Double Bass Solid basic pickup for home use

[I.M. Noone]

I have a new set of Dirty Guts on my ‘57 Kay. I really love the sound but, it’s fairly quiet in the bedroom/music room. I was thinking of springing for a basic pickup so I’m not plucking overly hard just to hear the notes. Any tips? I won’t be recording with it and doubt I’ll ever play out live. I just want to amplify the basic sound a bit. Thanks in advance and stay warm!

 

[Francois Blais]

Maybe it's the strings that are too quiet.
Anyway I like the K&K BassMax as a basic pickup.
Works well, and pretty affordable.
It's also not too picky about the amp's input impedance.

 

[AGCurry]

If your bass is not loud enough in your bedroom, there is a) something wrong with the bass, b) something wrong with your technique, or c) you have a really bad bedroom acoustically. A pickup will only fool you into thinking that things are good.

Have you tried playing into a corner?

 

[Ric Vice]

Good words AG, I have heard and played some Kay Basses that for whatever reason (i.e. sound post adjustment, strings, or bridge fit) didn't produce much sound. Once they were setup

really had great sound and projection. Once that's addressed I like the Kremona KNB-1 because it's really easy to mount, and easy on the bridge. While the K&K Bass Max offers great

value, easy of installation, and excellent feedback isolation, I've had to many bassists that I've known personally, have issues with it's ceramic element getting damaged. Maybe

the players who were having those issues were just to rough on the pickup when installing and removing it. Just my take of course.

 

[damonsmith]

Agreed. Get the bass and your technique checked out. You shouldn't need any amplifacation at home and you should really only need it when there is a drummer or other amplified instruments in the band.

If your bass is not loud enough in your bedroom, there is a) something wrong with the bass, b) something wrong with your technique, or c) you have a really bad bedroom acoustically. A pickup will only fool you into thinking that things are good.

Have you tried playing into a corner?

 

[Don Hergert]

I have a new set of Dirty Guts on my ‘57 Kay. I really love the sound but, it’s fairly quiet in the bedroom/music room. I was thinking of springing for a basic pickup so I’m not plucking overly hard just to hear the notes. Any tips? I won’t be recording with it and doubt I’ll ever play out live. I just want to amplify the basic sound a bit. Thanks in advance and stay warm!

My experience with specifically the SBW Deluxe Dirty Gut E and A strings was the same. They sound great for tone and are great amped, but their clarity and volume acoustically are poor. In contrast, the Dirty Gut D and G have always had great clarity and volume acoustically. After putting up with it for about 6 months I replaced my Dirty Gut E and A with Innovation SilverSlaps E and A...

Acoustically that made a huge positive difference, so now I can play acoustically with jams and my band anytime I want to. I'm still using the Dirty Gut D and G over the SilverSlaps E and A now; they are a great low-tension mixed-set for tone, clarity and volume.

That said, an easy way to get into pickups is with Vic's Pickups. If you don't slap and only need a single-side bridge wing pickup, you can get Zac Victor's Model B for ~$35US and with most amps you most likely won't need a pre-amp. Zac uses a two-element piezo system that produces lots of volume for direct amp'ing under most circumstances.

 

[AGCurry]

I should have added: How is your hearing? I need hearing aids to practice right ... I can't hear all the overtones without them.

 

[I.M. Noone]

Thank you as always for your insights. I do have some hearing loss from decades of loud band play, but between a heavily carpeted and muted bedroom and wannabe gut strings, I’ll definitely try playing into a corner for the time being and go from there. I am also brand new to the double bass and I am saving up for a visit to the local Austin bass tech to get it properly set up - I guess I should focus on those things before a pickup

 

[unbrokenchain]

Never used SBW strings but if they're anything like weedwhackers, I would definitely vote for better strings before a pickup. You can probably find a set of used Spiro .3885 weichs for a hundred bucks or less, that'd be my personal recommendation.

 

[Jared Houseman]

I also recommend the k&k bass max. It's not the very best option out their, but it's very agreeable and easy to work with

 

[AGCurry]

... I am also brand new to the double bass ...

This may be part of the problem. The force needed to pluck double bass properly is a lot greater than for bass guitar, and the technique is different.

 

[turf3]

This may be part of the problem. The force needed to pluck double bass properly is a lot greater than for bass guitar, and the technique is different.

Bingo! OP, take some lessons on pizzicato technique for the double bass. Plucking halfway up the string with your finger perpendicular to string like a bass guitar is the recipe for a wimpy little sound.

 

[Don Hergert]

The force needed to pluck double bass properly is a lot greater than for bass guitar, and the technique is different.

^^this^^

And, it's not just force, it's also how your finger pulls the string. Especially with Dirty Guts, for pizz you're going to want to catch the string with the long side of the fingers (index and 2nd fingers or whatever preferred combination), not just the fingertips, with the fingers pointing mostly downward, parallel to the strings. You may also want to anchor your thumb on the edge of the fingerboard. I also found my Dirty Guts to be extremely quiet until I picked up this technique.

For me, the pizz stroke while slapping does use the fingertips. But it is a strong pull -- for me, i use Index, 2nd and middle fingers for that slap-pizz stroke.

And to be clear, while Dirty Guts in the production process start with wacker material (Kevlar core Gator line), their spiral cut sets them a large distance apart from plain wackers. They move much more air than plain wackers, and the texture from the spiral cut gives them a real affinity to both finger and bow, plus it keeps them from getting sticky in humid weather. Plus, for those who care, their touch and appearance is extremely gut-like.

Personally, I go back and forth about whether I want to go to real guts. If I ever do, I'll probably only go gut D and G, keeping my SilverSlaps E and A, but honestly it's a hard sell since my Dirty Guts D and G are really so good.

I'll 2nd (or 3rd) the lesson suggestion, btw. Some things you may be able to learn on your own and by reading about them, but having a teacher or a mentor to watch and learn from can make a big difference.

 

[I.M. Noone]

Thanks, gentlemen! I’ll seriously consider your recommendation on lessons. I’ve made good progress in the month or so since I bought ‘er, but real world experience certainly wins out over a pile of YouTube videos

 

[HateyMcAmp]

Personally, I go back and forth about whether I want to go to real guts. If I ever do, I'll probably only go gut D and G, keeping my SilverSlaps E and A, but honestly it's a hard sell since my Dirty Guts D and G are really so good.

i’m glad you enjoy the whackers so much, but if you ever try real gut I’d be surprised if you didn’t have a very different read on this situation. While nylons can get a of the gut feel and looks, the big difference IMHO is sound. Not that nylons can’t sound good, they just don’t sound like gut.

what other strings have you tried besides the dirty gut?

 

[Don Hergert]

what other strings have you tried besides the dirty gut?

On My DB, SilverSlaps and the original mixed set of wackers and cable-core synthetics that came with it to me. On other people's DBs, Spiros, Ultrasonics, Polychromes, Rockabillys, guts and a number of metal strings whose brands I forget (and which were pretty forgettable for my tastes).

I'd also love to try Spiros, Perps and/or Polychromes, but not on my Alcoa, from which I'm trying to get more non-metallic tone. They would be potentially for a wooden DB sometime in my future.

 

[conte2music]

In hopes of saving a newer double bassist from getting injured due to overexertion while attempting to increase sound production, I'd like to offer up the phrase "full gravity inspired arm weight achieved through a relaxed approach" in place of where our colleagues used "forced" or "strong" in the above posts.

It may strike some as an overly picky distinction, but I expect many of you understand the distinction I'm attempting to make from your personal lived experience. I welcome editorial suggestions if you have the wording to more completely describe what I'm taking a stab at.

About 7 years ago, I was injured while using an industrial nail gun with unknowingly poor technique. The lasting result is chronic tennis elbow and trigger finger like symptoms that require my constant maintenance. By comparison, I was previously able to rip the bass in half. If I have any hopes of continuing to play into my 40s and beyond, I need to play with great attention and utilize finesse over force. Admittedly, I hadn't developed or even attempted to develop a "finesse-filled" approach because I was, compared to many, a hulking 30 year old with the natural strength able to overcome technical deficiencies. In the blink of an eye those days were gone.

 

[Wasnex]

I'll agree with the others who question the logic of using a pickup for home practice. I was a touring pro for about 25 years and almost always rehearsed and performed with an amp regardless of whether I played arco or pizz. However, when I practiced by myself, I never used the amp.

A goal upright players typically have with a pickup and amp is MBOL. MBOL stands for My Bass Only Louder, and it's actually quite elusive. The bass, pickup, and amp work as a system, and unfortunately the system tends to sound different than just the bass. The louder you play the worse this tends to get.

Also the pickup and amp tends to destroy the intimate connection that you will feel with the instrument when you play with acoustically. It's sort of like there is a small delay between when you play the notes and when the sound develops. This is not to say that you shouldn't get a pickup of some sort...just that it's not something that I advise using for home practice.

The most enjoyable space IMHO is actually a medium size rehearsal room with fairly strong natural reverberation. The reverb will reinforce your sound so the bass seems a bit louder. It will also flatter you, so be careful as it will make you sound better than you actually are.

 

[I.M. Noone]

Thanks, Wasnex - I get what you’re saying. Since I’m happy with my bass’s sound as I’m learning, I’ll figure out an accoustically better room for practicing.

 

[I.M. Noone]

About 7 years ago, I was injured while using an industrial nail gun with unknowingly poor technique. The lasting result is chronic tennis elbow and trigger finger like symptoms that require my constant maintenance. By comparison, I was previously able to rip the bass in half. If I have any hopes of continuing to play into my 40s and beyond, I need to play with great attention and utilize finesse over force. Admittedly, I hadn't developed or even attempted to develop a "finesse-filled" approach because I was, compared to many, a hulking 30 year old with the natural strength able to overcome technical deficiencies. In the blink of an eye those days were gone.

Sorry to hear this, I hope you regain some of your former strength. I’m happy that you are able to still play!