• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Splitting the money questions (multi band show)

#21
DiabolusInMusic said:
You offered to do the work and now you want to get paid for it? Not cool in my books. Unless you were actually out money putting up posters and such, I would say no you are not entitled to more pay.

Now if you had called the replacement band and just said, will you do it for $50 and pocket the difference, while shady is not nearly as offensive, since they agreed to take the $50.
Click to expand...

Time is money friend. I put in between 6-8 hours of work between contacting bands, screening responses to ads, mocking up posters for approval, etc. Thats beyond weekly rehearsals and the time and effort it took to GET this gig in the first place.

But I see what you are saying. Everyone is on the gig "on spec" essentially, everyone has a new CD out and is trying to move units. I'll ask my singer who is working the bar directly. I'd almost be cool making the guarantee our take, then letting the other bands split the bar take. It all goes back into the band fund in any case, paying back for recording expenses and soon for tshirt printing, etc. We're not paying any bills with gig money :)
 
#22
If the other bands sign off on that arrangement that's one thing, if you don't tell them and they find out your band will get a bad reputation among other bands and never get recommended by them. Think ahead.
 
#23
You should make that clear to everyone involved if you are going to be the promoter and the band guy.
I do that sometimes, and everyone knows who is in charge night of show.
At the end of the night, I deal with the venue, get the cash, and distribute as I see fit, with my expenses coming off the top.
Usually something like $60 for flyers, $25 local ad in weekly paper, + 10% - 20% fee depending on the cash flow and if there are any touring bands on the bill.

I try to give the touring bands more money, and the local acts know that and are cool with it. If another band brings a lot of people, I will tell them that and give them more money. I

've been somewhat successful with this show promotion stuff, but I don't want to do it on a regular basis.
 
#24
hsech said:
If the other bands sign off on that arrangement that's one thing, if you don't tell them and they find out your band will get a bad reputation among other bands and never get recommended by them. Think ahead.
Click to expand...

yeah, I agree, want to do right by all involved, but also feeling like we are doing a lot more than just showing up and playing. Oh, and proving drum and bass cab backline.
 
#26
Surely the important thing is how the venue pay. So if they give you $100 +10% then as the organiser, you're under no compunction to tell the others. The band I am in has a band leader. and he does all the bookings and three of us get a wage, plus a bonus when it's a high paying gig - but he will sign the contract and take the risk. For instance, one gig we played came up short and he was left £300 out of pocket, yet on another gig, he may easily recoup that. As our gig fee is pretty good, we're all happy he can make lots more money than we do, as he does the extra work. With such a rubbish paid gig as your bar one, there is a danger that the other bands may consider you are taking them for a ride, if each band gets $30, and you keep the extra $10. If they are unhappy with the money, then they may well start to believe that the bar is paying you $200, and you are ripping them off. When the money is good, this is far less likely. My experience is that bad money gigs encourage the bands you book to cancel, and it back fires! also - low paid gigs often have organisers who simply share the money evenly, and then make the money side fully transparent - making the low pay something everyone can talk about. Secrecy, and envelopes being slipped into pockets quietly is very bad news.
 
#27
paulears said:
...Secrecy, and envelopes being slipped into pockets quietly is very bad news.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Pay is sometimes very specific to the cover/originals dichotomy. I've done both, and IME, Cover bands are professionals, providing a service, and are treated that way. Original bands are there "for the music" or the glory or the ass, whatever, rarely as a "service provider". For cover gigs, it would work as you outlined, but IME with cover gigs, the venue provides a lot of the draw, that is the place is known for having good bands, or hot bartenders, or cheap drinks.

Ideally all three :)

But the original scene the draw is different every night, so dependent on the bands involved. Club can get a reputation for only booking good bands, but that won't always account for the majority of butt in the venue on a given night.
 
#28
Not sure if this is applicable in your situation but my band takes the little about wed make in a split and we put it together and throw it in a Paypal account we created. We just keep throwing in there so eventually it'll help us pay for promotional stuff and CDs and so forth. It's a lot better than splitting $100 4 ways. I won't miss the $25 I'd get.
 
#29
gregmon79 said:
Not sure if this is applicable in your situation but my band takes the little about wed make in a split and we put it together and throw it in a Paypal account we created. We just keep throwing in there so eventually it'll help us pay for promotional stuff and CDs and so forth. It's a lot better than splitting $100 4 ways. I won't miss the $25 I'd get.
Click to expand...

yeah, thus far all gig money goes back into the band fund. I'm cash out of pocket for food, beers, and gas on the night.
 
#30
My Trio has played with some bigger name bands and it has always been an even split. Here the bar owners are the ones responsible for getting the word out. Last couple of times we have played with a bigger name blues review it has been an even split between the bands. The other band has an 8 piece band, we have a three piece band. It's still an even split. Maybe it's just central Iowa that does it that way or maybe it's the venue. If we did it any other way, it wouldn't be worth the gas money.
 
#31
Have you asked anyone else to help you with the promotion? Perhaps someone from one of the other bands? If you have decided you are going to do it all without at least asking for help then it should be an even split if you don't give anyone else a chance to help in the promotion.
 
#33
re: bigger versus smaller bands- Interesting, thanks.
re: Asking for help- Just asked them to get people out, so we shall see. FWIW, the bar is going through us on these other bands, treating us as the de facto promoters.

Its probably going to end up an even split at this late stage in the game, but if we are asked to fill a bill like this in the future, we may tell the club upfront that we need a guarantee to fill the bill, then performance revenue on the night. And let the other bands know this up front.
 
#34
Ender_rpm said:
yeah, thus far all gig money goes back into the band fund. I'm cash out of pocket for food, beers, and gas on the night.
Click to expand...

$180 split by 3 bands is only $60. $60 split by 4 band members is only $15. About how much do you spend on gas, food and beer - are you spending more than you make? This (if any) isn’t much better than "pay to play" - do you really NEED the other two bands, or could your band do the gig alone?
 
#35
Joe Louvar said:
$180 split by 3 bands is only $60. $60 split by 4 band members is only $15. About how much do you spend on gas, food and beer - are you spending more than you make? This (if any) isn’t much better than "pay to play" - do you really NEED the other two bands, or could your band do the gig alone?
Click to expand...

We have about a solid hour of originals, and maybe another half hour of covers. We all want to do original music, so it is what it is.

Heck even on a cover gig at $100 per guy I'd barely break even after covering the wife's bar tab :)
 
#36
Joe Louvar said:
Bands should do all they can - but it's the bars job to get them there and the bands job to keep them there - if you want more money don't take it from the bands - get it from the bar.

Please don't support a race to the bottom - and instead help bring the pay scale back up again. Thanks
Click to expand...

/\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ AND MORE THIS /\/\/\/\/\

Sounds pretty obvious the venues have spotted the suckers in the crowd. Do the Booking Agent's job of finding acts to fit the bill for free. Do the Venues job of promoting the venue & the event for free. Then short change the other acts to make up for all the extra work.

Oh yeah, that's a real good plan! And if you continue to do it long enough eventually each band can just walk up to the venue owner at the beginning of their set and hand him/her a $100 for the privilege of playing the venue. That is of course as long as the bands continue to provide the clientele for the venue as well.
 
#37
smogg said:
/\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ AND MORE THIS /\/\/\/\/\

Sounds pretty obvious the venues have spotted the suckers in the crowd. Do the Booking Agent's job of finding acts to fit the bill for free. Do the Venues job of promoting the venue & the event for free. Then short change the other acts to make up for all the extra work.

Oh yeah, that's a real good plan! And if you continue to do it long enough eventually each band can just walk up to the venue owner at the beginning of their set and hand him/her a $100 for the privilege of playing the venue. That is of course as long as the bands continue to provide the clientele for the venue as well.
Click to expand...

Despite the obvious sarcasm, I get what you are saying. But I have to disagree on one thing: The era of a club promoting EVERY show, if it ever existed, is over. People buy the Washington Post for news, not for the going out section. In DC anyway there is no one place or even a combination of places a venue can advertise. So, it IS up to the bands to create the scene, promote the scene, and hopefully, sustain the scene. Most of the places we work with have FB pages, twitter accounts, and websites, but there is no one "club district", they are diffused over the metropolitan area.

And the Booking Agents fees have ALWAYS come out of the bands take, on the understanding that a good Booking Agent will get you more, and higher profile, gigs. We're performing that service for the other bands, on the understanding that if we ALL bring people we ALL make money.
 
#38
smogg said:
/\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ THIS /\/\/\/\/\ AND MORE THIS /\/\/\/\/\

Sounds pretty obvious the venues have spotted the suckers in the crowd. Do the Booking Agent's job of finding acts to fit the bill for free. Do the Venues job of promoting the venue & the event for free. Then short change the other acts to make up for all the extra work.

Oh yeah, that's a real good plan! And if you continue to do it long enough eventually each band can just walk up to the venue owner at the beginning of their set and hand him/her a $100 for the privilege of playing the venue. That is of course as long as the bands continue to provide the clientele for the venue as well.
Click to expand...

+100%. Yep.
 
#39
Promoting the venue is the venues responsibility, just like any other business out there. Promoting the event is the responsibility of both parties, the venue and the band (s). Promoting the band is the bands responsibility.

Businesses that don't advertise in their given market eventually fail. Does not matter if they are selling booze or selling burgers. The mindset of nickel and dimming those below can only lead to an eventual collapse.

Deal with reputable businesses that know and do their part & be a reputable business and do your part and you should succeed. Buying into the "oh the poor poor venue owner has no way to advertise his business in a cost effective manner" is just hog wash in my experience.

I do truly wish you the best of luck though. :)

Ender_rpm said:
Despite the obvious sarcasm, I get what you are saying. But I have to disagree on one thing: The era of a club promoting EVERY show, if it ever existed, is over. People buy the Washington Post for news, not for the going out section. In DC anyway there is no one place or even a combination of places a venue can advertise. So, it IS up to the bands to create the scene, promote the scene, and hopefully, sustain the scene. Most of the places we work with have FB pages, twitter accounts, and websites, but there is no one "club district", they are diffused over the metropolitan area.

And the Booking Agents fees have ALWAYS come out of the bands take, on the understanding that a good Booking Agent will get you more, and higher profile, gigs. We're performing that service for the other bands, on the understanding that if we ALL bring people we ALL make money.
Click to expand...
 
#40
Ender_rpm said:
Time is money friend. I put in between 6-8 hours of work between contacting bands, screening responses to ads, mocking up posters for approval, etc. Thats beyond weekly rehearsals and the time and effort it took to GET this gig in the first place.

But I see what you are saying. Everyone is on the gig "on spec" essentially, everyone has a new CD out and is trying to move units. I'll ask my singer who is working the bar directly. I'd almost be cool making the guarantee our take, then letting the other bands split the bar take. It all goes back into the band fund in any case, paying back for recording expenses and soon for tshirt printing, etc. We're not paying any bills with gig money :)
Click to expand...

I agree that time is money but if somebody offers to do something they cannot turn around and charge for it; If they knew they had to pay the other party might not have agreed to it.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back