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Double Bass String Length

There are a lot of different thoughts on string length and string instruments. While we are all familiar with the violin family and the debate about whether or not the double bass is a part of it or not, there are other string instruments out there as well that explore the difference in string length and body size in relation to pitch. The viol family debatably has seven different sizes from the pardessus which is about the same size as a violin with a high g string (which would be a minor third above the open e of a violin) and the bottom string is a low G the same as the violin. Some of them are only 5 strings, starting on a C a fourth above the open G on a violin. They reach down to bass viols that are similar in size and range to a cello, and then to what are sometimes referred to as contrabass viols or violone, with the violone in D (the bottom string is a tone lower than the double bass E) ranging anywhere from slightly smaller than a 3/4 size double bass to slightly larger than a 4/4 sized orchestra cannon. The Violin Octet/Hutchins violin family expands the traditional violin family, and the contrabass violin was designed to be tuned as a bass in 5ths (the same octave as a double bass in 5ths) but is sometimes played in 4ths so bassists used to playing in 4ths can make the transition easier. It typically has a larger body size, a 43" string length, but is shaped like a violin with narrower ribs and broader shoulders.

Various studies have been done to try to determine what is the optimal string length and body size for specific tunings. It is largely agreed that the viola should be larger than it is to work properly, and a 17" or even 18" string length would be optimal. The Violin Octet Alto Violin (the same tuning as a viola) has a 2-3" larger body size and is played vertically like a cello, but often has a string length of 16 3/4" or so such that violists can transition easier. Likewise, there are people that think something around 45" would be the optimal string length with a 5/4-6/4 size body, but few bassists could play on such an instrument. The Octobass was also flirted with for a while and was seen as the answer to a more powerful low end in the string section, but that didn't really take off.

All of that context largely to point out that our standard 3/4 size 40-42" double bass is "too small" both in comparison to the size of other string instruments, and according to some acoustic/other scientific studies. The double bass is full of compromises in order to make it a manageable instrument for the player and to meet the demands of the repertoire we play on it. Many large instruments have either been reshaped, had their string length reduced, or both, and a lot of modern makers are trying to find a way to make instruments that look traditional, but are easier to get around. This often manifests as sloped shoulders, a smaller upper bout with a larger lower bout, a big body with a not so long string length, canted back, narrow ribs or ribs that taper, or a combination of these things. There are some players that just cannot play a larger instrument/string length with their current physical or technique limitations, and others who play instruments that seem too large/small for them and manage just fine. Thomas Martin for example is 5'5" and plays on huge instruments just fine. It is also worth mention that while generalizations can be made about bigger or smaller instruments and longer and shorter string lengths, there are some fantastic (and horrible) exceptions to that rule, with small instruments sounding huge and huge instruments sounding wimpy.

Without getting into the 4ths/5ths debate, there are some who play in 5ths and some who play with "4 finger technique" where each finger gets a semitone in either tuning who like a shorter string length. There are others who are happy with 41-42", a few who play on something longer, and some who believe that with pivots and all four fingers, string length becomes irrelevant and any string length is possible.

Eventually, it comes down to personal preferences with a heavy amount of influence from our current conventions. 41-42" string length on a 3/4 instrument has become our "standard". There are some players that are looking for something longer or bigger, but these tend to be the exception not the rule. Anything below about 40" is usually considered short, and all of the stereotypes about having no bottom end, not carrying to the back of the hall, being a "solo" sized instrument that sounds like a cello etc. get thrown around. Anything longer than 42" and it's massive or unplayable, but it likely sounds like a cannon that was shot off three towns over. Sometimes these things hold true, and sometimes they aren't worth the paper they're written on. Or whatever the internet equivalent of that saying is.
 
Everything about your post is great Mike, but I wanted to clarify something. The purpose of the Hutchins Octet was to make an octet of stringed instruments that all had the same timbre as the violin. When you need to take away the need for a bass to sound like a violin, I think our modern 3/4 and 7/8 basses sound just fine. Composers and bassists have been working with basses that sound like basses for centuries as well so I don't think the Hutchins bass is filling any real needs.

Per the string length discussion, I believe I am noticing a trend at least in the US for makers to build basses with shorter string lengths. I can't provide any hard evidence, but that's what I think I'm noticing. I just finished a 7/8 bass recently with a 41.5" string length and most of my feedback has been that the bass is too big and string length is too long.
 
Thanks Joey, and I appreciate your perspective as someone who's in a shop and seeing what the trends are both for instruments being sold and the concerns with instruments coming in for repairs. I was not trying to suggest that the Hutchins instruments were superior, that we should abandon our current string family for it, or that the modern double bass is a complete write off. I have seen a few videos of the Octet and and the instruments being used outside of that setting as well which I do find quite interesting, but I have no idea what they sound like in the real world or in comparison to others. Plenty of issues such as a lack of repertoire and how they would fit in an orchestra setting come to mind, but I don't want to turn this into a discussion on the Octet.

I would disagree that composers and bassists have been working with basses that work/sound like our modern double bass for centuries though. The double bass that Mozart, Haydn, Handel, etc. had to work with most likely would have been much more of a violone than a modern double bass. Beethoven would have encountered a bass without frets, but with a bow much different than our modern bows. Steel strings have been adopted in almost every major orchestra on the planet now, but there are still plenty of bassists alive who remember when gut was the only option. While some double basses are quite old, many of them spent parts of their lives in different tunings, possibly had three strings, and a host of other musical and technological "limitations" that have been modified over the years. The double bass is still a changing instrument, and it will be exciting to see what comes about during the rest of my bass playing career and lifetime.

Back to string length, it does seem that we are leaning towards shorter than we once did. I have seen 42" held up as a standard, but usually that is with the caveat of not wanting anything longer than that. There seems to still be quite a bit of resistance to going shorter than 40" for an orchestral instrument, but there are plenty of players now that are focusing on solo and chamber music who like shorter string lengths and happen to have instruments that would work quite well in an orchestra if needed. We are slowly coming around to the idea that bigger isn't always better, and if it is easier to get around a smaller instrument without losing any sound or bottom end, then why not? I am not nearly as connected to the bass market as some here are, but it looks like smaller instruments that sound huge are what a lot of players are looking for instead of the biggest thing they can possibly play without resulting in automatic injury.

If someone made a bass with a 35" string length that could still hold its own in a section, I would jump on that. Maybe I'd even get a few less don't you wish you played the flute jokes...
 
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...I would disagree that composers and bassists have been working with basses that work/sound like our modern double bass for centuries though. The double bass that Mozart, Haydn, Handel, etc. had to work with most likely would have been much more of a violone than a modern double bass. Beethoven would have encountered a bass without frets, but with a bow much different than our modern bows. Steel strings have been adopted in almost every major orchestra on the planet now, but there are still plenty of bassists alive who remember when gut was the only option. While some double basses are quite old, many of them spent parts of their lives in different tunings, possibly had three strings, and a host of other musical and technological "limitations" that have been modified over the years. The double bass is still a changing instrument, and it will be exciting to see what comes about during the rest of my bass playing career and lifetime...

Of course you are right on this. I was speaking a little too generally.
 
The 5-string basses of the WDR symphony in Cologne, Germany have up to 115 cm vibrating string length on their 5-string basses, I was told. Played with Spiro Mittel 4/4 they have a huge sound, but I'm I wouldn't be able to play them due to string tension (and I have a 4/4 110 cm 5-string as my main instrument).
I read somewhere that the bassists of the Berlin Phil used to play on downtuned solo strings in the past. Maybe this is the reason, i.e. not something to pooh-pooh, but rather a necessity on the huge fivestringers they use?
 
I read somewhere that the bassists of the Berlin Phil used to play on downtuned solo strings in the past. Maybe this is the reason, i.e. not something to pooh-pooh, but rather a necessity on the huge fivestringers they use?

Well, the Spiros come as 4/4 that have almost the same tension as Spiro Weich 3/4, so they are lighter strings. But only Spiros and Superflexible have these lighter (and longer) 4/4 versions. Any other long strings (like Pirastro) have more tension on the longer scale. Light strings usually compensate this for going from 105 cm to 110 cm, downtuned solo strings compensate for going from 105 cm to 115 cm. which means you get the same tension as medium tension strings on the 105 cm scale.

It depends on what sound the director of the orchestra prefers or what sound the orchestra has developed over decades.

The WDR orchestra basses must have a high tension on their strings, like heavy strings.
 

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