• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Sound Guy From Hell!

B

BeastSternecker

Aug 5, 2013
114
0
#1
So, I was practicing for a district church even tonight. It's a rather large gathering, so it should be production quality.

I had to take my p-bass strung with flats because that was my only available bass.

After a few songs, he walked up to me and started complaining about my tone. I like dark tone. Nice and warm. I also like clarity in my tone so you can hear all the notes distinctly.

I tell him I have flats on my bass and I'll be bringing a different bass the night of. he doesn't know what flats are but he keeps asking me for brighter tone, even though I can't give him brighter tone.

He began to mess with the amp... And I mean mess. He turned the gain way up (all while I'm playing in a song) at this point I sound like an electric guitar and the amp is clipping.

I tell him my bass has a lot of mids and he says "I know, I'm going to get rid of them." He then turns my mids up all the way.

After messing with my near and dear tone, he turns to me and tells me he plays bass. He then begins to explain to me how I cannot go past my 5th fret on my A string.. I must play things that are lower. I hold myself to a very high standard with my bass playing. I'm not trying to boast, but I am a good bass player and I'll fill any role I need to.

At this point, I am getting fired up. I am also a very passive person, so I'll bite my tongue and play with horrible tone. The rest of the night, I played with "the best tone ever" (in his words)

Anyways, that's my story.

A
 
#4
You're way too kind. If I want to play with my tone as is and sound guy is getting in the way, it's gonna get ugly. Kindness goes away from me rather easily on those situations. Last week I even had my drummer play my bass for a while so I can go down stage an listen out front, and correct what ever I find not making justice to my tone. It sounded scooped to my ears, I told him to leave it flat please. He did, and my tone came right out.
 
#5
I help run sound at a solo guitar open mic, and I find it hard to find the right balance between giving advice and letting each person sound the way they want. It can be hard to disassociate yourself from what you think sounds good and what someone else wants. I ended up running the sound more out of no one else really wanting to, plus having some experience with it before.

I've had to learn that other people have different ears than mine. I had a couple of times where I may have come close to crossing the line, now I take the attitude of "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink". It still gets uncomfortable when someone moves the mic to where it feeds back, and they look at me to run across the room to fix it. In my opinion, every musician should learn basic sound reinforcement, but so many people would rather just be able to blame someone else for their bad sound.

But back to the sound guy at this church gig. He was way out of line, but you are partially to blame for not diplomatically sticking up for yourself. Having an opinion isn't the same thing as being confrontational. You just need to learn how to get what you want.
 
#8
Dude. If someone hiked my gain knob while I was playing I'd probably go all Mellowinman on them and crack some skulls. What a stupid cat. He's lucky he's not buying you new speakers.
 
#9
I do sound part-time and I have NEVER asked a musician to alter their sound for the mix, nor have I tried. A good sound person will bring you up and down during soundcheck to try to get a good mix and EQ of what sound/tone you are going for (regardless of what that sound should be), and try to make the best mix possible, as that's part of your sound. Any soundperson who pulls out the mids to get more bass doesn't know what they're doing. Period. That's where your definition comes from. If you want to hear more bass you boost the mids a bit, not pull them down. Gain will only make you louder or quieter; it regulates the input volume, hence the clipping or guitar tone you experienced.
That said, everyone has to learn somewhere. I just have a problem with people who don't know what they're doing claiming they know that they do. If you have no idea, be honest (not directed at the OP, but the OP's sound guy), and maybe someone will help you. Too many sound techs are too proud of themselves.
 
#10
BeastSternecker said:
So, I was practicing for a district church even tonight. It's a rather large gathering, so it should be production quality.

I had to take my p-bass strung with flats because that was my only available bass.

After a few songs, he walked up to me and started complaining about my tone. I like dark tone. Nice and warm. I also like clarity in my tone so you can hear all the notes distinctly.

I tell him I have flats on my bass and I'll be bringing a different bass the night of. he doesn't know what flats are but he keeps asking me for brighter tone, even though I can't give him brighter tone.

He began to mess with the amp... And I mean mess. He turned the gain way up (all while I'm playing in a song) at this point I sound like an electric guitar and the amp is clipping.

I tell him my bass has a lot of mids and he says "I know, I'm going to get rid of them." He then turns my mids up all the way.

After messing with my near and dear tone, he turns to me and tells me he plays bass. He then begins to explain to me how I cannot go past my 5th fret on my A string.. I must play things that are lower. I hold myself to a very high standard with my bass playing. I'm not trying to boast, but I am a good bass player and I'll fill any role I need to.

At this point, I am getting fired up. I am also a very passive person, so I'll bite my tongue and play with horrible tone. The rest of the night, I played with "the best tone ever" (in his words)

Anyways, that's my story.

A
Click to expand...

I'm not saying that this is the case in this instance, but I have heard P Basses at live shows that are just an absolutely indistinguishable muddy mess. I have resisted the urge to say something to the player each time but if they ask, I tell them the truth. The way a bass projects thru a PA and out in the audience thru a rig can be so different than what it seems like it sounds like from where we are standing on stage. The fact that you say you like your tone 'dark' is a red flag to me. If you like your tone super dark, then you might be xtra sensitive to highs and mids. Those frequencies can also make you feel as if your technique is under a microscope too if you are used to a dark tone. On the occasions when I have heard P-Basses sound almost indistinguishable, the tone knob was usually not up very high. I have a guy that sits in all the time so that I get to hear my basses out front. One thing I learned from this is that for the notes to really be articulate, at least on my 74' P, that tone knob needs to come up and mids and treble boosted a little. This gives me the best tone out front. Every bass is different, but maybe this dude really was making u sound better out front? He could have gone about it better...but he might just be helping u out. Just a thought.
 
#11
Wasn't he getting a pre-EQ feed from your amp? Then he could have manipulated that any way he wanted and simply had you turn down your stage volume a bit. I'm only to happy to work with a sound people to get what they want out front even if it means it sounds a little thin on stage but no one comes up and just resets my amp for me. There's only one pilot up there on stage and I'm it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WyreAndWood
#12
Oh wow I had similar experience in church except the soundguy wasn't a soundguy. It was just another bass player who thought he knew everything and dared touch my sansamp settings. I tore him a new one in front of everyone during soundcheck. He hasn't touched my stuff since. Do I feel bad?

Now that I look back, I kinda do, but someone mentioned kindness only gets you so far until they wear out your impatience. I was the John myung of our praise team until he totally crossed the line. I understand: touch the Soundboard. Touch your own amp and bass but never touch my stuff.
 
#13
It crosses the line when the sound guy starts fiddling with the knobs on your equipment without express prior permission. He can go play with his own knobs. Some dude does that to me, he gets one 'please don't do that' before I really let him know what I think.
It's not like they're taking a mic'd (and therefore post-EQ) tone from you anyways. If the sound of the bass sucks in the mains, it's because the sound guy doesn't know what to do with a clean unaltered bass tone. Then what kind of sound man is that?
 
#14
+1... a sound tech has more than enough knobs to fiddle with.

A good sound tech matches the sound he hears through his PA to what is coming out of the amp. Your band is practiced, rehearsed, and know what you want to hear. The sound tech should be an extension of that, making sure everyone is heard, and everyone can hear. Plus, most churches (except maybe city churches in a hall not designed for projection) are designed to carry the sound through. Just volume up and you should be able to carry and a half-competent sound tech should be able to mix around you. I do it all the time.
 
#15
sbass traveller said:
A good sound tech matches the sound he hears through his PA to what is coming out of the amp. Your band is practiced, rehearsed, and know what you want to hear. The sound tech should be an extension of that, making sure everyone is heard, and everyone can hear.
Click to expand...


Where you get that? A good sound tech makes not only the bass but the whole band to sound good in the FOH and let the player to do whatever he wants with his sign, the sound in the amp is base on whatever the player likes, that does not mean that this signal is the sound that is needed in FOH, if happens that the sound coming from the amp is good enough for the FOH then you can try to reproduce it, otherwise it belongs to the bass player only.

I run the sound in a church where we have 4 bass player, only one guy have an idea on how to run his gear and get a decent sound that fills the band, the other three guys does not even know how to use their amps, they keep tweaking the knobs in their amps and bass all service long looking for "their tone".

The sound guy does not do what your band wants unless you hired him, certainly is expected that he will communicate with the band and try to make to make them shine, just keep in mind that many sound guys also deal with many amateur musicians that think that because they spent thousands dollars in gears they know everything.
 
#19
Man, that sucks! I've had people fiddle with my amp controls without permission before when I'm playing, and it felt like someone coming up to me and re-buttoning my shirt or something.

I also once had a soundguy swap the lead into the DI box mid song, completely cutting all sound from the bass, as he thought the other one had 'higher fidelity'.

How do people who think you cut mids by boosting mids get a job as a sound engineer?
 
#20
It's one thing to want to adjust your tone - even at your amp - it's another to start ordering where you play, and to me that's the giveaway that this guy has some sort of issues around control. He's the sound guy, not the band leader.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back