Double Bass Role of a principal, in a section.

[Andy Mopley]

The principal for each section is normally the most skilled and valuable player, selected through an audition process - hence do they "show" the rest of the section how a piece is to interpreted (based on the conductor's desire), decide on bowing etc. ? and might there even be an occasion where they play a part, and some of the section doesn't?? Does their general management skill also come into play?


Regards to all

 

[elberon]

The principal sets the standard for the section, technically, articulations, dynamics, bowings, phrasing, style, and attitude. Bowings are often done in cooperation with the conductor and principals of other sections as needed, particularly the principal cello. Because of the nature of the bass some compromises are necessary bowing wise, especially related to the number of notes played with one bow in slurred passages.

You show up early and you stay late and you’re the one who takes the pressure of the solo spots. You’re also the one who takes the heat if your section makes wrong entrances, gets lost, or sounds like s##t.

You’ll get paid about 10-15% more than your section and might even get benefits and more job security in regional orchestras.

 

[Andy Mopley]

The principal sets the standard for the section, technically, articulations, dynamics, bowings, phrasing, style, and attitude. Bowings are often done in cooperation with the conductor and principals of other sections as needed, particularly the principal cello. Because of the nature of the bass some compromises are necessary bowing wise, especially related to the number of notes played with one bow in slurred passages.

You show up early and you stay late and you’re the one who takes the pressure of the solo spots. You’re also the one who takes the heat if your section makes wrong entrances, gets lost, or sounds like s##t.

You’ll get paid about 10-15% more than your section and might even get benefits and more job security in regional orchestras.

Cool - thanks elberon, appreciate the response.

 

[elberon]

Yes your management skills (and people skills) come into play. No one likes an ass#$&@ as their principal even if he/she/they is a great player. You have to be a good communicator as well to get the results you want.

There will also be occasions within a piece of music where the first stand (principal and assistant principal) only plays. There are also occasional works that only require a smaller group of players (2-4 generally) for entire baroque, classical, or chamber type works.

 

[Andy Mopley]

I see, thanks - so first stand does stand for something ;-).. I think the joke goes something like:
Q: What’s the difference between the first and last stand of a (insert instrument) section?
A: The last stand is a measure behind the rest and a semi-tone off.
An exaggeration, of course, but illustrates the point, in the hierarchy.
Txs again.

 

[elberon]

I see, thanks - so first stand does stand for something ;-).. I think the joke goes something like:
Q: What’s the difference between the first and last stand of a (insert instrument) section?
A: The last stand is a measure behind the rest and a semi-tone off.
An exaggeration, of course, but illustrates the point, in the hierarchy.
Txs again.

Funny but, yeah-no

 

[Cyoder]

For auditions, specific spots open up and are filled as they are needed and the appropriate player found. If I auditioned for a last stand spot in the very back of the section that's because that's all that is available and open. If I win, no matter how good or how much better I was, that's all I'd be oferred. If a second chair position opens up, the section doesn't generally move up nor do they re-audition a whole section to figure out hierarchical seating based on ability when they get a new member. Personally, last chair is my favorite spot because there isn't much decision making. I just show up, shut up, listen, and play. Like being the bassist or violone player in a baroque ensemble. Just sit back and let the other viol sections argue about bowings, style, musicality, etc. Then when they come to a consensus just listen and do that. I'm not really in this for the money. I just prefer the level and quality of working together and performing a professional group tends to have.

 

[s van order]

For auditions, specific spots open up and are filled as they are needed and the appropriate player found. If I auditioned for a last stand spot in the very back of the section that's because that's all that is available and open. If I win, no matter how good or how much better I was, that's all I'd be oferred. If a second chair position opens up, the section doesn't generally move up nor do they re-audition a whole section to figure out hierarchical seating based on ability when they get a new member. Personally, last chair is my favorite spot because there isn't much decision making. I just show up, shut up, listen, and play. Like being the bassist or violone player in a baroque ensemble. Just sit back and let the other viol sections argue about bowings, style, musicality, etc. Then when they come to a consensus just listen and do that. I'm not really in this for the money. I just prefer the level and quality of working together and performing a professional group tends to have.

I also enjoyed when I sat in the last chair in the section next to the low brass, often because I could so feel being part of the power driving the orchestra.

 

[Bruce Calin]

I play(when they can) in three regional orchestras. I'm principal in one, 2nd chair in another, and last(6th) in the third. It's very educational to have the different experiences depending on placement. It gives great perspective on the various issues, both playing and interpersonal, involved. I feel that being at the bottom in one really helps me as a principal and vice-versa.

 

[elberon]

I also enjoyed when I sat in the last chair in the section next to the low brass, often because I could so feel being part of the power driving the orchestra.

The flip side to that is when you play last chair and you're in the "danger zone" right in front of the low brass or percussion section when they're rockin' and rollin' on major works like Alexander Nevsky or Symphonic Dances from West Side Story. Yeah you can definitely feel it. I like last chair because I can sometimes play on a stand by myself so I don't have to maneuver for real estate and can actually see the music up close and not on an awkward angle to the conductor.

 

[neilG]

I took an audition for assistant principal of a regional orchestra so I could move away from the brass. Best move ever.

 

[neilG]

You’ll get paid about 10-15% more than your section and might even get benefits and more job security in regional orchestras.

25% would be common for principal players in regional orchestras. In my orchestra, it's 50%, 25% for assistants.

 

[CaseyVancouver]

I took an audition for assistant principal of a regional orchestra so I could move away from the brass. Best move ever.

I can relate to this.

Most orchestral bass players have ear plugs and plexiglass handy because of the deadly brass section.

 

[Bruce Calin]

I guess most American conductors don't like the bass section across the back of the orchestra setup,at least the ones I've played for, but personally I prefer it for several reasons: I as a player can see and hear better, I feel that the sound of the bass section is clearer to the audience and other players,we're not too crowded and aren't in the dreaded two-row setup, and we're behind the brass-no earplugs needed(assuming percussion isn't too close)! I know there are arguments on the other side, but that's my take.

 

[eerbrev]

The principal sets the standard for the section, technically, articulations, dynamics, bowings, phrasing, style, and attitude. Bowings are often done in cooperation with the conductor and principals of other sections as needed, particularly the principal cello. Because of the nature of the bass some compromises are necessary bowing wise, especially related to the number of notes played with one bow in slurred passages.

You show up early and you stay late and you’re the one who takes the pressure of the solo spots. You’re also the one who takes the heat if your section makes wrong entrances, gets lost, or sounds like s##t.

You’ll get paid about 10-15% more than your section and might even get benefits and more job security in regional orchestras.

The only thing I'd add to this is that when I'm principal I cue my section as I play. I expect them to have one eye on the conductor, one eye on the concertmaster, one eye on the principal cellist, and one eye on myself!

 

[LouisF]

And just for the hello of it :

 

[Neil Pye]

Here is the job, as I see it and try to do it:
Set the tone for rehearsals and performances - show up early, help those who need help, keep quiet when not playing, present yourself well

Decide bowings - in discussion with Concertmaster, Conductor and Principal Cello
Some fingerings need to be consistent too, but a lot fewer! Also lead by example with dynamics, phrasing etc

Lead the section - my head is quite active, and I expect my section to come with me, whether it's pizz passages in slow movements or tricky arco entries

Communicate with the Conductor on behalf of the section - any questions they have come through me.

Lead sectional rehearsals

Decide seating plans for concerts. We do not have fixed chairs, I like to move everyone around, and once in a while I sit back desk and someone else leads (last time I did that was Dvorak 8 and it was great fun)

Play the solos

Take the rap if (when!) things go wrong (see Maestro Toscanini above!)

I also run a twice monthly bass ensemble for the members of the section, plus a few other local players

 

[LouisF]

Sounds like a principal I'd want to play for, Neil! (Having been one myself at varying times, I'm much happier at the back now -- even if it means stuffing an occasional sock down the tuba!)

 

[Andy Mopley]

What Louis said, Neil!!

 

[Neil Pye]

Thanks!I try to make life as easy as possible and as enjoyable as possible for my section, because that way we play better and operate more as a unit. It's an amateur orchestra (I'm paid, along with one or two other Principals and the Leader and Conductor, but that's a recent thing. I would still do it unpaid), and the majority of the section (six or seven, normally) are right at the limit of their ability playing Mahler 2, Sibelius Violin Concerto etc, so the support hopefully keeps them coming back! I love it, and I'm making up for 30 years in the wilderness!