Solid state/class d vs tube amps

[Korladis]

This is so true man. I basically sold my SWR Goliath Sr 610 just because people I gig with expressed their opinions on the bulkiness of the rig way too often and basically subconsciously made me sell it and look for lighter and smaller stuff.

Edit: Also, no one will willingly help you carry it so it almost always ends up feeling as if people are doing you a big favour just helping you carry the damn thing to the car and that you should be happy you don't get replaced because you take up too much space in the van. But then again, every drummer loves when I help him carry his hardware bag :/

I also hate when you come to a gig and the main guy comes to you and tells you how you are the first guy in 50 years of the clubs existence to bring such a huge amp and cab. Like *** man, it really ain't your problem now is it? Should I come with a radio and a car speaker next time?

(and this literally happened when I brought my EBS Fafner and Barefaced Big Twin 2. Imagine the looks when I bring the SVT CL and 810 lol)

The places I play, no one bats an eye at 810s.

 

[Basslinger05]

The places I play, no one bats an eye at 810s.

can,t figr out why everybody seems to love 10s, to me,they just don,t kick out enough bottom. I use an old acoustic 301 that I put a crossover & good horn in that blows away just about anything out there! as for SS amps I like tubes kinduv hard to beat an svt cept for the 100 lbs the damn things weigh currently, I,m using a 300 w Traynor that I love ! Sounds just as good as an svt & weighs half as much Peace

 

[Korladis]

can,t figr out why everybody seems to love 10s, to me,they just don,t kick out enough bottom. I use an old acoustic 301 that I put a crossover & good horn in that blows away just about anything out there! as for SS amps I like tubes kinduv hard to beat an svt cept for the 100 lbs the damn things weigh currently, I,m using a 300 w Traynor that I love ! Sounds just as good as an svt & weighs half as much Peace

The 410HLF I hate because it puts out too much bottom and not enough midrange. Driver size doesn't tell you much besides how big the hole in the baffle is.

The thing that put me off the Traynor tube heads is that they use the FMV tone stack, which I dislike as there's no way to actually get a mids boost on it.

 

[GreyBeard]

The 410HLF I hate because it puts out too much bottom and not enough midrange. Driver size doesn't tell you much besides how big the hole in the baffle is.

The thing that put me off the Traynor tube heads is that they use the FMV tone stack, which I dislike as there's no way to actually get a mids boost on it.

Just max the mids and turn down the bass and treb. much like the Alembic pre. 2-10-2. And if that doesn't work, add an EQ pedal.

 

[Korladis]

Just max the mids and turn down the bass and treb. much like the Alembic pre. 2-10-2. And if that doesn't work, add an EQ pedal.

On a FMV tone stack, 2-10-2 is flat. You can't get an actual boost. And that's also why I'm wholly uninterested in the Alembic pre or any other pre that uses is it.

On my current amp, which sadly uses the FMV stack, I fortunately have a graphic EQ that I can use to get a true mid boost.

 

[rodl2005]

I know squat about the technical aspects of tube amps, and solid state amps. ..and hybrid amps for that matter. But I DO know what I like. ..and what I like has a YOOOOJ. ...read that? YOOOOOOOOJ impact to what I use at gigs.
My favourite amp of all time is my current Fender Super Bassman. .. and I'm in the fortunate position to have a 100w all tube amp in the V4B Ampeg, which is another favorite. ..again. ..of all time.
The weight factor does come into play. ..I'm 54 y.o. (just ) and I'm always the one, by myself, loading my gear.
Both these amps are about 5 yrs old. ..both are still on their original power tubes. ..both sound astoundingly good.
I've also got a couple of class D amps, and I love these 2 also. But I . ..me personally. ..find it hard to NOT take my tube amps to gigs.
I'll usually only take the lightweight ones when the gig has poor access. ..i.e. lotsa stairs etc. .. to the stage area.
But. .. tomorrow night I AM gonna take my Berg B|Amp to the corporate function gig we've got. Not because there's poor access or that I'll need more clean volume nor nuffin... drool
Just coz I'm taking the Bergantino Nv215 and I've not paired these 2 up yet. And I'm eager to try the B|Amp with the NV215.
I'll post my views in the Berg thread.
But re the tube amps /class D thang. .. again, my 2c only. I find that I like the class D amp GENERALLY more than traditional solid state amps.
I found it 1st with the Genz Benz Shuttle 6.0 I had. Also I liked the Mark Bass LMII (dunno if that was Class D) , but for some reason. ..that's the way uh huh uh huh I like it.

 

[mesaplayer83]

The 410HLF I hate because it puts out too much bottom and not enough midrange. Driver size doesn't tell you much besides how big the hole in the baffle is.

Agreed 100% - I've owned Mesa PH210, 410, 610, and 810 cabs, at least (3) SVT-410HLFs and even more SVT-810e cabs, and played thru an SWR Goliath Sr(610) plenty - and they all had tons of low end...

 

[Basslinger05]

Agreed 100% - I've owned Mesa PH210, 410, 610, and 810 cabs, at least (3) SVT-410HLFs, and played thru an SWR Goliath Sr(610) plenty - and they all had tons of low end...

I,m new to this forum, it's really cool to read what you other players think & do! I'm pretty old (67) & set in my ways , always thought of myself as just part of the rhythm section. Most of my carrier ( which is going on 50 yrs) I,be played in 3 piece bands so I,ve always tried to keep my sound as thick & heavy as possible ( sometimes pissin guitar players off, which pleases me to no end) if any of you get the chance to try one of the old acoustic cabs, ( the folded horn w/ an 18) I,ll guarantee you'll be impressed w/ just how much low end projection they crank out & mine,w a high end horn crossed over at 1.2k is mind boggling ,I don't use effects, just boost the lows & highs& leave the mids flat
always tried for the Entwistle sound. Yah I,m set in my ways! Peace

 

[stefancaunter]

can,t figr out why everybody seems to love 10s, to me,they just don,t kick out enough bottom. I use an old acoustic 301 that I put a crossover & good horn in that blows away just about anything out there! as for SS amps I like tubes kinduv hard to beat an svt cept for the 100 lbs the damn things weigh currently, I,m using a 300 w Traynor that I love ! Sounds just as good as an svt & weighs half as much Peace

always used 15s since i learned that john lord used them...

 

[mpdd]

I use 15s because the small Marshall ibs 115s fit in the back of my 86 Chevy nova when I was in college, now you know why

 

[Deak]

I,m new to this forum, it's really cool to read what you other players think & do! I'm pretty old (67) & set in my ways , always thought of myself as just part of the rhythm section. Most of my carrier ( which is going on 50 yrs) I,be played in 3 piece bands so I,ve always tried to keep my sound as thick & heavy as possible ( sometimes pissin guitar players off, which pleases me to no end) if any of you get the chance to try one of the old acoustic cabs, ( the folded horn w/ an 18) I,ll guarantee you'll be impressed w/ just how much low end projection they crank out & mine,w a high end horn crossed over at 1.2k is mind boggling ,I don't use effects, just boost the lows & highs& leave the mids flat
always tried for the Entwistle sound. Yah I,m set in my ways! Peace

Welcome! You are going to enjoy this site and its forums. A great bunch of guys, super informative and helpful with so many "Why didn't I think of that" and "now I know!" info (and some are really smart!). Again welcome and enjoy!

 

[eli]

I have of course turned every knob there is hehe. The problem is usually with the meaty low mids. I either get a nice round bottom on low notes but lose on the upper register resulting in thin upper notes, or I get a nice and beefy g and d string but get overwhelmed on the e string. Could a hpf filter do the trick perhaps?

You might try my EliSlope™ which is no more than raising the pickups on the treble side and lowering them on the bass side. I actually do this so extremely that on some basses, I have needed to angle-drill the screw holes in the pickups so they don't bind. This slope takes the hugeness out of the lower strings while leaving the upper strings nice and full. After that, sometimes I back a tad off the bass knob on the instrument (on instruments with active electronics).

 

[Eddie LeBlanc]

I shall have to Thoroughly Investigate this Wonderful Thing. It is difficult to compare exactly from the photographs, but it seems to Closely Resemble my Household Refrigeration Appliance.

Yep. As an old fart, I can't haul such stuff any longer. And there has been a lot of design and technical improvements in bass speaker and amp design, since the first days of huge heavy bass amps. Believe me, I have had my share of hauling around over-weight tube gear, multiple 10 inch cabs, 15 inch cabs, even 18 inch cabs, and folded horns too. Thank God, progress finally started working on sound reproduction for us bass players. For a long time, the industry didn't really care. BTW been playing bass for over 50 years. And believe it or not, once had a japanese Dan Electro (Silvertone Amp that was a 250 watt solid state head with a six 15 inch cabinet - damn that was behemoth - loud but -- well you get it. In the late 60s it was the cat's meow to a high schooler)

 

[eli]

...read that? YOOOOOOOOJ

Over here we spell that "YUUUUUUUUGE"

 

[Eddie LeBlanc]

Yep... YUUUUUGE alright.

 

[Charlie 50Watts]

Nothing lasts forever....and tubes are only part of the equation. Tube amps may require a little more maintenance than solid state, but there is absolutely no need to "constantly" change tubes. Tubes can last for years. Moving a heavy amp is like moving anything else. Too heavy? Use a hand truck, or *gasp!* ask for help. To some ppl, the tone of a tube amp is so satisfying that they are willing to deal with the 1st world problems of moving heavy music gear in order to achieve it. If we find tube tone to be extremely satisfying for the relatively long period we hear it (vs the relative short period we move it) then we find ways to do it. If it is not important enough, we retreat into lighter gearspace. I use both tube amps, as well as small lightweight gear at different times. Depends on my mood, and the circumstances of the gig. I'm an old guy, and despite arthritis and a previously broken back, I will make the 1st world sacrifice of lifting a heavy load, in order to achieve my ideal tone on occasion. And yes, horror of it all, I have been known to occasionally (very rarely) change some tubes.

I couldn't agree more. Music is about what it sounds like.
And without tubes, guitars sound sterile and without magic.
It's too vast a difference to excuse away. I suggest buy a wheel cart.
They come with large wheels ( in the back, at least, so you can pull them backwards over a curb or up a stair or two).
You can even wheel your stuff across a lawn with good big fat wheels on a cart. Might cost up to $300 I suppose.
But what else you gonna do? Let the sound be inferior and say it "can't be helped"? *GASP* DON'T EVEN THINK IT!!

 

[Drgonzonm]

Another rant about 1/8 power ratings on class d amps.
We were practicing for two Halloween gigs. The BL class D shut off, while We were practicing. The venues have limited plugs so all the mics, the mandolin, one guitar, and kb were going to a mixing board then to the amp's xxlr.
We overloaded the power amp, so out comes a power strip and a scratchy tube amp.

 

[agedhorse]

Another rant about 1/8 power ratings on class d amps.
We were practicing for two Halloween gigs. The BL class D shut off, while We were practicing. The venues have limited plugs so all the mics, the mandolin, one guitar, and kb were going to a mixing board then to the amp's xxlr.
We overloaded the power amp, so out comes a power strip and a scratchy tube amp.

The whole 1/8 rated power duty cycle has nothing whatsoever to do with class D. It is purely a design choice, and safety agency approvals require a MINIMUM of 1/8-rated power duty cycle but NOTHING limits a designer to this.

Every class D amp I design will operate successfully well in excess of 1/8-rated power duty cycle. 2-3 times that In fact.

Now most designers include under voltage protection on the power supply to improve the reliability of the product. This too is not exclusive to class D, it have been included on many "lead sled" amps too, because it beats an amp failing rather than simply going into protect.

 

[seamonkey]

Another rant about 1/8 power ratings on class d amps.
We were practicing for two Halloween gigs. The BL class D shut off, while We were practicing. The venues have limited plugs so all the mics, the mandolin, one guitar, and kb were going to a mixing board then to the amp's xxlr.
We overloaded the power amp, so out comes a power strip and a scratchy tube amp.

Name names if you can. A poorly designed amplifier of any class shouldn't be setting the standards for all the other amps of the same class. There's good and bad amps in any class.

Now I've seen just the opposite. One place had us on the same circuit as a big freezer, and when it kicked on other amps and keyboards cut out. But not all of them - the main pattern was that newer gear and keyboards seemed to handle it better, including PCs.

 

[leadfootstudio]

ok guys. As generic of a topic as this is I have a big dilemma.

If you check my sig, you will see that I am a (proud) owner of Aguilar amps.

They sound great and all but yesterday I tried to hook up a fender bassman tube clone.

Wow! I couldn't believe the sound I was getting. Barefaced big twin 2 has a renown of being a cab that is able to pump monstrous lows, that are sometimes even hard to control. But with the clone, every low note has a clear and round, veery warm low end that doesn't extend over the limits. What surprised me even more is that every note I played, even on higher registers is still meaty and has a great low mid presence and just keeps on going and seamlessly blends with the low notes with zero volume difference.

My aguilar amps work great as well but there was an obvious and immediate difference in the sound the moment I plugged in.

I immediately felt groovier and a better bass player.

Should I go after an all tube amp? I never played a solidstate with a similar warmth and meat to the sound and I am starting to think I never will.

The bassman clone was 40w and I couldn't believe how loud it actually was.

The size of these amps is bugging me though.

Aguilar has made some great tube amps like the db 750... don't know if they have one in production at the moment though... also, there are some great vintage tube amps one can get into for little money... traynors are a great example... ampeg based part of the svt design on a traynor. the yba-3 is a great great tune amp that normally costs around 5-600 can$