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Standard Tuning vs Half Step Down

I've never understood this need for everyone in the band to play in the same tuning. Its a completely alien concept to me.

The key of the song is the key of the song. Its up to each individual bandmember to then play the right notes in the right place at the right time regardless of whether they're tuned to Eb or E or drop D or whatever.

You should just tune your bass to whatever it needs to be tuned to in order to best get through the set. In your case that sounds like Eb.

This may be the wrong place but help me please. I don't understand drop tuning. I get the capo thing for guitar players but bass players ? I may be old school and mean no disrespect but I just play it in the key if its Bb I play in Bb help me to understand

I don't get it. If the guitars and/or bass want to tune a half step down then go ahead and do it. A "middle-C" is a middle-C, no matter what instrument, no matter where on that instrument it's played. Uncle Psychosis (above) has it right.

There are two ways to proceed when you retune. You all seem to have one of them in mind and that one is retune, relearn your fingerboard, and then play a C when a C is called for. This is what I did when I retuned my bass in fifths, CGDA. I can play any song with the rest of the band because we are all playing a C when a C is called for.

Many people do it another way however. They retune and then continue to play all their songs the way they always have, ignoring the fact that their instruments now play some other note than a C when they play a C. They do not relearn their fingerboards. If you take this approach then either everyone in the band must retune the same way or the holdouts now have to transpose their music. And then of course the holdouts now have to relearn the transposed music. This is frequently the reason why whole bands want to tune the same way. But the other reasons given here are often true too.

This second approach may seem silly but in fact many band and orchestral instruments play a pitch other than the one noted on the music they play. Such instruments are called transposing instruments and bass guitars are transposing instruments already. It is relatively uncommon for bass guitar parts to be written out in standard notation but when they are they are written an octave higher that the notes that are actually sounded. An octave is a trivial transposition to make, of course. Most clarinets are tuned to Bb or A, they sound a whole step or three half steps lower than the notes written in their music, for example. That, like a drop tuned guitar, forces a non-trivial transposition if everyone is to play a C when a C is called for. Give a Bb clarinetist a sheet of music written for the non-transposing instruments in the band and he or she will have to imagine that every note is written one whole step higher and that the key signature has two more sharps or two less flats than it actually has. So there is precedent for this approach, odd as it seems.
 
As a bass player I have probably the least input in the band with respect to what key we choose. Well, OK... maybe more input than the drummer and the cute tambourine girl. :)

Vocalists usually trump everyone if the song is out of their range. Lots of bands down-tune just to make it slightly easier on the vocalist. Horn, reed, and traditional piano/organ players probably get the next say since transposing via tuning isn't really possible for those instruments, and some keys can get nasty for them. Guitarists after that (although transposing up a few steps via capo is trivial). Then bass players and electronic keyboard players.

So, as a bass player, just get used to playing in the key others agree to, and never get hung up on memorized positions. If your song depends on an open-string bass riff (lots of slap riffs come to mind), then you either re-tune (easy for Eb or F), come up with a different bass line (great unless it's a classic bass line that everyone expects), see if a 5-string makes things easier, or as a last resort explain to the band why the bass part will suck in that key. Most people are willing to compromise if they understand that your objection is legitimate.

But the argument that it's "odd" to play on the 4th, 6th, or 8th frets is bogus, IMO. You won't convince anyone if that's your gripe. ;)
 
I've played in bands with keyboards that liked writing in e flat. I just bust out my other bass that is detuned so I can get super funky with open string, or my fiver if it's a mellow tune. I've played in cover bands that dropped half a step to help the singer. I just practice with an app that drops or raises the recording to my tuning. If a keyboardist is complaining about playing in the original key it is most likely because they don't have the tools to practice with the recordings any other way.
 
As a bass player I have probably the least input in the band with respect to what key we choose. Well, OK... maybe more input than the drummer and the cute tambourine girl. :)

Vocalists usually trump everyone if the song is out of their range. Lots of bands down-tune just to make it slightly easier on the vocalist. Horn, reed, and traditional piano/organ players probably get the next say since transposing via tuning isn't really possible for those instruments, and some keys can get nasty for them. Guitarists after that (although transposing up a few steps via capo is trivial). Then bass players and electronic keyboard players.

So, as a bass player, just get used to playing in the key others agree to, and never get hung up on memorized positions. If your song depends on an open-string bass riff (lots of slap riffs come to mind), then you either re-tune (easy for Eb or F), come up with a different bass line (great unless it's a classic bass line that everyone expects), see if a 5-string makes things easier, or as a last resort explain to the band why the bass part will suck in that key. Most people are willing to compromise if they understand that your objection is legitimate.

But the argument that it's "odd" to play on the 4th, 6th, or 8th frets is bogus, IMO. You won't convince anyone if that's your gripe. ;)

I totally agree! Most times I find the color of a song is not the same when the key is changed. Songs are written in the key they are for a reason. Again no right or wrong I am just trying to understand.
Rock on Dudes
 
I have been on both sides of the argument. I always go for what makes the best sense for the band. I prefer to play every thing down a half step and then for new rock stuff that is actually in C play it up a half step so that you aren't changing guitars every time you want to change the setlist.
I hate doing a bass change mid-set.
I personally don't think a rock crowd cares if the song is off half a step. If they did they would be upset that many of their favorite bands do the same thing live.
I actually was in a band once that transposed "You shook me all night long" 4 steps down so the singer can sing it and people still danced.
 
BTW: If you downtune, you really should re-setup your bass for it.

Quick related question....I know guitarists don't like down tuning because of tremolo bars and messing up their set ups...what's the reason for bass players needing to have a different set up for down tuning?

For me, I play with really low action, and if I drop down a half step the neck flattens out a bit more and I'm hit with major fret buzz.
 
BTW: If you downtune, you really should re-setup your bass for it.



Quick related question....I know guitarists don't like down tuning because of tremolo bars and messing up their set ups...what's the reason for bass players needing to have a different set up for down tuning?


If you loosen the strings, you need to "tighten" the truss rod to keep the neck at the same relief.
 
We use standard tuning live but I usually keep a practice bass tuned a half step down to play with records that were recorded originally a half step down. Songs that were normally 1/2 step down we just play in standard E. Never had a complaint from the peanut gallery. After doing the cover band thing for many years ........if you have to change the key to accommodate the singer then maybe you are better off just selecting another song that's in the wheelhouse .......there are hundreds of them instead of trying to force it to work.