searching for a splitting/combining solution

[Darknut]

I want to achieve the following, and i can think of a few different ways to do it, but they all involve tapdancing. any ideas for a one-foot solution?


1) split signal coming out of bass.

Channel A:
compressor->FX
Channel B:
distortion

I want to be able to have either channel, as well as both channels at my discrection. simple enough. BUT when i switch channels, i would like to have my clean time-based FX decay. I would also like to have a sweepable phase adjustment, and a boost on the clean channel whenever both are used.

is there a simple way to achieve this with one foot? is it prohibitively expensive?

The Badger Schism VX will get you all of that except the sweepable phase ( it has a phase toggle )

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[gidbass]

The Nady mixer is powered ... it may actually work better than the Rolls that I use. That was not available when I put my board together. I may try those for my board.

Also bass players should consider running effects in parallel, because some effects like distortion will boost mids and reduce the low end. So when run in series you loose bass. But if you run parallel you can mix a mid boosted distorted signal with a clean signal with lots of low end. Also effects like flange and chorus can be overwhelming when run in series, but again running parallel makes those effects more subtle.

Well I tried out the Nady mixers and no worky...

Your rolls supports a 1 in, 4 out as well as 4 in 1 out. The Nady only support 1 in 4 out. Not really surprising given the price point, but it was worth a shot anyways...

 

[Flux Jetson]

Y'know, another simple solution that has it's plusses is the Boss LS-2 Line Switcher. It is a buffered 2-channel parallel mixer that also doubles as a 2-channel 20db clean boost. I have two of them, and with 2 of those you have FOUR buffered and boostable parallel channels that have individual bypasses.

And since the LS-2 is buffered, it offers a 1meg-ohm input impedance which is comparable to most of your better bass-amp input stages! The Rolls has a 10k input impedance ... which puts a buttload of load on your pickups. Bad news for those of us with passive basses.

I've found the Boss LS-2 for as little as $70 each, and while that is roughly $20 more per device than the Rolls I find it to be well worth it.

*** Footswitchable A/B control over each parallel chain.
*** Mixable A/B chains.
*** 20db clean boost per chain.
*** Fully Buffered operation, and buffered bypass as well.
*** 1megOhm input impedance (which passive basses find super yummy!).
*** Multi-modal operation. Should you chain two of the LS-2s together you have a very powerful 4 channel parallel mixer system with bypassable parallel chains.
*** 9volt daisy-chain ability, it has not only a 9 volt input but also a 9volt output so you can use the LS-2 to daisey-chain 9volt power to other modules/pedals.
*** Boss "built tough as a manhole cover" construction.
*** Probably fifteen other reasons I've neglected to post.

I'm not anti-Rolls, in fact I own a Rolls Tiny Crossover and really love it's ability and tone. But I just feel that the Boss LS-2 is a superior choice as a splitter-and-mixer all in one gadget.

Download the manual, give it a look. It goes over all of the different (easily selectable) modes the LS-2 offers. Here's a link to the manual page, scroll down untill you see the LS-2 and click on it. It will provide a savable PDF file with diagrams and easy to understand explanations of the LS-2s operation ....

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And there's more than a few Talk Bass threads regarding the LS-2 ... do a search.

 

[gidbass]

you know, i already have an LS 2 and i was thinking about pickup up another and experimenting with it as you mention.

Thanks for the info though, I don't understand the buffering side, but what you say makes sense to me...sort of anyways...

 

[Derelict78]

you could do most of this with a line 6 m13

 

[gidbass]

that m13 looks pretty cool, but way outside of the price i was looking at...Thanks though.

 

[Flux Jetson]

you could do most of this with a line 6 m13

An M13 does parallel routings? Do tell! I have an M9 and an M13, I'm always open to hearing new ways of using them!

 

[Flux Jetson]

you know, i already have an LS 2 and i was thinking about pickup up another and experimenting with it as you mention.

Thanks for the info though, I don't understand the buffering side, but what you say makes sense to me...sort of anyways...

Buffering (when used in the guitar and bass guitar worlds) is a fancy way of saying that your signal runs through some rather basic electronic circuitry that passes the signal straight through it but doesn't put a "load" on your pickups. Well, it puts a load on them, but a load that they really really like .... your pickups "think" they are plugged in to a very kickass made bass amp.

Almost every single Boss pedal made has a really great "loading" (otherwise known as "impedance"). The input impedance is so nicely engineered that your bass ~thinks~ you plugged it into a high-end bass amp. Even when the pedal is bypassed, your signal is STILL run though this ~buffer~ circuitry.

"True Bypass" means that your signal is actually hardwired directly around the pedal, just as if it weren't even there. However, if the next pedal in line has a crappy "impedance" it will load your pickups down and they will sound dull and with less life and sparkle. Since Boss pedals don't have "True Bypass" setups (instead, your basss runs through this "buffer") then no matter what is next in line doesn't matter if it has crappy impedance specs or not, because the Boss has the same great input impedance whether it's bypassed or engaged.

There are mountains of details about this "buffered bypass vs true bypass" debate, most all of it is correct. It comes down to the fact that if you don't want to do the wrong thing and make your bass sound less-than-good, you have to brain-up on some of these issues to protect yourself from Tone Suck.

Knowledge is Power! THAT is an absolute fact!

So since Boss stuff is all "buffered bypass", your bass ALWAYS "thinks" it is plugged into a killa-badass bass amp, whether the Boss pedal is bypassed or engaged. When you bypass a buffered pedal (like almost all Boss pedals are) you're only actually bypassing the effect, not the internal buffer. So if you are using (let's say) a phaser, when you bypass the phaser you have only bypassed the stuff that is phase shifter stuff, the buffer inside of it is still engaged and your signal is still running through that buffer, even though the phaser electronics are bypassed.

The other thing about true bypass setups is they can actually produce tone suckage if your chain is kinda long. You have to add up the total distance that your bass's sound travels from the jack on your bass to the input jack on your amp. EVERYTHING has to be included. The cables, the patchcords, even the distance that the signal travels through the pedals when they are all bypassed. If that distance is long enough, it can actually produce what is known as "cable capacitance". All you really need to know about that is that the total length of your signal path can create a tone-dulling affect if it is long enough. Since true bypass pedals don't have "buffers" to make your bass feel the love of a good input impedance until it gets allllllll the way to the amp's input jack, they can actually contribute to tone suckage.

Putting a buffered pedal at the beginning of your pedal chain makes your bass think it is plugged into an amp that is only as far away as your first cable is long. So if you have a 10ft cable and it is plugged into a buffered pedal first, your bass sounds as if you only have a 10ft path from the jack on your bass to the input jack on your amp. The bass is loving life at that point! Even if you have fifty feet of signal path AFTER the buffered pedal, your bass thinks the total path is only 10ft, not a total of 60feet. The buffer basically hides all of the wiring AFTER it from your bass, your bass doesn't know that there is 50 more feet of path after the buffer.

Sorry this was so long, it's a tough thing to put in only a few words. This video demonstrates the way that capacitance and path length can srew up your tone, and it also shows how a buffered pedal can correct it



Many players just use a good tuner as a buffer. The Boss TU2 is a buffered tuner, the LS-2 is a buffered 2-channel parallel FX Loop with different looping and switching modes.

 

[Derelict78]

An M13 does parallel routings? Do tell! I have an M9 and an M13, I'm always open to hearing new ways of using them!

I explained in your modular thread but here it is.
I have a stereo out on my bass, neck p/u goes to input right than right effects sendto amp, bridge p/u goes into effects return left , out the left output and into a separate amp. Where ever you put the effects send is where the two are split. Example first effect is a comp. I have my effects send set to post 1. Second effect say is a filter than third delay than fourth reverb. The neck is only getting comp. while the bridge is getting filter, delay, and reverb. This is pretty simplified because I also have fuzz and a number of OD's as well. Usually bridge is pretty fuzzed out and neck has a touch of OD

 

[gidbass]

...
Sorry this was so long, it's a tough thing to put in only a few words.
...

Don't apologize, this was some great information and you did a great job of explaining it to me. I actually understood all of it, so thanks!

EDIT: I think that video should be mandatory watching for anyone running effects, it was great!