Request for effects chain advice...

[Dave W]

Thanks! That is really helpful. I have never tried putting the drive in the effects loop because I had gotten the impression dirt pedals needed to be on the front end. I’ll definitely try it.

The 3Leaf Wonderlove has an effects loop built into the pedal, I believe that's what the poster is referring to.

 

[Cutter8]

The 3Leaf Wonderlove has an effects loop built into the pedal, I believe that's what the poster is referring to.

Really? Well, I don’t have a 3Leaf Wonderlove, and the only pedal I have with an effects loop is the AmpTweaker Tight Drive. So you’re saying I should not put the overdrive pedal in the amp’s effects loop, right?

 

[Frodolicious]

Yeah I was talking about the effects loop in the Wonderlove. You dont need to put the Tight Drive into the effects loop of the amp.

 

[Feral Feline]

[ELVIS VOICE]“Thank you, thank you very much!”[/ELVIS VOICE]

Foundation pedals first, of course...

1. Turbo Tuner, gets a completely unadulterated signal for max-tuning accuracy. I'm freq'ish about that.

1a. The Octaver you're planning to get.​

2. Submarine, since it is the core tone machine.

2a. Octaver can go here, too, after the Submarine if the Sub's not set too hot.​

3. 443 Filter, since that's my preference to have filters/autowahs before dirt. (Though I like my manual-treadle wah post dirt).

Dirt will naturally compress your signal, its the very nature of clipping. So I like to get maximum pop out of the filter, first, by having it react directly to my playing. I like the sound of a traditional wah after dirt.​

4. Amptweaker Tight Drive, having the filter spike the dirt can produce some crazy soft and hard distortion depending on how the filter is hitting it. The dirt can also help tame the filter's smaller spikes.

5. Compressore, after dirt because you can set your dirt in such a way as to mildly breakup while playing lightly and then crunch when you dig in hard on the strings. Dynamics, you don't want to kill them all, but Compressore's still after the filter to rein in those huge filter spikes that blasted through the dirt.

6. Ampeg SCR-DI, end of your current chain. The Scrambler will benefit from being hit with a hot signal from your Amptweaker and the Compressore will also help feed the Scrambler a consistent signal — it's not the type of octaver that needs superlative clean signal to track well. It's kind of like a Green Ringer (which Dan Armstrong designed based on the Scrambler). You can also use the Amptweaker and/or Compressore to smack the front end of the Ampeg's dirt section. Smack it hard. It likes it.

More importantly, the Ampeg is at the end of my rendition of your chain because when the magic smoke is released from your Magjellionamp for whatever reason (the singer used it as a beer coaster or whatever), by the time the magic smoke has disappeared you'll already have swapped the XLR cable from the amp's DI to the Ampeg and the only one who'll notice what happened is your FOH sound engineer — you've still got all your effects to play with and they're going to FOH. The audience won't have heard/seen the swap, and neither will your bandmates.


Further to your Octaver hunt:
Listen to (lots of) demos of analog and digital octavers. Decide what you want from your octaver (for example monophonic synth emulation, or do you need polyphonic capabilities that only digital can provide?) I like playing chords and I need a clean octave up *(analog octave up is always a bit dirty), I have a Mooer Tender Octaver (POG clon-ish in a smaller box saves pedalboard real-estate). I also have an M5 MFX that can emulate a variety of other (monophonic) octavers. You may find you use your octaver a lot, or barely at all – depends on what kind of music you mostly play, so that may factor in on your decision-making process. If you're in a funk band, for example, you'll be able to use the octaver a lot, maintain your "buy the best, buy it once" mantra. Otherwise, if you hardly ever use it, there are some fun cheap octavers out there (like the Mooer).

For a great monophonic octaver, try to snag a Broughton Broughtave.

One last suggestion: consider more modulation.
Southampton Utility Knife and/or a Dr Scientist BitQuest get you several good sounding effects in one small box. Yes, vermillion there is a Santa-sounds MFX...


So, as you can see everybody has there reasons for putting stuff in a specific order: like auto-filterwah pre/post dirt — there's no wrong way to do pedal order so you've got nothing to lose.

Oh, one last thing. Some effects can do line-level (and be placed in your amp's effects loop), but most pedals are instrument-level only (and will sound really truly horrible in your amp's line-level effects loop — unless your amp can accept instrument-level signals)...


So many variables.

Great to have 'm.

 

[Cutter8]

Foundation pedals first, of course...

1. Turbo Tuner, gets a completely unadulterated signal for max-tuning accuracy. I'm freq'ish about that.

1a. The Octaver you're planning to get.​

2. Submarine, since it is the core tone machine.

2a. Octaver can go here, too, after the Submarine if the Sub's not set too hot.​

3. 443 Filter, since that's my preference to have filters/autowahs before dirt. (Though I like my manual-treadle wah post dirt).

Dirt will naturally compress your signal, its the very nature of clipping. So I like to get maximum pop out of the filter, first, by having it react directly to my playing. I like the sound of a traditional wah after dirt.​

4. Amptweaker Tight Drive, having the filter spike the dirt can produce some crazy soft and hard distortion depending on how the filter is hitting it. The dirt can also help tame the filter's smaller spikes.

5. Compressore, after dirt because you can set your dirt in such a way as to mildly breakup while playing lightly and then crunch when you dig in hard on the strings. Dynamics, you don't want to kill them all, but Compressore's still after the filter to rein in those huge filter spikes that blasted through the dirt.

6. Ampeg SCR-DI, end of your current chain. The Scrambler will benefit from being hit with a hot signal from your Amptweaker and the Compressore will also help feed the Scrambler a consistent signal — it's not the type of octaver that needs superlative clean signal to track well. It's kind of like a Green Ringer (which Dan Armstrong designed based on the Scrambler). You can also use the Amptweaker and/or Compressore to smack the front end of the Ampeg's dirt section. Smack it hard. It likes it.

More importantly, the Ampeg is at the end of my rendition of your chain because when the magic smoke is released from your Magjellionamp for whatever reason (the singer used it as a beer coaster or whatever), by the time the magic smoke has disappeared you'll already have swapped the XLR cable from the amp's DI to the Ampeg and the only one who'll notice what happened is your FOH sound engineer — you've still got all your effects to play with and they're going to FOH. The audience won't have heard/seen the swap, and neither will your bandmates.


Further to your Octaver hunt:
Listen to (lots of) demos of analog and digital octavers. Decide what you want from your octaver (for example monophonic synth emulation, or do you need polyphonic capabilities that only digital can provide?) I like playing chords and I need a clean octave up *(analog octave up is always a bit dirty), I have a Mooer Tender Octaver (POG clon-ish in a smaller box saves pedalboard real-estate). I also have an M5 MFX that can emulate a variety of other (monophonic) octavers. You may find you use your octaver a lot, or barely at all – depends on what kind of music you mostly play, so that may factor in on your decision-making process. If you're in a funk band, for example, you'll be able to use the octaver a lot, maintain your "buy the best, buy it once" mantra. Otherwise, if you hardly ever use it, there are some fun cheap octavers out there (like the Mooer).

For a great monophonic octaver, try to snag a Broughton Broughtave.

One last suggestion: consider more modulation.
Southampton Utility Knife and/or a Dr Scientist BitQuest get you several good sounding effects in one small box. Yes, vermillion there is a Santa-sounds MFX...


So, as you can see everybody has there reasons for putting stuff in a specific order: like auto-filterwah pre/post dirt — there's no wrong way to do pedal order so you've got nothing to lose.

Oh, one last thing. Some effects can do line-level (and be placed in your amp's effects loop), but most pedals are instrument-level only (and will sound really truly horrible in your amp's line-level effects loop — unless your amp can accept instrument-level signals)...


So many variables.

Great to have 'm.

Wow... I appreciate you taking the time to lay that all out! It was 100% responsive to my request, and your explanation of the “why” behind each sequence choice was clear, easy to grasp, and very helpful. Thank you!

 

[Cutter8]

Yeah I was talking about the effects loop in the Wonderlove. You dont need to put the Tight Drive into the effects loop of the amp.

Since the Tight Driver has an effects loop, presumably it was intended to be used, so what might you choose to put in the loop off of a drive like that?

 

[Cutter8]

Foundation pedals first, of course...

1. Turbo Tuner, gets a completely unadulterated signal for max-tuning accuracy. I'm freq'ish about that.

1a. The Octaver you're planning to get.​

2. Submarine, since it is the core tone machine.

2a. Octaver can go here, too, after the Submarine if the Sub's not set too hot.​

3. 443 Filter, since that's my preference to have filters/autowahs before dirt. (Though I like my manual-treadle wah post dirt).

Dirt will naturally compress your signal, its the very nature of clipping. So I like to get maximum pop out of the filter, first, by having it react directly to my playing. I like the sound of a traditional wah after dirt.​

4. Amptweaker Tight Drive, having the filter spike the dirt can produce some crazy soft and hard distortion depending on how the filter is hitting it. The dirt can also help tame the filter's smaller spikes.

5. Compressore, after dirt because you can set your dirt in such a way as to mildly breakup while playing lightly and then crunch when you dig in hard on the strings. Dynamics, you don't want to kill them all, but Compressore's still after the filter to rein in those huge filter spikes that blasted through the dirt.

6. Ampeg SCR-DI, end of your current chain. The Scrambler will benefit from being hit with a hot signal from your Amptweaker and the Compressore will also help feed the Scrambler a consistent signal — it's not the type of octaver that needs superlative clean signal to track well. It's kind of like a Green Ringer (which Dan Armstrong designed based on the Scrambler). You can also use the Amptweaker and/or Compressore to smack the front end of the Ampeg's dirt section. Smack it hard. It likes it.

More importantly, the Ampeg is at the end of my rendition of your chain because when the magic smoke is released from your Magjellionamp for whatever reason (the singer used it as a beer coaster or whatever), by the time the magic smoke has disappeared you'll already have swapped the XLR cable from the amp's DI to the Ampeg and the only one who'll notice what happened is your FOH sound engineer — you've still got all your effects to play with and they're going to FOH. The audience won't have heard/seen the swap, and neither will your bandmates.


Further to your Octaver hunt:
Listen to (lots of) demos of analog and digital octavers. Decide what you want from your octaver (for example monophonic synth emulation, or do you need polyphonic capabilities that only digital can provide?) I like playing chords and I need a clean octave up *(analog octave up is always a bit dirty), I have a Mooer Tender Octaver (POG clon-ish in a smaller box saves pedalboard real-estate). I also have an M5 MFX that can emulate a variety of other (monophonic) octavers. You may find you use your octaver a lot, or barely at all – depends on what kind of music you mostly play, so that may factor in on your decision-making process. If you're in a funk band, for example, you'll be able to use the octaver a lot, maintain your "buy the best, buy it once" mantra. Otherwise, if you hardly ever use it, there are some fun cheap octavers out there (like the Mooer).

For a great monophonic octaver, try to snag a Broughton Broughtave.

One last suggestion: consider more modulation.
Southampton Utility Knife and/or a Dr Scientist BitQuest get you several good sounding effects in one small box. Yes, vermillion there is a Santa-sounds MFX...


So, as you can see everybody has there reasons for putting stuff in a specific order: like auto-filterwah pre/post dirt — there's no wrong way to do pedal order so you've got nothing to lose.

Oh, one last thing. Some effects can do line-level (and be placed in your amp's effects loop), but most pedals are instrument-level only (and will sound really truly horrible in your amp's line-level effects loop — unless your amp can accept instrument-level signals)...


So many variables.

Great to have 'm.

I forgot to mention... I did some reading on the Southampton Utility Knife and really like the idea. Seems like quite a bit of hp in a fairly small package. I think I’ll be keeping an eye out for one!

 

[cataract]

I really like the Submarine and the Ampeg, but they are the only preamp pedals I have ever tried. If you were going to add one additional selectable always on preamp to those, what would you choose?

That’s a tough question! I’ve owned an Ictineo (basically a Submarine made by Southampton Pedals) so I know how great that circuit is— I used mine as kind of a tone shaper, with great results.

Depending on what style of music you’re playing, I’m a huge fan of Tronographic’s Rusty Box and would recommend it wholeheartedly. It’s been my always on for the longest time and I’ll never sell it.
The only possible downside is that it comes with its own proprietary 30v wall wart adapter- totally worth figuring out how to make it work if power space is an issue. I plug mine into the front plug on my PP2+.

I’ve also been digging my Nunez Amps Annex Drive— works great as an always on set to either all out crazy distortion grind or as a subtle, tubey grit machine.

I’ll be reassembling my board once my new bass arrives and will be sure to post my findings here & in a dedicated thread. Also, sorry if I came off as a jerk in my previous post here— didn’t mean to come off so bluntly.

 

[Cutter8]

That’s a tough question! I’ve owned an Ictineo (basically a Submarine made by Southampton Pedals) so I know how great that circuit is— I used mine as kind of a tone shaper, with great results.

Depending on what style of music you’re playing, I’m a huge fan of Tronographic’s Rusty Box and would recommend it wholeheartedly. It’s been my always on for the longest time and I’ll never sell it.
The only possible downside is that it comes with its own proprietary 30v wall wart adapter- totally worth figuring out how to make it work if power space is an issue. I plug mine into the front plug on my PP2+.

I’ve also been digging my Nunez Amps Annex Drive— works great as an always on set to either all out crazy distortion grind or as a subtle, tubey grit machine.

I’ll be reassembling my board once my new bass arrives and will be sure to post my findings here & in a dedicated thread. Also, sorry if I came off as a jerk in my previous post here— didn’t mean to come off so bluntly.

All good!
Would you just add the Rusty Box (amusing that this emoji just popped up when I typed that!) to the chain, or would it be in place of the Submarine or SCR-DI?

 

[cataract]

All good!
Would you just add the Rusty Box (amusing that this emoji just popped up when I typed that!) to the chain, or would it be in place of the Submarine or SCR-DI?

If you’re super happy with the tone of the Sub + SCR-DI, I’d keep what you have going on and just add to it.
My latest way of doing things is to dial in a set tone with whichever preamp and only use one at a time— easy to switch between them between songs with just a click of a switch.
Using any of these pedals as an added flavor of dirt / tone shaping is super easy as well. Depends on how crazy you’re looking to go!

 

[Cutter8]

If you’re super happy with the tone of the Sub + SCR-DI, I’d keep what you have going on and just add to it.
My latest way of doing things is to dial in a set tone with whichever preamp and only use one at a time— easy to switch between them between songs with just a click of a switch.
Using any of these pedals as an added flavor of dirt / tone shaping is super easy as well. Depends on how crazy you’re looking to go!

That makes sense. I really do like the Submarine and SCR-DI, but they are the first pedals in their respective categories that I have tried, and those “But what else might be better that I’m missing out on?” thoughts are popping up!