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So Talkbass Has A Store Now...

#81
Bryan R. Tyler said:
By who? This is a forum. Every post is completely transparent. If me and the other admins suddenly started bumping every GHS strings thread, everyone would notice. We're not being paid or asked to promote the store. It not only doesn't benefit us, but it would look gross if we did. It's a side business for Paul's family that doesn't affect the forum usage or the staff at all.

As for you no longer contributing, that's a bit of throwing the baby out with the bathwater/taking your ball and going home. Your activity on TalkBass and your reputation spread around by happy TBers has earned you a lot of business- I'd wager a majority of your business comes from TBers. While a few users who used your store may opt to buy from TB instead, you're going to lose or lose the potential of gaining a vast amount more if your presence disappears altogether. Your activity and reputation are what attracts customers to you- not a lack of competition.
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I have no problem with competition. If they decided to open a store separate from the forum and post on the forum as an advertiser just as I do then no problem! The problem is, that based on the Commercial User Policy we can not post direct links or directly recommend a product unless specifically asked. When it comes to giving info a commercial user can only post general information. Having a direct link to the store and products I see as a conflict with the current CUP.

Also, now the forum has become content for a store. I have no reason to provide content for someone else's store. I do not go on other stores and post information about products so no reason to do it here as well. Not all users know who I am, the content I write is read as general info on this stores forum.

Content on this forum is searchable though Google and other search engines. I'd rather the content I write direct to my website/web store than someone else's. Simple as that. That is why I will no longer provide product information and resources for this store.
 
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#82
Selta said:
Just curious, and I'm going to ask this as simply/plainly as I can - do you honestly not see a conflict of interest by talkbass setting up their own store?
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A conflict of interest with who? The site as a business makes money through advertising and, now, through the store. The site as a forum is not affected in any way by this. The only change is the addition of a tab that says "Store" between the Wiki and Members tab. If we're not promoting brands in the forum, we're not conflicting with anyone. And btw, I'm pretty positive all the brands the store carries are brands that Jason and every other string store carries.

The only real conflict of interest would be allowing other companies to sell strings to have a presence here, and that would be a conflict of interest against the TB store, not against the other companies. Except those companies aren't being asked to leave.
 
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#85
SLaPiNFuNK said:
I have no problem with competition. If they decided to open a store separate from the forum and post on the forum as an advertiser just as I do then no problem! The problem is, that based on the Commercial User Policy we can not post direct links or directly recommend a product unless specifically asked. When it comes to giving info a commercial user can only post general information. Having a direct link to the store and products I see as a conflict with the current CUP.

Also, now the forum has become content for a store. I have no reason to provide content for someone else's store. I do not go on other stores and post information about products so no reason to do it here as well. Not all users know who I am, the content I write is read as general info on this stores forum.

Content on this forum is searchable though Google and other search engines. I'd rather the content I write direct to my website/web store than someone else's. Simple as that. That is why I will no longer provide product information and resources for this store.
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Except there is no user that is conflicting with the CUP. No one is promoting the store in-forum. No one is saying "shop here." We receive advertising dollars from many companies. Allowing vendors such as yourself to have any presence here at all could be seen as a conflict of interest to those paying for advertising. Allowing them to stay under a strict CUP both satisfies that conflict and still gives you a presence and what amounts to free publicity. One tab at the top of the forum compared to thousands of visible, archived posts by you doesn't put you at the disadvantage- quite the opposite actually.

It's your choice and you should do as you see fit, but to me it seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Every post you make does link to your store. Every good impression you make increases peoples' interest in buying from you. Stop posting here and you're going to lose all that visibility.
 
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#86
yodedude2 said:
as a supporting member, it is affecting me. i believe that does affect the site as a forum (albeit in an infinitesimal way from anyone else's point of view.)
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I'm not sure I see how the forum experience will change at all, being that the forums are member-generated content. Can you expand on how your (and my) experience in the forums will be affected? Not trying to argue ... I honestly want to know how the forums are going to change.
 
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#87
Bryan R. Tyler said:
A conflict of interest with who? The site as a business makes money through advertising and, now, through the store. The site as a forum is not affected in any way by this. The only change is the addition of a tab that says "Store" between the Wiki and Members tab. If we're not promoting brands in the forum, we're not conflicting with anyone. And btw, I'm pretty positive all the brands the store carries are brands that Jason and every other string store carries.

The only real conflict of interest would be allowing other companies to sell strings to have a presence here, and that would be a conflict of interest against the TB store, not against the other companies. Except those companies aren't being asked to leave.
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Ok, cool to see your response. Even if it doesn't live up with how I (and apparently BSO, if not others) view the situation.

I see the "conflict" arise where TalkBass Forum and TalkBass Store are inseparable. They are not two entities, they are one - they are "TalkBass". Admins and mods may try to say they are not, but as a general (long time) user, I see them as one and the same. I'm pretty sure other people in this thread feel the same, and if you were to point a brand new user here, they would see it all as one, also.

TalkBass demands commercial users to adhere to an extended set of rules and in some cases, pay. TalkBass, however, does not need to abide by those same rules, and in fact, already are not. TalkBass has a link to their own store at the very top of the page. In webdev, this is extremely prime real estate. In order for Jason, or anyone, to have similar (but not equal) placement, is to pony money up for ads (which, it's a known fact that savvy net surfers use ad blockers).

In addition, Jason makes a very valid point - he spends X amount of time here being helpful, and answering questions. So someone sees that content (which, in turn helps TalkBass page ranking, among other benefits), hits the "store" button up top and viola, a sale for Talkbass.

While small, each occurrence is IMO a conflict, and tilts things favorably in TalkBass's favor. And the store is what, 2 days old?

I obviously have no dog in this fight. The impact this has on me is basically nil. I can't bring myself to buy anything from TalkBass, though.

Luke19Boarder said:
I'm not sure I see how the forum experience will change at all, being that the forums are member-generated content. Can you expand on how your (and my) experience in the forums will be affected? Not trying to argue ... I honestly want to know how the forums are going to change.
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Well, an example is already potentially forming. If Jason were to cut down or leave the forum, the information available could be reduced. If enough other people, especially vendors, do the same, then the community as a whole suffers. Driving out those people is not the soundest of maneuvers.
 
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#88
Do any of y'all think that I'd be so stupid as to compromise the integrity of the TalkBass forums for a side-business? The TalkBass forums have been profitable (ie, my day job, supporting my 4 (soon 5) kids and wife since 2004. This is my livelihood, my job. And I LOVE it. The store is for my family. My wife is shipping out of an upstairs utility room, and the kids are going to grow into this family business one day. Compromising the unbiased integrity of the member-generated TB Forums would destroy the whole thing.
 
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#89
Bryan R. Tyler said:
Except there is no user that is conflicting with the CUP. No one is promoting the store in-forum. No one is saying "shop here." We receive advertising dollars from many companies. Allowing vendors such as yourself to have any presence here at all could be seen as a conflict of interest to those paying for advertising. Allowing them to stay under a strict CUP both satisfies that conflict and still gives you a presence and what amounts to free publicity. One tab at the top of the forum compared to thousands of visible, archived posts by you doesn't put you at the disadvantage- quite the opposite actually.

It's your choice and you should do as you see fit, but to me it seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Every post you make does link to your store. Every good impression you make increases peoples' interest in buying from you. Stop posting here and you're going to lose all that visibility.
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To view posters signature is optional. Users have the option to view them. The Store button is static users do not have an option to turn that off. So you force your paid users to view an advertisement.

I've never emailed directly your members paid users advertisements for my store. I do not have the ability to do so. You have emailed users advertising your product (the store).
 
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#90
Selta said:
TalkBass demands commercial users to adhere to an extended set of rules and in some cases, pay. TalkBass, however, does not need to abide by those same rules, and in fact, already are not. TalkBass has a link to their own store at the very top of the page. In webdev, this is extremely prime real estate. In order for Jason, or anyone, to have similar (but not equal) placement, is to pony money up for ads (which, it's a known fact that savvy net surfers use ad blockers).

In addition, Jason makes a very valid point - he spends X amount of time here being helpful, and answering questions. So someone sees that content (which, in turn helps TalkBass page ranking, among other benefits), hits the "store" button up top and viola, a sale for Talkbass.
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I didn't even notice the "Store" link till it was mentioned on this page. And a user could even more easily click the BSO link at the bottom of each of Jason's posts.
 
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#93
GregC said:
I didn't even notice the "Store" link till it was mentioned on this page. And a user could even more easily click the BSO link at the bottom of each of Jason's posts.
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Frankly it's about as inconspicuous as it could be made. And when viewing the forums, who opts to read the navigation bar on every page instead of the posts?
 
#95
Luke19Boarder said:
I'm not sure I see how the forum experience will change at all, being that the forums are member-generated content. Can you expand on how your (and my) experience in the forums will be affected? Not trying to argue ... I honestly want to know how the forums are going to change.
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it's personal...not sure about you. also, i'm still processing it all. on one hand, i feel like i',m paying to sell items on the forum, and now the forum is using a bit of the money i pay to sell so that they can sell. on another hand, it's the surprise of it all...it just 'appeared'. i dislike the unannounced change quite a bit, and it changes the way i view and interact with this internet space. all out of hands...still mulling it over, but generally displeased.
 
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#98
Bryan R. Tyler said:
Frankly it's about as inconspicuous as it could be made. And when viewing the forums, who opts to read the navigation bar on every page instead of the posts?
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Again, you're just trying to justify the conflict, in my opinion. Saying that "Oh, yeah, we're taking full advantage of placement and readership, but we're only doing it a little." doesn't suddenly take the conflict away.
 
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#99
Selta said:
Well, an example is already potentially forming. If Jason were to cut down or leave the forum, the information available could be reduced. If enough other people, especially vendors, do the same, then the community as a whole suffers. Driving out those people is not the soundest of maneuvers.
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People threatened to leave when the site changed servers (I think that's what happened) and looked different. People threatened to leave when the 'like' system was implemented. People threatened to leave when the mobile app was discontinued/changed. There are going to be people who fight any sort of change to the website. Should the admins never implement any changes to the site because of the potential that people will leave?

As far as I can tell, the potential for the store to be implemented inappropriately is just that - potential. My experience here is exactly the same as it was last week, and I'd be incredibly surprised if there is a noticeable negative impact on TalkBass as a whole because of a small store being implemented.
 
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#100
Fat Freddy said:
I posted the following in a different thread....

Just thought I'd add my 2c's worth here too....

Absolutely gutted about the loss of Jason to this community.....

Also, now feeling a little uneasy about purchasing a Tee shirt from the TB store yesterday!.....

Not in the market for strings right now, but rest assured that when I am, I'll be buying from Jason :thumbsup:

EDIT: Also wondering about postage prices from the TB store....$11.00 plus minimum for a Tee? :(....

No point bitching now I guess, my own fault for paying it....
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Where did you get that $11.00 minimum? My shipping for a T was $3.45. It is on its way. Get an email with tracking info. Very professional from what I see. I don't know about sales tax where you are, mine was $1.65.
 

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