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Shuttlemax 12.0 question

bassman515

bassman515

Jun 15, 2007
646
1
49
Noblesville, in
#1
Hello all,

I just picked up a shuttlemax 12.0. I have been using a Carvin B1500 for about a year now. Love it, but it is pretty stinkin heavy in the rack, so i decided to get a light amp as the gigging amp. Here is my questions. Today i was ABing the two using my Carvin BRX2.10 cab and i noticed somthing that seemed a bit odd to me. The Carvin was obviously louder at equal settings (1200w vs 600w) but what i noticed was when i would hit a note or play a groove on the B1500 it was punchy, smooth and clear. When i played it on the SM it seemed almost a little compressed, like it took it a split second to come alive with each note. I am running eq flat on both amps. I have the gain and volume around 12 o'clock on the pre and then the volume up just enough to get a little umph...

thoughts?
Jeremy
 
#4
Just looked at my amp. I was using my Quantum5 last night and my gain was at about 2 {on a clock face} volume at 11 and master at 10. IIRC I don't change it much with my 55-02. As far as the notes jumping out at you it could just be the difference in amps. I have a GK 1001rb11 and it has the quickest response of any amp I have ever owned. The notes just jump out at you. It may just take some time getting use to the shuttlemax. I have only had mine for a month and I am still trying out different settings. So far I like it and you gotta love the weight.:)
 
#5
I also have the SM12 and B1500 and the B1500 is slightly quicker from what I hear. But I wouldn't consider the SM12 a slow amp, it's just a little different than the B1500. Maybe it has something to do with the power sections of each amp since they do differ quite a bit.

When I switch back and forth between amps I really don't notice a huge difference response wise other than the B1500 is a touch quicker to respond. If you have been playing the B1500 for a while it will probably take a week or two to get acclimated to the ShuttleMax. There always seems to be a "calibration" period for my ears to get used to new equipment if I have been playing something else for a while.

You've got two great amps...enjoy!
 
#8
bassman515 said:
Blmeier, which amp do you use more? Why?
Click to expand...

Lately I've been using the ShuttleMax most of the time. It's a great practice amp for home use because it's quieter than the B1500 and uses less power. Plus, I like to run my drum machine through the aux port on the SM to practice with.

I've also noticed that after playing through the ShuttleMax for a while now the tube channel has seemed to open up a little more and I seem to notice more presence in the tube warmth. I don't know if the tube has a break-in period, or if it's just me.

The B1500 is not going anywhere though. It's just a beast of an amp. It's easier for me to dial in the right tone for the room with the B1500.
 
#9
That does make sense. I will see how it goes. I bought the SM to be my gigging amp and to use at Church so I did not have to move the B1500 as often as I would leave it at the rehersal space, but who knows, the SM might end up just being the Church amp and the Carvin the Gigging/rehersal amp.
 
#10
I am also a big fan of the B1500. If the Shuttle Max 12 ends up not floating your boat, and you can deal with a 4ohm minimum head, the Markbass F1 has the same hammer-like quickness and attack as the B1500. Of course, it doesn't have the heft and volume capability of that monster, but I find it surprisingly loud and very tight/accurate/transparent... and really small and light! The new F500 is basically the same head with some additional features and EQ power.
 
#11
blmeier7 said:
I've also noticed that after playing through the ShuttleMax for a while now the tube channel has seemed to open up a little more and I seem to notice more presence in the tube warmth. I don't know if the tube has a break-in period, or if it's just me.
Click to expand...

I've got a Shuttle 6.0. I noticed a fairly significant difference when I swapped different 12AX7's in there. It's easy enough to try if you have a reasonable number of tubes to audition.

My other amp is an old AMP BH-420. It's "faster" than the Shuttle 6.0. I slightly prefer the BH-420 to the Shuttle 6.0, but not by much. The BH-420 stays at home and the Shuttle 6.0 goes out with me, mostly because the Shuttle 6.0 fits in the pocket of my bass gig bag. That _IS_ the reason I bought the Shuttle after all. I keep the BH-420 because it's been a workhorse of all these years and I want to have a backup amp in case something happens to the Shuttle. The Shuttle has never disappointed me, but I find it hard to trust it because it just seems to good to be true!

Good luck with your SM 12.0. I'm guessing it's killer.

KO
 
#14
Yeah, i am pretty much stuck with needing to do a "2ohm" load. Both of my cabs are 4 ohms cabs, one of the reasons i originally got the B1500. Tonight is my first rehersal with it, so we shall see how it goes. I will only be running one 4 ohm cab tonight so we shall see...
 
#15
So, i got the chance to try it last night at practice. I could not hear the "compressed" hits at volume so I am good there. The one thing that was a bit concerning though was that i was hitting the limiter last night and the amp did not seem all that loud. EQ flat, gain at about 1o'clock volume 12o'clock and master at 11o'clock. Now keep in mind i was playing through an Ampeg PR410hlf (Fairly in efficient cab) and we practice is a pretty small room that sucks up the bass. But I never seemed to have an issue with the B1500. I am sure that it has to do with putting 1200w vs 600w in that cab.
Thoughts?
J
 
#17
bassman515 said:
So, i got the chance to try it last night at practice. I could not hear the "compressed" hits at volume so I am good there. The one thing that was a bit concerning though was that i was hitting the limiter last night and the amp did not seem all that loud. EQ flat, gain at about 1o'clock volume 12o'clock and master at 11o'clock. Now keep in mind i was playing through an Ampeg PR410hlf (Fairly in efficient cab) and we practice is a pretty small room that sucks up the bass. But I never seemed to have an issue with the B1500. I am sure that it has to do with putting 1200w vs 600w in that cab.
Thoughts?
J
Click to expand...

Genz heads have an unusual 'clip limiter light' design that comes on way before the amp runs out of steam. Ignore the light and use your ears. It's kind of a goofy design decison IMO, but if you just ignore the power amp limiter indicator, you will be fine.
 
#20
KJung said:
Genz heads have an unusual 'clip limiter light' design that comes on way before the amp runs out of steam. Ignore the light and use your ears. It's kind of a goofy design decison IMO, but if you just ignore the power amp limiter indicator, you will be fine.
Click to expand...

Let me restate exactly how it works (it's also clearly explained in the owner's manual) so that you understand WHY it works like it does.

The Clip-Limit LED indicates the point where the output tube emulation limiter begins to operate. Like a tube output stage, there is some compression that happens (actually variable slope, frequency dependant stuff) and some harmonic enhancement stuff. This begins to happen about 1-2dB before the amp actually clips and there's about 5-6dB of compliance between the point that the limiter begins to operate and the power amp actually clips. The LED indicates to the player when you are getting within a dB or two of the maximum rated power AND the limiter is operating. This way you know where in the output range you are operating. It's now up to the player to decide how much of the output tube emulation limiting is suitable for the playing/music style. Knowing this information helps prevent amp clipping BEFORE it happens. There's nothing goofy about it. Don't ignore the light, understand how it works and then use itto your advantage. Figure out how much limiting you prefer. You will hear the amp clipping if you push it hard enough. The limiter is very misucal and hard to hear operate (unlike some other bass amps) which is why the LED is so important.

Really, how good is it to learn that the signal is clipping AFTER it's already clipped. This is why most audio consoles input clip LEDs illuminate between 3-6dB BEFORE clipping occurs for example.

Most pro audio power amps show the actual clip point because the LED doesn't really monitor clipping but shows other things as well to the knowledgeable user/engineer, such as loss of global feedback. Again, a dual function indicator that is done this way for a good reason that is not really applicable to the average bass player IMO.
 

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