Swapping preamp first time

[bste9]

Hello all,
I posted this is the basses forum but maybe it will get more play over here.
So I just picked this up yesterday, Tobias Toby Pro5. I was always intrigued by these back in the day and a local shop had a few so I tried one out. Its really comfortable to play, feels great and looks killer. Did some research and the electronics appear to be the weak link on these and I agree. They are not terrible, but nothing great.
So I decided to buy it knowing I would go ahead and replace something, either pickups or preamp or both. I have never done so before but I thought it would be a project to learn on.
I am going to start with the preamp, but my question is which preamp? Soo many options out there. I am thinking a Bartolini NTBT as it would probably be the simplest and cheapest, this being my first time doing a swap. Would it be better to get the harness/preamp or just the preamp itself? The controls currently are volume/blend/bass/treble.
I like the sound of EMG pickups but it seems if you get a EMG preamp, you also have to have EMG pickups and this is more expensive. Although, that doesnt really matter. I am just spit balling and there are so many options and choices out there, I am a little overwhelmed.

 

[dwizum]

If you're eventually going to replace the pickups anyways, might as well go with all EMG if you like that sound. The unique EMG tone is pretty much due to the pickups, not so much the preamps. I have several basses with EMGs and just passive tone and volume controls, and they are unmistakably EMG in terms of the sound.

That said, the Bartolini NTBT is a nice preamp too. If you go that route, it would definitely be simpler to get one with a harness ready to go that matches the configuration you want and the number of holes you have. Buying just the bare preamp might be a little overwhelming on your first ever swap.

 

[bste9]

If you're eventually going to replace the pickups anyways, might as well go with all EMG if you like that sound. The unique EMG tone is pretty much due to the pickups, not so much the preamps. I have several basses with EMGs and just passive tone and volume controls, and they are unmistakably EMG in terms of the sound.

That said, the Bartolini NTBT is a nice preamp too. If you go that route, it would definitely be simpler to get one with a harness ready to go that matches the configuration you want and the number of holes you have. Buying just the bare preamp might be a little overwhelming on your first ever swap.

cool...thanks for the input. I think the hardest part is just deciding what I want to do. lol

 

[ctmullins]

Lots of choices. The Bartolini is nice, but not the cheapest. The Duncan Blackouts preamps can be found a bit cheaper. But lots of good choices out there.

I use EMG preamps on a few basses with passive non-EMG pickups, no problem.

 

[rojo412]

There's a certain truth to the fact that if the sound of a bass isn't making you happy, it could be the pickups, preamp, or both:
- Preamps are designed to modify the sound of the pickups that are feeding it. Sometimes, they are good at translating the truth, sometimes they are actually choking off a good signal. So you can't really tell if the preamp is bad until you take it out of the equation.
- Pickups can also either tell the truth, make it better, or make it worse. And until you send the signal from those to a jack, you won't really know.
- And sometimes, they can either benefit, cancel out, or cause issues with each other.

I guess my point is this: if given the option, you may want to try and bypass the preamp and see what the pickups do on their own, in order to get a better picture of the situation.

Now as a frequent mod'er myself, I can say that most of the time, these types of "stock," kinda blah parts are unimpressive. I've removed both components, replaced them, and was absolutely shocked at the end result. However, that is an investment.
- I've been wowed by some basic preamps with either more functionality or a gain control to help boost a low signal, so you can luck out with that.
- And I've also been wowed when supposedly "good" preamps were removed, only to reveal that they were chocking the life out of a good signal from the pickups.

If it were me, like I said, I'd bypass the preamp and see what happens. If you find that it was killing a good signal, replace the preamp. If things don't change much, you may also need the pickups. But you could always start with a preamp and see what happens (something with gain control and mids definitely changes a lot about what a bass can do), deciding for pickups down the line if the preamp alone doesn't get you where you need to go.

Also to consider, measure the size of the pickups. They look like they could be EMG size, which is fine for a number of upgrade options of many different makers. But get that measurement first, to see what you may be able to use. If they are a weird size and you need to get something super custom to even fit proper (or rout out the bass for different sized units), that could be the kind of number that may prevent you from going down a slippery slope.

 

[bste9]

There's a certain truth to the fact that if the sound of a bass isn't making you happy, it could be the pickups, preamp, or both:
- Preamps are designed to modify the sound of the pickups that are feeding it. Sometimes, they are good at translating the truth, sometimes they are actually choking off a good signal. So you can't really tell if the preamp is bad until you take it out of the equation.
- Pickups can also either tell the truth, make it better, or make it worse. And until you send the signal from those to a jack, you won't really know.
- And sometimes, they can either benefit, cancel out, or cause issues with each other.

I guess my point is this: if given the option, you may want to try and bypass the preamp and see what the pickups do on their own, in order to get a better picture of the situation.

Now as a frequent mod'er myself, I can say that most of the time, these types of "stock," kinda blah parts are unimpressive. I've removed both components, replaced them, and was absolutely shocked at the end result. However, that is an investment.
- I've been wowed by some basic preamps with either more functionality or a gain control to help boost a low signal, so you can luck out with that.
- And I've also been wowed when supposedly "good" preamps were removed, only to reveal that they were chocking the life out of a good signal from the pickups.

If it were me, like I said, I'd bypass the preamp and see what happens. If you find that it was killing a good signal, replace the preamp. If things don't change much, you may also need the pickups. But you could always start with a preamp and see what happens (something with gain control and mids definitely changes a lot about what a bass can do), deciding for pickups down the line if the preamp alone doesn't get you where you need to go.

Also to consider, measure the size of the pickups. They look like they could be EMG size, which is fine for a number of upgrade options of many different makers. But get that measurement first, to see what you may be able to use. If they are a weird size and you need to get something super custom to even fit proper (or rout out the bass for different sized units), that could be the kind of number that may prevent you from going down a slippery slope.

Hi, thanks for the reply. I did a lot of research before buying this thing. Searching the old threads here on TB on this bass, it seemed most thought the preamp was the issue and the stock pickups were decent. So that was my original thought just to replace the preamp.
You are right, they are EMF 40 size, I already measured, 4.15x1.56.
Replacing both the preamp and pickups is pricey, just looking around about $300, so i thought go with preamp first and see how the stock pickups do.

 

[rojo412]

Good moves!