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Skeptical about Darkglass

#101
As long as we're back: it's unfortunate that people lump all Darkglass pedals together! I think that's partly the fault of DG marketing -- for a long time, the product announcement demos mainly featured nu metal (or whatever it's called these days). I think DG has begun to address this -- some of their artists have demoed a pedal with different genres. Even so, "DG is for metal" is still in many folks' minds.

I've owned a bunch of DG products, and there isn't one "Darkglass sound". There are obvious differences between the BxK, Vintage, AO, and X series pedals. A couple of TBers have said they used their AO for gentle, always-on overdrive. Yes, B3K/B7K does have a mid notch... happens to work beautifully with my P-style basses, and it's not a "mid chasm" so I still get plenty of mids. The Vintage series has a mid bump! The AO had plenty of versatility, including mid-forward. The variable filters on the X give that series a huge amount of versatility.

I bought the DG 900 amp so I could use its onboard distortion when I didn't have time or space to set up pedals. Sure, it can rock, but I also use it for non-metal: oldies, pop, country, vintage R&B. And I'll use either mode on it (B3K or VMT) for those genres.

Bottom line: sure, DG does metal very well, but there isn't a "Darkglass tone". Judge each of their offerings independently.
 
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#103
It turns out I'm just more of a Tech21 sansamp kind of guy. I tried the X7 and the Vintage Deluxe and ultimately sold both of them. I didn't get on with the Vintage Deluxe AT ALL. Actually seriously disliked that one. I think I actually ditched the X7 too soon. I got a couple of tones out of it that I kinda liked but probably should have spent more time with it. May pick up another one some day. I'm rocking the VT Bass right now and I love it. It's the first dirt box I've had that I really fell in love with and I've tried a number of them. I'm probably going to pick up a Bass Driver just to experiment with.

All that being said, I really appreciate what Darkglass has done and continues to do. I'm a fan.
 
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#104
I approach the VT Bass quite differently compared to dirt boxes such as a bass drive, bass dist, bass fuzz by [enter brand name] and so on.

Not only is that pedal a preamp in itself, it is a complete signal chain (minus effects, para eq and compression) coming from its output and behaving in a manner similar to a valve amp that can produce overdrive by design, then it goes a bit beyond according to the Character knob. Given it's a pedal, such effect can be reproduced at controlled, non-ear-splitting levels.

A dirt box requires an amp and a cab by design. I agree to some extent when they say, for instance, that the ODB3 is a bit harsh in the high frequencies, but in today's world of DI boxes and amp models, people seem to forget that in the 90s it was meant to go through an actual amp and cab, and also voiced accordingly. Yes, it might have been mislabeled as "OD", but it's a dirt box meant to go through a rig and where the dry/wet blend is of utmost importance.

If I need a more surgical kind of drive or something voiced, I'd rather use one of those boxes blended in (not totally wet) and use the VT Bass as an amp, to tighten their tone and prevent mosquito-like buzz in the highs.
 
#105
cnltb said:
It is ok to not like everything. No?
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Of course it's OK to dislike all Darkglass pedals. My point was simply that anyone who claims there's a "Darkglass tone" doesn't know their products very well.



FWIW, the B7K is still top-three for me, and I own a couple other DG pedals. OTOH, I owned the AO for awhile and sold it -- it sounded fine and delivered a nice range of tones, but didn't quite crack my top ten.
 
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#106
I have a limited edition vintage micro tubes and it’s garbage. Works about half the time. (Issues seem to be with the bypass signal being cut by the pedal) have tried just about everything to fix. Pedal is garbage.

bought a Source Audio aftershock and haven’t looked back.
 
#109
xsnrg27 said:
I didn’t only cause I bought used. Worked the first 2 times and then kaput. And before you ask, yes I used the correct power supply.
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If that's the case, is there the chance that someone sold you an item knowing it was defective (that's why warranties exist) or it had been abused?
Reading your previous post, one might conclude that "DG pedals are garbage and badly built". Frankly speaking, it sounds a bit off.
Again, this is only speculation from my side and, having said that, I'd still try to get in touch with DG, explaining your issue. I can't guarantee anything, but I wouldn't be too surprised if their products carry a lifetime warranty or similar cover, given their price point and their status as a brand. At worst, they might get back explaining what their policy is, or mention some tips or options for you.

"Pedal is garbage" sounds to me more like the outcome of an emotional reaction rather than objective truth. I get your frustration, though.
 
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#110
EmaTheMirror said:
If that's the case, is there the chance that someone sold you an item knowing it was defective (that's why warranties exist) or it had been abused?
Reading your previous post, one might conclude that "DG pedals are garbage and badly built". Frankly speaking, it sounds a bit off.
Again, this is only speculation from my side and, having said that, I'd still try to get in touch with DG, explaining your issue. I can't guarantee anything, but I wouldn't be too surprised if their products carry a lifetime warranty or similar cover, given their price point and their status as a brand. At worst, they might get back explaining what their policy is, or mention some tips or options for you.

"Pedal is garbage" sounds to me more like the outcome of an emotional reaction rather than objective truth. I get your frustration, though.
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#111
fuzzspiral said:
wow...veeery interesting! At high gain it's a beasty fuzz
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The SFT is an Ampeg SVT emulation pedal, marketed to guitar players (thus the Stones setting), but works great for bass too. I have it on my board for OD, but also have the Joyo Orange Juice on my board. Another one is the Solidgoldfx Beta, which I have currently on a shelf.

The Joyo OJ is sinfully cheap, and has a pretty broad range of OD tones with little to no loss of low end. Joyo also just announced an “Oxford Sound”, which is another Orange amp emulation pedal, a copy of the Tech 21 Oxford pedal. I’ve one on order and am very curious.

What’s wrong with fuzz? I use the EHX Green Russian with the fuzz turned down low and the tone turned down low and it gives a really nice creamy OD sound. I also added the Brown Acid fuzz pedal, which can get really noisy, and sounds amazing in front of the SFT. Lots of low end, and however much dirt you want to dial in, from “not enough” to “holy sh*t too much!” It really sounds great.

EDIT: I saw you really liked the VT Bass, I was going to add that I also have it, and anything the SFT can do, the VT Bass DI can do. I found the VT Bass DI had a lot more options, and used it as an always on mild OD for a while, but decided I liked my clean tone better. So removed it. As an OD stomp, it has *too* many options, the SFT is a lot simpler and far easier to find what I wanted, and takes up less space. I should also add that I play a P primarily, with flats, fingers. If you use a pick or a different bass, you have to have a plan for that too. I also now use a Tbird Vintage Pro and the pickups are craaaaazy. I need totally different settings on everything for it.
 
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#112
MtManiac said:
I have it on my board for OD, but also have the Joyo Orange Juice on my board. Another one is the Solidgoldfx Beta, which I have currently on a shelf.

The Joyo OJ is sinfully cheap, and has a pretty broad range of OD tones with little to no loss of low end. Joyo also just announced an “Oxford Sound”, which is another Orange amp emulation pedal, a copy of the Tech 21 Oxford pedal. I’ve one on order and am very curious.
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I bought an orange-looking "Ammoon American Sound" as a backup pedal a while ago and I'm seeing a pattern here :smug:

Yes. I was surprised too, given what I paid. I don't have an actual Tech21 Blondie to A/B it, I do have the VT Bass and, yes, it's punchier by design on bass and the eq is set to affect different frequencies. But, as I mentioned, it's a different pedal by design and, as you say, the ones marketed for guitar (Tech 21 and derivates) don't cut your low end like a guitar speaker would. They do work well for the top end going dirty through DI, though.
 
#113
sunbeast said:
For sure the B3K/B7K and Alpha-Omega range were clearly designed with a lot of these tones in mind, but there is a whole VMT range and the new X/X7 range that are capable of completely different things. I don’t see how anyone who has owned both a B3K and a VMT could say they sound particularly similar at most settings? And what makes any of these pedals “optimized” for high gain? Lots of users use them at low gain- all it takes is turning the gain knob down...

The Vintage was marketed as a pedal made to reproduce vintage tube recorded tones, which is not really something I associate with those genres. You can get a guy with a low-tuned Dingwall with low action to demo one at high-gain and with high blend settings and it’ll still sound like that guy but that’s more a testament to the versatility of the pedal than proof that it is most capable of sounding like that guy. Having played through mostly tube amps (SVTs and a variety of Mesas, with a few other random Fenders, etc) for 20 years, I can say that the best tube amps don’t have “a” sound, they just make what you put into them sound better.


Then there’s the X7, which does tons of tones from Chris Squire to even cleanish cutting preamp tones- you can have a djent dude come in and make it sound djent, but I can use it to sound like me (just better!).

The Alpha-Omega range also happens to excel at a lot of midrangey tones that I don’t associate with those musical styles either (though obviously that one was designed for a particular user who does play in that world). It certainly doesn’t sound much at all like a B7K though.

I picked up a B3K then later a B7K back when they were the only DG stuff available and did feel like I was running them non-optimally as you say, fighting the inherent voice of the pedal. Compared to other pedals on the market then (and trust me I had tried most of them), it was still one of the best pedals to get punchy amp-like tone. When the VMT came out, it’s low gain tone was exactly the tone I was looking for. I think the Vintage line and X7 both excel at low-gain tones just as well or better (for me) than high-Gain tones where they can lose their punch. I’m not sure what beats personal experience to show me that! There are plenty of non-DG demos of the Vintage line to show this, and some good ones of the X7 too- Darkglass just seems to focus on a limited scene of players when they do official demos.
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Actually, the X7 is a B3k with a crossover. And the Alpha Omega is a blend between lot of thing including a b7k and a tech21 XXL
 
#114
Franz975 said:
Actually, the X7 is a B3k with a crossover. And the Alpha Omega is a blend between lot of thing including a b7k and a tech21 XXL
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It really isn’t though. Show me a video of someone nailing B3K tones with an X by turning down the crossover? You can’t, because the drive channel is voiced totally different than the B3K even if it uses Mosfets and similar signal path to a B3K. And you can’t make an AO sound like a B7K or an XXL either (or vice-versa), so what’s your point? Not every amp with 12ax7s and 6550s sounds the same even if they share the same foundational clipping mechanisms and similar signal paths, because the EQ filtering before and after amplification/clipping stages has just as much to do with what an amp sounds like just as it does in a drive pedal.

I wouldn’t say that a Mesa 400 is just like a Fender Super Bassman despite having similar tube sections and preamps with similar Fender-type TMB tonestacks because in the real-world they don’t sound sound similar at all. Not every amp that has a James tonestack sounds like an SVT, and not every circuit built off the foundation of a Rat pedal or Tubescreamer sounds the same either.
When you are saying “X company has a sound”, generally you are actually saying that a number of users use the gear of a certain company to attain a certain sound- usually by matching parts or most of the whole signal chain from bass to pedals to amp of someone they like the tone of. That doesn’t mean that equipment can’t be used to make vastly different types of tones, and I can personally attest to none of my music made with DG gear sounding anything at all like a modern djent band or similar.
 
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#115
Darkglass release the Microtube Infinity and say there is the Vintage, the B3k, and the X7 in it. But you only have the Vintage and B3k with or without crossover and when some answer where was the X they say that a b3k with crossover was the way to get the X tone.

Second, do you know what Jon Stockman use to get the AlphaO sound ? Because he basically use a Darkglass B7k, a Tech21 XXL bass, a Boss OD-B3 (with EQ, Ashdown/Ampeg amp and cabs, and some delay, reverb and Octaver but I don't think it is part of the distorded part). You can look at that on a Youtube video about Darkglass/Jon Stockman Rig/Karnivool bass tone
 
#116
Franz975 said:
Darkglass release the Microtube Infinity and say there is the Vintage, the B3k, and the X7 in it. But you only have the Vintage and B3k with or without crossover and when some answer where was the X they say that a b3k with crossover was the way to get the X tone.

Second, do you know what Jon Stockman use to get the AlphaO sound ? Because he basically use a Darkglass B7k, a Tech21 XXL bass, a Boss OD-B3 (with EQ, Ashdown/Ampeg amp and cabs, and some delay, reverb and Octaver but I don't think it is part of the distorded part). You can look at that on a Youtube video about Darkglass/Jon Stockman Rig/Karnivool bass tone
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If you've ever tried to get a B3K tone using an X pedal (not the Infinity) you would hear for yourself that they are not the same. Its different in the Infinity because you are instead given a B3K engine and a crossover, which is different from the X (the X distortion side lacks the always-present inherent mid-scoop voicing of the B3K, making it much fuzzier unless you leave the crossover set high)- the X may well have a similar drive architecture as the B3K, but without the voicing of the drive it sounds completely different (the same way a Boss Blues Driver pedal and Boss HM-2 sound completely different though they use the same clipping engine). So they are different tools, and they don't call the crossover tone in the Infinity "X" either, presumably because it isn't actually an emulation of the X but just something similar in theory.

And your point about the AO/Stockman tone doesn't matter either, because unless you could make the AO sound like all of those independent circuits it is just its own unique sound now. Again, if you have tried an AO and a B7K next to each-other you would find little crossover in the sounds they can make- the closest they can get is when dialing in a scoop using the Alpha engine, and the AO still sounds quite different. In fact the AO doesn't even use the same kind of clipping devices as the B7K.
 
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#117
sunbeast said:
If you've ever tried to get a B3K tone using an X pedal (not the Infinity) you would hear for yourself that they are not the same. Its different in the Infinity because you are instead given a B3K engine and a crossover, which is different from the X (the X distortion side lacks the always-present inherent mid-scoop voicing of the B3K, making it much fuzzier unless you leave the crossover set high)- the X may well have a similar drive architecture as the B3K, but without the voicing of the drive it sounds completely different (the same way a Boss Blues Driver pedal and Boss HM-2 sound completely different though they use the same clipping engine). So they are different tools, and they don't call the crossover tone in the Infinity "X" either, presumably because it isn't actually an emulation of the X but just something similar in theory.

And your point about the AO/Stockman tone doesn't matter either, because unless you could make the AO sound like all of those independent circuits it is just its own unique sound now. Again, if you have tried an AO and a B7K next to each-other you would find little crossover in the sounds they can make- the closest they can get is when dialing in a scoop using the Alpha engine, and the AO still sounds quite different. In fact the AO doesn't even use the same kind of clipping devices as the B7K.
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Ok
 
#118
Anybody know how the overdive from DG infinity is compared to Vintage deluxe?
At the moment i am using Vintage deluxe overdrive into the X7 as an eq without any overdrive from X7
So I was thinking if I could replace those two from my pedalboard and get DG Infinity.
 
#120
I recently went and found a clone of a b7k. Kinda an impulse buy and an experiment into if dark glass is something I'd want to put down an investment into. My take on it is that I think the dark glass circuit is good. The eq might not be exactly what some would like but it's really not bad. I'm not a huge distortion fan but it's definitely useable and if you have an active bass you can sculpt lots of things. I wanted something to balance out the super transparent and polite tone of my nux mld pedal I use for headphones and aux so I can run music. I kinda get myself a similar vibe with both pedals dialed in together as I did from my GK Plex that I really wish hadn't failed on me. It could be made gritty but it can also do transparent but at the same time there was a little bit of color that I just attribute to gk DNA. The "clone glass" kinda colored my tone and got me closer to where I want to get back to. On its own that b7k tone is a little baked in but not as 1 trick pony as other tones I've tried. Mind you it's not the real b7k but hopefully it's close enough I can give people a decent idea.
 

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