences on a recording can just come off as a lull in the performance live and on and on.
It is a whole other interaction with the listener or potential listener.
Besides that, your bass is already going to be amplified when played through the listeners stereo/ipod anyway!
For the OP, or projects where the amp is part of the overall concept then yes - I use a DI and a speaker mic for my EUB, for example.
The most important point is here is that while under certain controlled instances a bit of DI in the mix can really brighten thigs up or otherwise be a plus, but 99.99999% of all engineers just can't be trusted with a DI (even and especially for "insurance"). The strong signal is just way too tempting for them. Even your close friends and EVEN engineers that are bassists themselves can just get lazy.
If the amp is part of your sound, let them mic the amp, at most a DI out of the amp but NEVER the pick up alone.
Even on the loudest gigs the bass still fills out the sound. A lazy engineer can take that all away.
When I record, I always bring my own equipment. First and foremost, I bring my vintage Shure ribbon mic. I aim it towards the middle of the space between the bridge and the end of the fingerboard, about 20 inches out. Ribbon mics rule for acoustic bass, but my dream of an RCA DX44 is out of reach financially. I always also bring my own DI, an Avalon U5. The DI cannot compensate for weaknesses in the signal chain. Over the years I have found a really great one--my 1961 Pollmann bass strung with Velvet Animas, a Full Circle PU, Monster Cable to the Avalon, and a balanced signal to the board. Recording engineers tell me that the direct sound is better than anything they've heard before. Most of the time we use only the ribbon mic in the mixdown, but there are acoustical situations where judicious blending of some of the direct sound helps in the mix.
And if you can maintain control and sit there durring the mix, that sounds like a great system. The trade off with the bit of good they can do in the mix with the havoc they can wreck in the wrong hands just isn't worth it.
Another VERY important issue is what pick up you are using and how it affects the acoustic sound.
Fishmans, Underwoods, Polytones, Barcus Berrys and to lesser extent even the Realist affect the acoustic sound.
