Source Audio Zio Bass Preamp

[johnk_10]

Yeah I posted the same question a while back. I would love to see freq plots that illustrate exactly what the focus knob does through its full rotation. I don't think this info is publicly available at this point. That said, an HPF can be used with different goals in mind. 40Hz is a common set point for bass because most bass cabs can't do much of anything useful with freq below this. In the case of the Pultec trick that the Zio is partly inspired by, the HPF would be set around 60Hz while the bass is simultaneously boosted. Turn it up and try out a bunch of settings. If it sounds good, it is good.

it was posted on the previous page.

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[lomo]

it was posted on the previous page.

Yeah my bad I had forgotten-looks like 60Hz-not as versatile or designed to serve the same purpose for bass as a standalone variable HPF in most settings.

 

[Johno Dunn]

Got mine today, finally! I love it through my IE’s, which is the main reason I got it. I’ll have to play around with it some more through my live rig.

 

[PhatBottomBass1]

Without getting in over my head, but it kinda looks, to me, that some of those setting descriptions are extream?

ZIO Focus full CW = 300Hz that would appear to be a top of the potential intended effect of a HPF, to me.

The other settings are a bit jacked up to the extream interacting with the Focus as a snapshot?

I could be wrong but it looks like 60-100Hz is the lower end of the cut without boosting anything?

I was wondering how the Scoop with just a bit of Bass Boost and the HPF just shy of full CCW would work for my specific situation??

 

[Xad]

Ok, new plots for y'all, in case you're interested. Again, not official - I'm not affiliated with SA in any way. Running pink noise through the Zio, out via DI to my mixer, via USB to Logic Pro, using the SPAN plugin.

These are just, ah, focused on the Focus knob. First plot is with the pedal disengaged, so you know what OFF looks like, because, as you'll see "off" and "Bass fully CCW, Treble noon, Focus fully CCW" are not exactly the same.

In any event, you have Focus fully counterclockwise, Focus at 9 o'clock, Focus at noon, Focus at 3 o'clock, and Focus fully clockwise.

EDIT: Plots updated with new pink noise generator!

 

[mikeynets]

Can someone with experience with standalone HPFs compare and contrast how the FOCUS knob on the ZIO behaves vs a dedicated HPF? Are they typically hard shelves, or with the roll off at a different slope or focused on a different Hz band? Or do they come in every flavor, just like every other pedal?

 

[lomo]

Ok, new plots for y'all, in case you're interested. Again, not official - I'm not affiliated with SA in any way. Running pink noise through the Zio, out via DI to my mixer, via USB to Logic Pro, using the SPAN plugin.

These are just, ah, focused on the Focus knob. First plot is with the pedal disengaged, so you know what OFF looks like, because, as you'll see "off" and "Bass fully CCW, Treble noon, Focus fully CCW" are not exactly the same.

In any event, you have Focus fully counterclockwise, Focus at 9 o'clock, Focus at noon, Focus at 3 o'clock, and Focus fully clockwise.

Wunnerful thanks! It's as described....a cut below 60Hz that gets steeper as you turn in cw.I caved but won't lay ears on mine until the Feb 10. I hate to ask for more of your time... but if (and only if) this is fun for you (as opposed to a royal PITA) I'd love to see how it approximates the Pultec trick.....I'm guessing here but prolly something like: scoop engaged, grit off, bass, treble and focus all at noon.

 

[PhatBottomBass1]

Thanks for those extra shots!

Now I'm thinking Scoop ON, Bass boost just a tad, a bit of Treble cut with the Focus between full ccw and 7:30 - 8:00 with a nicely applied low grit setting to glue it all together!

*With new updated original plots...I'm going with the above as a starting point...

Gracias!

 

[Xad]

I might redo these plots -- there's clearly something a little weird about the pink noise generator I used. Using a different one might make things look a little cleaner/clearer. Please stand by

 

[Xad]

Ugh. Something got bumped. And now I can't edit the original post. So... here are the ACTUAL UPDATED PLOTS

 

[GRichards]

Thanks, Xad, for your work on the plots. It is visual confirmation of what I am hearing with the unit.

 

[lomo]

As Focus moves beyond 3 o'clock, it looks like there starts to be a significant drop even above 60Hz.....that'll be too much collateral damage for my ears-better from noon -3.

 

[Xad]

Wunnerful thanks! It's as described....a cut below 60Hz that gets steeper as you turn in cw.I caved but won't lay ears on mine until the Feb 10. I hate to ask for more of your time... but if (and only if) this is fun for you (as opposed to a royal PITA) I'd love to see how it approximates the Pultec trick.....I'm guessing here but prolly something like: scoop engaged, grit off, bass, treble and focus all at noon.

Here you go

Scoop is ON for all of these. One with everything at noon, and one that looks a little more Pultec-like to me

 

[PhatBottomBass1]

Ugh. Something got bumped. And now I can't edit the original post. So... here are the ACTUAL UPDATED PLOTS

Uh...yes, that's dramatically different...don't hurt yourself!

 

[Abe-of-Bass]

As Focus moves beyond 3 o'clock, it looks like there starts to be a significant drop even above 60Hz.....that'll be too much collateral damage for my ears-better from noon -3.

I think the key is that the Focus knob is designed to be used in conjunction with the bass knob. It's very unlikely that you'd ever want to use the focus knob that high with the bass flat, but if you crank the bass, turning up the focus can help you get a nice musical hump, without it getting boomy or muddy. I think I saw somewhere that a recommended starting point was having the bass and focus knobs turned to the same number, ie both at 3 o'clock, or noon, etc. By my ears this works pretty well and gives a fantastic sounding "special something" to the low end.

 

[shoepedals]

Hi guys.

Just to clear up some things about the Focus control:

It's a high pass filter (not a shelf), which has variable frequency and becomes less resonant as you turn up the knob/frequency.

At the lowest setting the cutoff frequency is about 20hz with a steeper curve. At the highest, it's about 120hz, but with a gentler curve.

For a filter, cutoff frequency is typically defined, as the point in the response curve where the signal is -3db compared to flat. This means that you do have between -3db and 0db above the cutoff frequency. It's a little counter-intuitive, but that's how filters are typically defined.

As stated earlier by a few people, it's correct that the idea is to combine this with the bass boost control to dial in the right balance in the low end for your instrument, mix, and playing environment.

The Pultec Low end is a little bit different. That's actually a combination of two shelf EQs (which have fixed frequencies, but variable levels of cut and boost). It doesn't actually have a high pass filter, technically, but it has a shelf cut. That shelving trick is more represented in the Bass knob by itself, here. When you turn up the boost and attenuation both on a pultec you get a curve that alao results in a bit of a low mid dip, which is what gives it the ability to boost a lot but remain clear.

Bass Zio's bass boost also does this, but in a single knob control. It both boosts bass and dips a little bit of the low mid mud out so that the boost remains more in the fundamentals region.

I did send over official frequency plots to the team at Source Audio, so we should be publishing those soon, I think.

 

[Zbysek]

I did send over official frequency plots to the team at Source Audio, so we should be publishing those soon, I think.

Thank you, they seem to be posted on the website

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Edit: the user's guide is very useful, thank you!

 

[lomo]

I did send over official frequency plots to the team at Source Audio, so we should be publishing those soon, I think.

10K mercis! Those graphs are extremely helpful. It looks as though the bass boost can simulate a Pultec trick pretty well on its' own, as can the scoop toggle. Are those 2 also interactive with one another? I'm even more eager to lay ears on mine. Fiddling with knobs to get a great sound is OK, but using an eq with non-traditional, interactive controls like this will be soooooo much easier, faster and more satisfying with some key knowledge, which is, after all, power

 

[shoepedals]

10K mercis! Those graphs are extremely helpful. It looks as though the bass boost can simulate a Pultec trick pretty well on its' own, as can the scoop toggle. Are those 2 also interactive with one another? I'm even more eager to lay ears on mine. Fiddling with knobs to get a great sound is OK, but using an eq with non-traditional, interactive controls like this will be soooooo much easier, faster and more satisfying with some key knowledge, which is, after all, power

Yes, exactly! I wanted to make it very easy to dial in that type of sound quickly without much fiddling.

The scoop is a fixed filter that is independent of the bass shelf (it's before the Grit stage in the circuit, while bass is after). Actually all of the controls are independent in what they do, but the frequency cutoff points of each control are carefully chosen so that parts of their curves overlap and they end up working together to produce the final curve, if that makes sense.

 

[PhatBottomBass1]

Yes, exactly! I wanted to make it very easy to dial in that type of sound quickly without much fiddling.

The scoop is a fixed filter that is independent of the bass shelf (it's before the Grit stage in the circuit, while bass is after). Actually all of the controls are independent in what they do, but the frequency cutoff points of each control are carefully chosen so that parts of their curves overlap and they end up working together to produce the final curve, if that makes sense.

Cheers,

So the Scoop will be slightly reduced in the high-end by the grit being applied AND can be further adjusted +/- with the Treble control BUT cannot be adjusted (+) by the Bass control?