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Double Bass Slurred String Skipping (Sterling Cello Suite I.)

J

JamieParkinson

Apr 23, 2010
37
0
London, UK
#1
Hi,

I'm playing the Prelude from the 1st Cello Suite, Sterling Edition, and I'm struggling to get a nice sound when slurring notes across the strings and skipping one string (ie, missing one out - in the first few bars for example)

The string I shouldn't be playing usually makes some ugly sound.

Any way to get round this?

Thanks!
 
#2
You could play it at pitch, in G major. It's a great way to get comfortable in thumb position and frankly it's much easier than the Sterling edition.

As for the slurs, you could re-write the bowings so they aren't completely stupid/unplayable. Take a look at the Anna Magdelna Bach autograph score and you'll see the bowings are completely different from Sterling. Very few slurs, actually.

If you absolutely must play it in C with the written bowings, the technique is to very briefly stop (slow, or pulse - however you need to think about it) your bow's horizontal movement while bringing the frog up or down to change strings, all while holding the previous note in your left hand to let it resonate. The resonating string will fill the gap while you change strings.
 
#3
PaulCannon said:
You could play it at pitch, in G major. It's a great way to get comfortable in thumb position and frankly it's much easier than the Sterling edition.
....
Click to expand...
+1. Doing it C and sluring eight to a bow is good as an etude, but not how it is normally performed. There are also transcriptions in D which reduces some of the nasty nonadjacent crossings, but makes for some awkward shifts. Whatever the key, I'd break up the slurs, especially the bass notes.
 
#4
Hmmmm, I did expect some Sterling-bashing :p I can see the advantages of learning it at pitch and maybe that would have been a better choice, but I'm fine with this route for now.

However, I have already changed the bowing (and did quite a lot of research on the matter) not to the somewhat haphazard Anna Magdalena bowings but to what most 'Cello editions use, slurring the first 3 semiquavers of each 8-semiquaver group.

Guess I will work on slowing down at the crossing, but any more tips would be great - thanks!
 
#5
Playing it at pitch, changing the bowing, and playing the notes on a different string is only avoiding the real problem which is you gotta learn to play a smooth slur when crossing over a string. You ain't going to be allowd to change the key when you're playing a Beethoven Symphony! :-)

Try breaking the task of crossing the string into seperate parts. Concentrate on the wrist action for a while until you cross the unused string accurately and you get the higher string to speak smoothly. Then concentrate on not making the skipped string speak.

Above all, don't go looking for ways to avoid problems, hit them head-on so they cease becoming problems.
 
#7
Bill Bentgen said:
Playing it at pitch, changing the bowing, and playing the notes on a different string is only avoiding the real problem which is you gotta learn to play a smooth slur when crossing over a string. You ain't going to be allowd to change the key when you're playing a Beethoven Symphony! :-)

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Click to expand...

Except,the original key is not c, it is g so really, the sterling edition already changes the key. Granted one should be able to do what one wants, but I also think there is something to be said for trying to do things in the original key first. With that said, most often bass players move the keys aside from suites 1,2 and occasionally 6. 3 is most often played in g, but can be played in c, 4 is most often played in e major, but is also playable in eb, 5 in a, 6 in d or g. Bottom line is the key chosen should suit the music when its something as personal as bach.
 
#8
I played through the Sterling edition of that suite last night and spent a couple of minutes analyzing that crossing you're talking about.

The bow walks across the string without making a sound. For German bow, the quickness and smoothness of the rotation of the wrist seems to be the key. It's one of those things that are hard to describe but if you saw it one time you could probably do yourself instantly.

You have a teacher?
 
#9
JamieParkinson said:
Thanks Bill!

Should I expect the skipped string to be completely silent, or can there be a small sound (not a note) when I just touch it?
Click to expand...
There may be a nearly inaudible "pop," but a scratch or anything audible a few feet away should be avoided.

Try placing the bow on your A string, then lift the frog up and watch the stick's transition across the strings. There should be almost no sound when you do this. You can see the contact point between the string and hair changes as you move up and down -- this is something to think about when you work on string crossings.
 
#11
Bill Bentgen said:
Playing it at pitch, changing the bowing, and playing the notes on a different string is only avoiding the real problem which is you gotta learn to play a smooth slur when crossing over a string. ...
Click to expand...

True, and if you're only approaching the piece as an etude, then there is value in following the key and bowings in the arrangement. However, if you're going to use it for an audition, jury, or recital performance, then implementing unnecessary technical challenges is unlikely to win you points, unless perhaps the audience is composed solely of pedantic bass pedagogues. In that case I would play it in Ab:D

Bach cello suites are not composed for double bass, and like any transcription from another instrument, there is no shame in choosing the the key and bowings which best fit your instrument. In the case of the transcription we are discussing, it is ironic that changing these parameters from the original work makes the piece actually harder to play.

BTW, I find that the fourth suite works best a m7 down. Doing it in F allows me to preserve many of the double stops and broken triple stops which Bach wrote.
 
#12
Hi all,

I play French bow; but I can see now that pivoting around/over the skipped string (that's how I conceive it, at least) is the way to go that keeps things quiet.

I do have a teacher but haven't seen him for a while. I do intend to soon, although he is definitely more of a jazz guy than classical.

Thanks again!
 

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