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Double Bass SM 57 Under the Bridge
- Thread starter RogueLobster
- Start date
Gaolee
Official leathers tester and crash dummy
The good thing about a mic wrapped in a towel, all stuffed under the tailpiece is that it dampens the top and reduces feedback. I use a tennis ball stuffed under the tailpiece for the same purpose when playing my upright in a loud situation. It works reasonably well as a feedback killer and doesn't do anything too awful to the sound of the bass.
In an isolated environment, we use small diaphragm condenser omni-directional microphones in that manner and it is one of my favorite ways of amplifying the upright.
You can put a tape on the SM57 to make it it omni-directional, but in a live scenario she might get feedback.
You can put a tape on the SM57 to make it it omni-directional, but in a live scenario she might get feedback.
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I’ve done well enough with a Sennheiser e906 (chosen for form factor and because it’s meant to be close to the sound source) mounted with old earpads from my AKG k701’s and additional foam bits
Closeup with photos seem to no longer be on my phone
The mic is in between the ear pads
Closeup with photos seem to no longer be on my phone
The mic is in between the ear pads
Attachments
The SM57 is considered an instrument mic and the SM58 is considered a voice mic. I've seen both of them used interchangeably with good success.
That said, in a hand towel under the tailpiece whatever cardioid pattern a mic has won't matter much anymore. And in that capacity there's a good question about whether it's still working as a stand mic, or if in fact it is then a contact mic.
I agree it's a shortcut use of a mic, but it also has a pretty strong record at least in sensitive volume situations. Personally I'd rather use my mounted Senn e604, but not everyone has access to them.
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What Don said. But from a simpler perspective, I’ve found the SM57 to be “hotter” making it better for instrument micing.
Thats a hot feedback place on my bass
Earl
Supporting Member
Only if you want a lot of BOOM. Otherwise that is generally the worst place to mic a bass.
Hi all - could someone please direct me to the @Don Hergert MacGyver instructions for the Sennheiser e604 mount mod?
This is the mic
You should be able to figure it out from https://www.talkbass.com/threads/dynamic-mic-for-upright.1569017/#post-26602889
Hi Jason, maybe I can help with that...
Please note @Wasnex's excellent pic of the e604 above...
Here's how I mount it:
The e604 comes with a resin'ish drum tension hoop mount, bolted to the microphone's adjustable elbow with a black knurled knob'ed 1/4" bolt.
Remove the bolt and the resin'ish mount comes off with the bolt. The resin'ish mount can be removed, it probably won't be needed for a double bass.
Then that same bolt fits through one of the string holes in a conventional tailpiece, from the top of the tailpiece, and attaches back into the microphone's adjustable elbow and holds it in place under the tailpiece.
Using the elbow, the mic's attitude can be adjusted to point in various directions like an upside down turret, including toward one of the bridge feet (I point to the treble-side bridge foot). Once setup nearly as desired, a female XLR plug can be plugged into the mic underneath the tailpiece. Final attitude adjustments can be made then.
I use a female XLR to female 1/4" phono pigtail so I can plug into the mic with any standard mono amp cable. Since I leave my e604 mounted on my bass and use it often outside, I have a wind muff mounted over the mic to protect it from weather, bumps, etc.
Considerations:
The string hole sizes on the tailpiece and the height of the tailpiece over the top table may require different mic attitudes or adjustments. But conceptually the mount on the tailpiece is optimal. The mic itself with the bolt is very light -- on my DB the XLR plug weights more than the mic itself...
... My tailpiece is a custom Deuce aluminum tailpiece that has a dedicated accesory hole that I use for mounting the mic on my tailpiece, but I've experimented with the bolt on a couple of standard tailpieces and at least with them the bolt fits through string holes without modification.
My amp has a combo XLR/phono-plug socket which fits a 1/4" phono male plug and a switch that adds an internal impedance balancing transformer. I turn that on and the e604 sounds excellent as-is. On amps that do not provide impedance balancing, a common external inline impedance balancing transformer does the job just as well, (including in combination with my wireless dongles).
The e604 is of course a dynamic mic, so no battery or phantom power is required.
Some FOH guys prefer just to plug the e604 into one of their XLR cables (even instead of using my wireless dongles), so for that I simply unplug my pigtail and plug their XLR directly into the mic.
I hope that helps!
Please note @Wasnex's excellent pic of the e604 above...
Here's how I mount it:
The e604 comes with a resin'ish drum tension hoop mount, bolted to the microphone's adjustable elbow with a black knurled knob'ed 1/4" bolt.
Remove the bolt and the resin'ish mount comes off with the bolt. The resin'ish mount can be removed, it probably won't be needed for a double bass.
Then that same bolt fits through one of the string holes in a conventional tailpiece, from the top of the tailpiece, and attaches back into the microphone's adjustable elbow and holds it in place under the tailpiece.
Using the elbow, the mic's attitude can be adjusted to point in various directions like an upside down turret, including toward one of the bridge feet (I point to the treble-side bridge foot). Once setup nearly as desired, a female XLR plug can be plugged into the mic underneath the tailpiece. Final attitude adjustments can be made then.
I use a female XLR to female 1/4" phono pigtail so I can plug into the mic with any standard mono amp cable. Since I leave my e604 mounted on my bass and use it often outside, I have a wind muff mounted over the mic to protect it from weather, bumps, etc.
Considerations:
The string hole sizes on the tailpiece and the height of the tailpiece over the top table may require different mic attitudes or adjustments. But conceptually the mount on the tailpiece is optimal. The mic itself with the bolt is very light -- on my DB the XLR plug weights more than the mic itself...
... My tailpiece is a custom Deuce aluminum tailpiece that has a dedicated accesory hole that I use for mounting the mic on my tailpiece, but I've experimented with the bolt on a couple of standard tailpieces and at least with them the bolt fits through string holes without modification.
My amp has a combo XLR/phono-plug socket which fits a 1/4" phono male plug and a switch that adds an internal impedance balancing transformer. I turn that on and the e604 sounds excellent as-is. On amps that do not provide impedance balancing, a common external inline impedance balancing transformer does the job just as well, (including in combination with my wireless dongles).
The e604 is of course a dynamic mic, so no battery or phantom power is required.
Some FOH guys prefer just to plug the e604 into one of their XLR cables (even instead of using my wireless dongles), so for that I simply unplug my pigtail and plug their XLR directly into the mic.
I hope that helps!
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This is great thanks - yes that stand mount & bolt action look very handy.
I thought I saw another photo of this mic with maybe two large washers added and foam in between that was then clamped onto the string after length.
I hadn’t considered using the existing sting hole on the tailpiece. That seems solid.
I thought I saw another photo of this mic with maybe two large washers added and foam in between that was then clamped onto the string after length.
I hadn’t considered using the existing sting hole on the tailpiece. That seems solid.
FWIW, @rickwolff was the original source of the suggestion of using the Sennheiser e604 mic on a double bass, and I thank him very much for that insight. For me it has been a quality and simple MBOL solution that I've used on stage and in the studio lots of times. He may have also been the originator of the idea of using the large washers with foam.
Rick has evaluated lots of mics here in TB/DB and in doing so has also been very active in acquainting us with the Xlson mic line.
Rick has evaluated lots of mics here in TB/DB and in doing so has also been very active in acquainting us with the Xlson mic line.
JUST GOT THE SENNHEISER E604
This thing is tiny and weighs next to nothing (I think it's 2 oz). Just got back from the gig and it was waiting for me on the front porch. It's late but I hooked it up quick and it sounds good so far. It's so light that it would work really well with the H-Clamp, but also mounts easily to the afterlenghts with 2 rubber washers and 2 metal washers backing tghem up. The bolt that comes with it to attach it to the drum-clamp works great for this.
This thing is tiny and weighs next to nothing (I think it's 2 oz). Just got back from the gig and it was waiting for me on the front porch. It's late but I hooked it up quick and it sounds good so far. It's so light that it would work really well with the H-Clamp, but also mounts easily to the afterlenghts with 2 rubber washers and 2 metal washers backing tghem up. The bolt that comes with it to attach it to the drum-clamp works great for this.
Well there you have it!FWIW, @rickwolff was the original source of the suggestion of using the Sennheiser e604 mic on a double bass, and I thank him very much for that insight. For me it has been a quality and simple MBOL solution that I've used on stage and in the studio lots of times. He may have also been the originator of the idea of using the large washers with foam.
Rick has evaluated lots of mics here in TB/DB and in doing so has also been very active in acquainting us with the Xlson mic line.
JUST GOT THE SENNHEISER E604
This thing is tiny and weighs next to nothing (I think it's 2 oz). Just got back from the gig and it was waiting for me on the front porch. It's late but I hooked it up quick and it sounds good so far. It's so light that it would work really well with the H-Clamp, but also mounts easily to the afterlenghts with 2 rubber washers and 2 metal washers backing tghem up. The bolt that comes with it to attach it to the drum-clamp works great for this.
For anyone still interested here 
, from deeper into the same thread linked above, is another Sennheiser e604 direct tailpiece mount, a slightly different approach than what I described:
Anyway, I found this mounting option works well - a 3/8" bolt and two rubber O rings...
the perspective makes it look as though the mic is touching the tailpiece - it is not.
, from deeper into the same thread linked above, is another Sennheiser e604 direct tailpiece mount, a slightly different approach than what I described:- possibly the wind muff reduced some very low frequencies? that should allow you to turn up the mic gain?
Anyway, I found this mounting option works well - a 3/8" bolt and two rubber O rings...
the perspective makes it look as though the mic is touching the tailpiece - it is not.
Dusted off some gear for a baseline mic experiment. Surprisingly good results (at home) with the “57 in a towel under the tailpiece” & the “wireless / rubber band trick under the bridge”.
The AKG 214 was clearly the winner for clarity. I even tried the 609 trick wedged under the bridge and it sounded killer.
Problem is, these hot mics will pick up everything in a noisy room, so, not sure if adding a mic is a fools errand at this point, but it’s reaffirmed my commitment to always always always keep a spare 57 and xlr cord in the kit bag just in case!
I did the same thing a few days ago- came across a couple of mikes I had tried at one point years ago. I was tempted to try them again and had to remind myself that it would be a waste of time for similar reasons to yours. I'm quite happy with the sound and simplicity of what I'm using now and am going to give them to a friend with a recording studio and remove temptation.
I do have to say I’m impressed enough to consider ordering one of those choice products under-tailpiece-57 mic holder clamps. It’s only like $50 and I’ve already got the 57.
Either that or one of the e604s mounted to the string after length or directly to the tailpiece. These are very lightweight and only $150 new. I could likely find another use for it if it didn’t work out on the DB.
Not sure how a mic would work for me as the entire source, but maybe just a little blend with more of the pup.
There is a top player around here who uses an RE20 on a stand into an amp so it’s not unworkable!
Either that or one of the e604s mounted to the string after length or directly to the tailpiece. These are very lightweight and only $150 new. I could likely find another use for it if it didn’t work out on the DB.
Not sure how a mic would work for me as the entire source, but maybe just a little blend with more of the pup.
There is a top player around here who uses an RE20 on a stand into an amp so it’s not unworkable!
Quick update. Played a jazz quintet set this evening at an outdoor street fair.
Very glad I had the Krivo magnetic pup to deal with the crazy loud subs under the stage.
Anyway, the sound man had Sennheiser e604s on the kit. After the gig I grabbed one and 1) the rubber drum rim mount fits great in the bridge leg 2) the tailpiece string hole clamp looks very promising.
Very glad I had the Krivo magnetic pup to deal with the crazy loud subs under the stage.
Anyway, the sound man had Sennheiser e604s on the kit. After the gig I grabbed one and 1) the rubber drum rim mount fits great in the bridge leg 2) the tailpiece string hole clamp looks very promising.
