Hey, I like that dead crab on the bottom the most! He has a custom etched and hand painted shell.
-Frank
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Starting a pedal company, suggestions?
- Thread starter crockb
- Start date
Hey, I like that dead crab on the bottom the most! He has a custom etched and hand painted shell.
-Frank
father of fires
Commercial User
I have put a lot of thought into this subject at different points in my life. I got into DIY to fill a passion for tinkering but every time I build something I like to imagine I'm designing for a large scale production run. I try to satisy as many imaginary customers as possible. I ultimately get frustrated and put the iron down for a while until I come up with another idea and the process starts all over again. I am in no way trying to start a pedal company but if I ever design something I like more that what's currently available then I'd be happy to offer it for sale.
The problem is, is that everything is already on the market. Scrappy DIYers turned pedal makers ain't gonna scratch the surface. You really need to think of the marketing and selling aspect as your "business". Pedal building is secondary.
But...if you just want to built simple solid designs and refuse to compromise then you may have some luck. The problem is, is that less scrupulous builders will capture the attention of buyers with mojo ad copy and cheaper builds/prices.
What you really need is a famous friend who can use your pedals on their album/tour.
The problem is, is that everything is already on the market. Scrappy DIYers turned pedal makers ain't gonna scratch the surface. You really need to think of the marketing and selling aspect as your "business". Pedal building is secondary.
But...if you just want to built simple solid designs and refuse to compromise then you may have some luck. The problem is, is that less scrupulous builders will capture the attention of buyers with mojo ad copy and cheaper builds/prices.
What you really need is a famous friend who can use your pedals on their album/tour.
father of fires
Commercial User
I actually gave up on the "building pedals for sale" idea recently but I had a builder that I respect egg me on. He basically said if you build a good product they will come. Try not to worry about the **** on the market.
I guess he's right. I know if I were to make a go at it I would make my customers as informed as possible. I would try to cut through the BS marketing and explain what my pedals were and what they weren't. An informed customer is the best customer even if they don't buy anything from you they'll have good things to say and there will be one less fool for the crap makers to dupe.
I guess he's right. I know if I were to make a go at it I would make my customers as informed as possible. I would try to cut through the BS marketing and explain what my pedals were and what they weren't. An informed customer is the best customer even if they don't buy anything from you they'll have good things to say and there will be one less fool for the crap makers to dupe.
i'm sure this thread will get overwhelming for the OP- many points of view, many will contrast, ext.
so i'll just repeat other peoples ideas that i agree with
-octave pedals. a really good sounding -1, clean, +1,+2, all with independent volume controls would be sick. good tracking and a musical sound, a warm natural sound, not a digital icepick. i'd buy one. who else??
-filters. its true, there are never enough in the world. keep an eye on what pedals have become popular, give respect to the classics, but be unique!
-even though i will contradict myself here, you SHOULD build your take on a good fuzz. there are many suggestions above as to what that would be. i just dont like hearing of new pedal companies, and going to their webpage (willing to spend money on products i like!) to find nothing but two generic sounding dirt pedals and a clean boost. that said, if you're a self-respecting pedal builder, whats you're fuzz? my own tip on the fuzz (and again, im sure this exists all over the place) is something with a clean blend, and a switch to effect the low end of the fuzz itself. blending a clean signal with a not to bassy fuzz is cool, but also having a 100% wet signal and loosing no low end. also, this would be a fuzz for guitar players too.
-synth. yeah i said this already, but for me- a big fan of synths- the only one i ever used happily was the Korg G5. i would gladly buy another if the time ever came. the EHX is too hard to actually use at a gig. the deep impact is very cool, and does have its moments, but on the whole is a cheep digital sounding pedal. the markbass doesn't seem to have gained much popularity, though i hardly used it. chunk systems octavius had huge hype and now i dont ever hear about it.
and more importantly, when can we expect to see your products available for purchase? us TBers are quite impatient..
so i'll just repeat other peoples ideas that i agree with
-octave pedals. a really good sounding -1, clean, +1,+2, all with independent volume controls would be sick. good tracking and a musical sound, a warm natural sound, not a digital icepick. i'd buy one. who else??
-filters. its true, there are never enough in the world. keep an eye on what pedals have become popular, give respect to the classics, but be unique!
-even though i will contradict myself here, you SHOULD build your take on a good fuzz. there are many suggestions above as to what that would be. i just dont like hearing of new pedal companies, and going to their webpage (willing to spend money on products i like!) to find nothing but two generic sounding dirt pedals and a clean boost. that said, if you're a self-respecting pedal builder, whats you're fuzz? my own tip on the fuzz (and again, im sure this exists all over the place) is something with a clean blend, and a switch to effect the low end of the fuzz itself. blending a clean signal with a not to bassy fuzz is cool, but also having a 100% wet signal and loosing no low end. also, this would be a fuzz for guitar players too.
-synth. yeah i said this already, but for me- a big fan of synths- the only one i ever used happily was the Korg G5. i would gladly buy another if the time ever came. the EHX is too hard to actually use at a gig. the deep impact is very cool, and does have its moments, but on the whole is a cheep digital sounding pedal. the markbass doesn't seem to have gained much popularity, though i hardly used it. chunk systems octavius had huge hype and now i dont ever hear about it.
and more importantly, when can we expect to see your products available for purchase? us TBers are quite impatient..
i want a good bass octave fuzz. r u going to "sponsor" bands? because i like my own signature octave fuzz pedal. and what i mean by sponsor is my band doesn't want free pedals. we just want our name on your pedals website saying we use our signature pedals. we'll pay full price for our sig gear like everyone else. right now we got a new drum, so we're practicing our songs and soon will be gigging and get a bigger presence on the internet.
Along the lines of what MM said ... What's one pedal you can make better than anyone else can? Make that.
You can also be innovative not only by the sound of your pedal but by the way they fit "well" together. Maybe propose a pedal board with an integrated power supply (or with phantom power coming from your amp), with a cover or bag, where you simply "snap" your individual pedals and they become a growing "multi-effect" unit.
Maybe a master pedal with phantom power, in, out, and presets for your indiviudal pedals.
Maybe a master pedal with phantom power, in, out, and presets for your indiviudal pedals.
Pay attention to details. Aesthetic matters to a lot of people and I personally like companies that have some kind of leitmotif in their graphics/etching (ie EQD or Iron Ether).
Also, it'd be cool to have a video or some samples for each pedal on the company's website, once the whole thing starts to get real. I know every bass/amp/hand is different, but I hate it when I find new pedals browsing around and can't get an idea of how they sounds.
Best whishes for the future!
Also, it'd be cool to have a video or some samples for each pedal on the company's website, once the whole thing starts to get real. I know every bass/amp/hand is different, but I hate it when I find new pedals browsing around and can't get an idea of how they sounds.
Best whishes for the future!
I don't know if you could ever really count me as "in" but I just got out of that game. I build pedals as a hobby and never really intended to start a business per se, but a couple of years ago I found myself building about as many pedals as I could handle in small runs (and I even built a few for Fuzzrocious when Ryan was getting geared up).
I stumbled upon a few really great sounds but I second the comment encouraging you to find your niche and excel there rather than trying to be all things to all people. I appreciated the enthusiasm that people had about my pedals, but I would get all sorts of custom requests or requests to change something about a design that was really the heart of the sound of the pedal in the first place. Some of that was helpful product development, and in the end I tried my best within reason to accommodate, but sometimes it was just a distraction and the person would have been happier with another pedal anyway.
For instance, I'm not a chorus guy. Never have been, never will be. When asked by several folks to build a chorus I would inevitably send them to someone else because I knew my heart just wasn't in it and I wasn't going to build a GREAT chorus, I was just going to build another chorus.
Do your market research, but at the end of the day ask yourself what YOU want to build.
Also, +1 on almost all of the CS advice in this thread. Realistic wait times, clear answers, and good correspondence go a long way in building your business. I've seen great products rise and fall under the weight of poor management.
I stumbled upon a few really great sounds but I second the comment encouraging you to find your niche and excel there rather than trying to be all things to all people. I appreciated the enthusiasm that people had about my pedals, but I would get all sorts of custom requests or requests to change something about a design that was really the heart of the sound of the pedal in the first place. Some of that was helpful product development, and in the end I tried my best within reason to accommodate, but sometimes it was just a distraction and the person would have been happier with another pedal anyway.
For instance, I'm not a chorus guy. Never have been, never will be. When asked by several folks to build a chorus I would inevitably send them to someone else because I knew my heart just wasn't in it and I wasn't going to build a GREAT chorus, I was just going to build another chorus.
Do your market research, but at the end of the day ask yourself what YOU want to build.
Also, +1 on almost all of the CS advice in this thread. Realistic wait times, clear answers, and good correspondence go a long way in building your business. I've seen great products rise and fall under the weight of poor management.
My feeling is that there is (almost) always room at the very top end of the market (i.e. the boutique zone) for truly top-quality, thoroughly amazing stuff. If your gear really is "all that", you can charge top dollar for it - and get it. And you won't have much competition either. Just don't expect to move large quantities of merchandise, as your customer base will likely be small (yet top crust) as well, i.e. well informed, highly knowledgeable, experienced players who are very discriminating, are willing to pay for quality, and who know just what they want. The big question here is usually: "How do I scale up enough to actually bring in a good income?" Often times, the business model just doesn't scale up. (Think: Neiman Marcus)
There is often room at the very bottom as well. But there the dynamics are completely reversed. At the bottom, nobody competes on quality, everybody competes on price. The name of the game is cutting costs enough to maximize one's profit margin - and to undercut one's rivals. The competition is utterly cutthroat. These are shark-filled waters. (Think: Walmart)
It's the middle of the market that's the real no-man's land, as it's almost impossible to distinguish yourself there - you're neither the highest-quality vendor, nor are you the most cost-effective one. Unless you find a way to set yourself apart enough to attract a customer base - before the start-up capital gets used up - you'll get completely lost in the shuffle. (Think: Macy's)
MM
A variable crossover/mixer with send/return on the high frequency part?
In a tiny box, of course.
(The idea here is to not apply effects to the low end)
This^^^
I will add something to this as a fan of builders in the boutique world. The ONLY thing we don't need is more people opening up shop that don't actually understand how to build. There are a TON of "builders" running around out there that probably don't even know how to use a multimeter. So as long as you're not one of them, you'll do fine.
Clones are going to happen on some level. Everything is a clone at a certain point, so I don't really care about that. We don't need anymore OD's or muffs. We need more aggressive fuzz pedals and filters. I can't count how many filters I've owned and thought "meh", maybe I'm picky, but I still haven't found one worth my time. So yea. Make one.
Clones are going to happen on some level. Everything is a clone at a certain point, so I don't really care about that. We don't need anymore OD's or muffs. We need more aggressive fuzz pedals and filters. I can't count how many filters I've owned and thought "meh", maybe I'm picky, but I still haven't found one worth my time. So yea. Make one.
I only have 2 words of advice. I worked for Analog Man a few summers ago. First and foremost surround yourself with solid, honest people. AM has a backlog of about a 8-9 months of their King of Tone pedal. Make something to compete with that and you may sell a ton of them.
Thanks, bongo--you're definitelty the guy to go to about pedal info, but IME every chorus pedal I've used had a "level" knob, none of the phasers I've used have. I dig the Phase 90, for example, but it gives way too much of a boost to be remotely subtle. My MXR Analog Chorus, though, while it's not my favorite, can at least be tamed with a knob twist. Maybe there are some design nuances I'm missing as just a user, not a builder, but that's my experience.
Anyway, back to the OP: throw me into the pool of names that would gladly test stuff out (not in the I-want-stuff-for-free kind of way, but in the unbiased-3rd-party-who-would-return-the-stuff way).
Ric5
Inactive
- Jan 29, 2008
- 29,772
- 30,452
- Disclosures
- I like 5, 8, 10, and 12 string basses
Here's an idea ...
A distortion pedal that only distorts highs and mids while leaving a nice clean full bottom on the bass tone. Maybe have a knob that will vary the frequency cutoff point. And maybe a low end boost to the signal as well. This way a bass player could play with distortion and not have the bottom drop out or the low notes fart out.
The electronics should be fairly simple.
A distortion pedal that only distorts highs and mids while leaving a nice clean full bottom on the bass tone. Maybe have a knob that will vary the frequency cutoff point. And maybe a low end boost to the signal as well. This way a bass player could play with distortion and not have the bottom drop out or the low notes fart out.
The electronics should be fairly simple.
