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Should a fill-in be asked to rehearse

#22
shwabilly said:
I've done a hand full of subs, and I don't think showing up for a rehearsal is that big of a deal. I'm all about getting paid as much as the next guy, but at the end of the day, I'm playing because I enjoy it. If I have an excuse to get together with some people to play music, I'm all for it.
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I think the first bit of your first sentence somewhat highlights an important distinction. If you don't sub or even play out too often then even rehearsals can be a fun thing to kick back to. Personally, I'd rather not spend time spinning my wheels on stuff I already know. I'd rather use that time on new things in life.
 
#23
jmattbassplaya said:
I think the first bit of your first sentence somewhat highlights an important distinction. If you don't sub or even play out too often then even rehearsals can be a fun thing to kick back to. Personally, I'd rather not spend time spinning my wheels on stuff I already know. I'd rather use that time on new things in life.
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I get where you're coming from. I play in an original band and we gig quite a bit, but I enjoy playing covers with different bands from time to time. If I were playing in cover bands a lot, I'd probably be less enthused about doing the rehearsal.
 
#24
g4string said:
Unless you're friends with the hiring band or are trying to pay it fwd in life....I see no reason why a hired gun needs to give up his/her time for free in order to make the hiring band "feel better" about hiring you. If a band needs to "feel good" about hiring a sub, they should audition or have heard your playing prior to offering you the gig.
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Wow...tough room. I did a stint for a while playing with Willie King and it was a situation where you never knew who was going to be on the job until we all showed up at the venue. Willie would book jobs then get on the phone and round up a band for them. I've played with him 3 nights in a row when he and I and the drummer were the only people who were the same in the band all three nights. As a rule it was cool and a real rush when a group of people who just met had the whole room doing the snake dance by the second or third song. Of course there was always the occasional grind when some self centered azzhole made it a chore. That was when the privilege of playing with someone as real as Willie made it worth putting up with some guy who was usually about half as good as he thought he was.

If I thought of myself as good enough to hang a shingle as a hired gun in the bass world you can bet your ass I wouldn't bother with any job that didn't pay any better than a hundred bucks an hour because I'd be good enough to step into any situation and nail it. Sadly, i'm just one of those ordinary pud pullers who piss off the pros by taking jobs where the pay is so far beneath their skill level they claim they can't be bothered to do anything but show up and prop up the clowns who can't manage to pay any better, but for some odd reason still take such menial work.
 
#25
shwabilly said:
.....If I have an excuse to get together with some people to play music, I'm all for it.
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I too like to gtg with other players and jam....but the thing is, it has to be on my own terms AND while playing in a project I enjoy!

Hashing through a bunch of bar-grade tunes is not my idea of a good excuse to get together with some guys and play music. Maybe a good ole fashioned blues jam, maybe. Burning through some cool, funky styled jazz/fusion/funk....improving, oh yeah! Getting together and suffering through BEG, Billie Jean, Margarittaville, no thanks! Your gonna have to pay me for that.
 
#26
What is the old saw about fishing?

Even a bad day on the water beats a good day at work.

After decades of playing I still look forward to every opportunity I get to play.

Some of the best paying music jobs I've had lately have been with my 18 year old nephew playing drums. At the end of the night when we split the cash his dad and I just hand our cuts to him. He's a college kid on a scholarship while working a full time job and still finds time to haul his stuff out on a weekend to play music with the "old guys", and like any kid in his situation he can actually use the dough. I sure as heck don't need it to keep the wolf from my door and my nephew kinda sorta does so why not give it to him?

At the heart of it for me, if money was my only motivation for playing I'd be doing something a lot more lucrative and regular.
 
#27
fhm555 said:
What is the old saw about fishing?

Even a bad day on the water beats a good day at work.

After decades of playing I still look forward to every opportunity I get to play.

Some of the best paying music jobs I've had lately have been with my 18 year old nephew playing drums. At the end of the night when we split the cash his dad and I just hand our cuts to him. He's a college kid on a scholarship while working a full time job and still finds time to haul his stuff out on a weekend to play music with the "old guys", and like any kid in his situation he can actually use the dough. I sure as heck don't need it to keep the wolf from my door and my nephew kinda sorta does so why not give it to him?

At the heart of it for me, if money was my only motivation for playing I'd be doing something a lot more lucrative and regular.
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That's really awesome of you :)
 
#28
fhm555 said:
What is the old saw about fishing?

Even a bad day on the water beats a good day at work.

After decades of playing I still look forward to every opportunity I get to play.

Some of the best paying music jobs I've had lately have been with my 18 year old nephew playing drums. At the end of the night when we split the cash his dad and I just hand our cuts to him. He's a college kid on a scholarship while working a full time job and still finds time to haul his stuff out on a weekend to play music with the "old guys", and like any kid in his situation he can actually use the dough. I sure as heck don't need it to keep the wolf from my door and my nephew kinda sorta does so why not give it to him?

At the heart of it for me, if money was my only motivation for playing I'd be doing something a lot more lucrative and regular.
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Apples and oranges....your motivator on a gig like that is family and camaraderie.

Again, I think most can agree that enjoyment is prob the #1 motivator for playing music, paid or unpaid. However, busting your hump for a band you have no affiliation with only for the glory/enjoyment of playing music seems foolish to me....espc when money is involved.

If it were good friends, family, or good PR.....money would not be motivating factor in taking a gig.
 
#29
The way I see it, you shouldn't be doing the gig if you aren't willing to rehearse, especially with a band you've never played with. Sure, you can wing it, maybe even very well, but is it really worth the risk? Surely it's sensible, if nothing else, to get to grips with the drummer so you can lock in with him properly. Personally, if I asked someone to sub, it'd be on the condition that they came to at least one rehearsal, and it was to a good standard. However good you are, not rehearsing when you have a chance to do so is a terrible idea, and just asking for trouble. I'd also question the "I'm too good to need to rehearse with you" attitude.

Just my two cents, whatever works for you...
 
#31
tomnomnom91 said:
The way I see it, you shouldn't be doing the gig if you aren't willing to rehearse, especially with a band you've never played with. Sure, you can wing it, maybe even very well, but is it really worth the risk? Surely it's sensible, if nothing else, to get to grips with the drummer so you can lock in with him properly. Personally, if I asked someone to sub, it'd be on the condition that they came to at least one rehearsal, and it was to a good standard. However good you are, not rehearsing when you have a chance to do so is a terrible idea, and just asking for trouble. I'd also question the "I'm too good to need to rehearse with you" attitude.

Just my two cents, whatever works for you...
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McD's is short a burger flipper, wants you to fill in for a shift cause they know you can flip a mean burger, but then demands you work a shift for free so they can see if you're a good enough flipper.....would you say yes?

Its not about being "too good" to rehearse with said band, its about being compensated for your time and resources.....gas in some parts of the country is +$4 per gallon....some places have toll roads. I have two little ones at home.....time away from my kids is valuable time. I am not going to give it away.

The risk of not sounding good is on the hiring band, not me. I know I sound good....whether the rest of the band does or not is a different story. IMO, if you're going to be a hired bass mercenary; you need to be OK with the fact that you might be walking into a train-wreck. Thus, the higher price tag (on my end). Charging more for my time, plus not willing to rehearse for free; somewhat eliminates the possibility of me booking myself with a less than stellar band....which lowers the probability of me walking into a train-wreck.
 
#32
g4string said:
McD's is short a burger flipper, wants you to fill in for a shift cause they know you can flip a mean burger, but then demands you work a shift for free so they can see if you're a good enough flipper.....would you say yes?

Its not about being "too good" to rehearse with said band, its about being compensated for your time and resources.....gas in some parts of the country is +$4 per gallon....some places have toll roads. I have two little ones at home.....time away from my kids is valuable time. I am not going to give it away.

The risk of not sounding good is on the hiring band, not me. I know I sound good....whether the rest of the band does or not is a different story. IMO, if you're going to be a hired bass mercenary; you need to be OK with the fact that you might be walking into a train-wreck. Thus, the higher price tag (on my end). Charging more for my time, plus not willing to rehearse for free; somewhat eliminates the possibility of me booking myself with a less than stellar band....which lowers the probability of me walking into a train-wreck.
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+1

I'd like to think there's a difference between having an ego and simply recognizing when you no longer benefit from further rehearsal of certain material. That time is simply better spent elsewhere. Likewise, being able to command a certain price for your skills on a sub gig does tend to filter out lesser prepared and skilled bands.
 
#33
jmattbassplaya said:
+1

I'd like to think there's a difference between having an ego and simply recognizing when you no longer benefit from further rehearsal of certain material. That time is simply better spent elsewhere. Likewise, being able to command a certain price for your skills on a sub gig does tend to filter out lesser prepared and skilled bands.
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A higher price tag also means that if the band turned out to be a train-wreck....at least you were well compensated for the evening.
 
#35
Sadly, i'm just one of those ordinary pud pullers who piss off the pros by taking jobs where the pay is so far beneath their skill level they claim they can't be bothered to do anything but show up and prop up the clowns who can't manage to pay any better, but for some odd reason still take such menial work.
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this sentence is really long :confused:
 
#36
tomnomnom91 said:
The way I see it, you shouldn't be doing the gig if you aren't willing to rehearse, especially with a band you've never played with. Sure, you can wing it, maybe even very well, but is it really worth the risk? Surely it's sensible, if nothing else, to get to grips with the drummer so you can lock in with him properly. Personally, if I asked someone to sub, it'd be on the condition that they came to at least one rehearsal, and it was to a good standard. However good you are, not rehearsing when you have a chance to do so is a terrible idea, and just asking for trouble. I'd also question the "I'm too good to need to rehearse with you" attitude.

Just my two cents, whatever works for you...
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It's not "attitude". It's professionalism.

I play fill-in gigs all the time. Most often I play with bands who just happen to be swinging through NC. I played with an act our of Baltimore recently. When were we going to rehearse? We weren't. I don't rehearse. I have a wife and two young kids. While I don't really need the money from music any more, you aren't getting ma away from my family for free..... period. (Unless of course it is a benefit for a really good cause.)

Also, some of my best friends are in Nashville TN. Quite often they are in the position of having to book a gig and then find a band. Usually, when they find musicians, they meet them in the parking lot of the local Food Lion and load up in the van. There have been no rehearsals. There won't be ANY rehearsals or the musicians won't take the gig. And I have seen them play (and even played with them quite a few times) and the band is always hot. And it sounds as though they/we have played together for years.

So your premise is crap. Either you can play Mustang Sally or you can't. If you need to rehearse The Joker, you need to hang up your bass.
 
#40
I do unrehearsed sub work all the time. There are two sides to the coin. The sub has to be ready, but the band also has to be ready to use a sub. In the jazz scene, folks start out as subs before they form into cohesive bands, so everybody has experienced subbing.

There are cases where the gig is very high profile, or a band is playing complex arranged music. In those cases I don't mind doing a rehearsal -- it beats a train wreck, and I can trust that the band will hold an efficient and professional rehearsal. In some cases, it's a semi-rehearsal, just meeting at the bandleader's house for a few minutes to discuss the charts.

Once in a blue moon I'll get a call from a band that really isn't ready to use a sub. Often, they are players who came out of various genres, and have always played together as a unit. And nobody likes to see a band disappoint an audience at a booked gig. The rehearsal gives me a chance to coach the band a bit, and maybe even help them adjust their repertoire, so that the gig will go better. Some of those gigs pay well enough that it still works out even with the rehearsal.

So, this is yet another of those things, where we all have our rules, including "never say never." It always boils down to the situation.
 

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