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Starting to learn scales. Help!

H

halarryus

Feb 27, 2011
11
0
#1
I've been playing for a few years now and I'm pretty much completely self taught. I'm an alright bass player, I make my own bass lines and I've learned little show off bass lines from Primus and RHCP's, but I know very little when it comes to music theory. I want to start learning scales, but I have absolutely no idea where to start. What scales should I learn? How should I approach them? Should I always start on the root? What the hell are modes? What's first position or second position? I'm so lost. Please help!

Also, I've recently learned how to properly practice so I need any advice about using a metronome and stuff like that.

Thanks alot :D
 
#3
halarryus said:
I want to start learning scales, but I have absolutely no idea where to start.
Click to expand...

You've already started by asking the question. A few lessons with any good teacher (piano, guitar, horn...this isn't bass specific) will do wonders for getting the doors to open.

As you go through this process always keep in mind that scales are not the be all, end all. Chords are just as (if not more) important to understand.....it's all related so don't get stuck on any one thing too much.

In the meantime start with a C major scale and arpeggio.
 
#4
halarryus said:
I want to start learning scales, but I have absolutely no idea where to start. What scales should I learn? How should I approach them? Should I always start on the root? What the hell are modes? What's first position or second position? I'm so lost. Please help!

Also, I've recently learned how to properly practice so I need any advice about using a metronome and stuff like that.

Thanks alot :D
Click to expand...
Here is a cheat sheet.
Bass Patterns based upon the Major Scale box.

Major Scale Box.

G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string


Scales
Major Pentatonic = R-2-3-5-6
Minor Pentatonic = R-b3-4-5-b7
Blues = R-b3-4-b5-5-b7
Major Scale = R-2-3-4-5-6-7
Natural Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-b6-b7
Harmonic Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-b6-7
Melodic Minor Scale = R-2-b3-4-5-6-7

What are modes? Moods of the major scale. Now IMHO - If you are not getting lead break solos you don't need modes. Chord tones for accompaniment, scales and modes for soloing. Scales and modes are a rite of passage thing, you need to know about them so you can talk to other musicians. So yes learn how to make them. How to use them is another story...... there is not a lot of use for them in what I do. Again IMHO. For the lead electric guitar modes fill a need. Here is my take on modes.

Major modes
Ionian same as the Major Scale. Ionian is said to give an attractive up beat mood.
Lydian use the major scale and sharp the 4 - yes, it’s that simple. Gives a day dreamy mood.
Mixolydian use the major scale and flat the 7. Gives a Latin mood, I hear Mexican. Used with dominant seven blues.

Minor Modes
Aeolian same as the Natural Minor scale. Gives a startled perhaps sad mood.
Dorian use the Natural Minor scale and sharp the b6 back to a natural 6. Gives an attractive jazz mood.
Phrygian use the Natural Minor scale and flat the 2. Gives an exotic Spanish mood. Choice of Metal.
Locrian use the Natural Minor scale and flat the 2 and the 5. Gives a dark and tense mood.
Should mention none of those moods will develop unless you are playing the correct chords under the mode notes. A long story best taken up on another string.

Which should you learn? Major and the natural minor plus the major and minor pentatonic are the normal ones people put to memory. I use scales to warm up by and they did help me learn where the notes are on the fretboard, however, I seldom use any scales beyond the major and minor pentatonic. Why? I don't get lead solos and I don't play melodic. So chord tones (R-3-5-b7 or whatever) are more important to me than scales. I've put chord tones into muscle memory and use my favorite ones much the same way others use scale patterns. Many follow the chords and use only chord tone notes for their solo work. Your decision do what is best for you.

Should I always start on the root. For accompaniment and chord tone work you can not go too wrong having the root on the first beat. Why? Part of our job is to call attention to the chord being used in the song. Playing the root first does that. However, that is a problem with scales. We run them in scale order and guess what they sound like - scale exercises. So the answer to that is no use the notes of the scale to make melodic phrases. Which notes? The ones that sound good with the lyrics - I know that did not answer your question. This gets into melody and which notes to use and that too is a long story.

First and second positions - to me this means where you find the notes. First position is the first 4 frets of the fingerboard. There may be other definitions.

Metronome - I'll leave this to others. I sing the song under my breath with the vocalist so the vocalist is my metronome. This is not the correct thing to do, however, when the vocalist is the wife of the director it insures job security. If I follow her lead she is happy. In another jamming band I belong to everyone is jamming - no sheet music in site so here again the vocalist is the metronome. If you will be playing from standard notation or with others that are following the standard notation sheet music the metronome is a must and you need to know how to use it.

Good luck.
 
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#5
A scale is a group of notes put together in a specific order. So, learn the order, what the scale sounds like, and how to play it. Just being able to finger a scale is not at all the same as KNOWING it!! You have to own the diatonic major scale before any of the other stuff (pentatonics, harmony, modes) make any useful sense.

So, you need to know:

1. The formula- W W H W W W H
2. How to build it in any key with the correct enharmonics- that is you know not only that the key of D has a C#, but why it's C# and not Db.
3. How it sounds- when you play it you need to know how the next note sounds BEFORE you play it.
4. How to play it over at least two octaves ascending and descending.

That's what you need to learn, so how to go about it?

1. Memorize these two bits- the whole step/half-step formula (W W H W W W H) and that in the key of C there are no sharps or flats.
2. From those two memorized bits, it follows that there's a half-step between E natural and F natural, and a half-step between B natural and C natural.
3. From the only two things you need to memorize and what you learned in step 2, you can sit down with paper and work out the notes in all the other keys. Start at A and apply the formula-
3 a. Write out all the letters for the note names A B C D E F G A
3 b. Figure out the whole steps and half steps A (W) B (W) C (H) D (W) E (W) F (W) G (H) A
3 c. Work out from 1 and 2 where to put sharps or flats (not both)
A to B is a whole step, so no changes needed; B to C is a half step but the formula requires a whole step, so we move from C to C# (can't be Db because we have to use the letter C first); C# to D is a half step so we're OK; D to E is a whole step as the formula requires, we're OK; E to F is a half-step but we need a whole step, so we move to F#; F# to G is only a half-step and we need another whole step, so move to G#; G# to A is a half step, which is what we need so we're OK, and we've gotten back to our starting point. That's WHY the key of A has three sharps, and they're C#, F#, and G#; so the A major scale is A B C# D E F# G# A. Work this out for all 12 keys.
4. Find the notes on the fingerboard over two octaves at least. As you play the scale (ascending and descending), sing the note names before you play the note. So for the key of G you'd play sing "G", hit the note, then sing "A", hit that note, etc. Don't stay locked into one position, because you need to be able to play music along the whole neck.

Note that only step 4 has anything to do with physically playing the instrument, and it's the absolute LEAST important part of "knowing" a scale. After you know how to do this with a couple of keys, it becomes a lot faster because you'll have the sound in your head, your fingers will start to recognize the common patterns, and you'll be able to say the notes faster from practice.

After learning the diatonic major scale (and I don't mean memorizing all 12 keys- there are still some keys I have to take a second and work out the notes for quickly in my head because I don't play in Db or F# very often), then start to learn basic chordal theory. Two main ways to look at chords, both of which require you own the major scale...

A. Learning chords from the scale of the root of the chord- the easiest and quickest way to get into how to build specific chords. This is stuff like learning a major chord is 1 3 5, a minor is 1 b3 5, a 7th is 1 3 5 b7, etc. Get a good music theory book and study this, but also work out the fingerings for the chords (not strummed, but played one note at a time- arpeggios). I recommend Edly's Music Theory for Practical People ([Invalid or Expired Link Removed])
B. The harmonized scale- if you stack every other note from the major scale you'll get seven different four-note chords. Because they come from the same formula, no matter what key you're in the NATURE of the seven chords is always the same. This is vital because it's how chords go together and create harmony- and our job is to define the harmony.

Only after you really understand the major scale and know basic chord construction, does it make any sense to even think about modes. And you'll find that most of the modal applications that are taught are already covered in chords.

Search through the theory forum for recurring threads about how to learn theory, the progression of theory, why or why not to deal with modes, and how to put it all together. Malcom Amos, Chris K, and Mambo4 (among others) have excellent and well-written posts all over the place for the last few years that will help you tremendously.

Have fun with this! It's a blast, and you should enjoy the journey as well as the destination.

John


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