SWR BigBen replacement woofer

[Passinwind]

Passinwind, thanks again for posting the link to the new version of WinISD... it definitely takes me into a new era of headaches
And many thanks to Arjank too, for his time and advice.

No worries. As an aside, you might just want to take Arjan's advice to try Boxsim. The fact that it encourages one to do actual measurements turns many people off, but ultimately I think that's a much better approach for those who can handle it.

BTW, I dug what I saw of your basses on your website. I'll hit you up on FB, for sure.

 

[Triad]

Thanks! Yes, I'll definitely get Boxsim too... I'm curious and picky, so the next time I'm in this position I'll try to avoid the stupid question and maybe only ask for details that aren't easily covered by a normal search.
Anyway, I have to say the cab sounds nice. The lows aren't probably as deep as I wanted them to be once you go under 40hz but the cabinet isn't huge and it all started when I found the ad for the BigBen cabinet with the dead speaker.
The mid surprised me, it's a little bit on the "harsh" side (expecially with my Ebony necked Staab bass) but it's nice overall. The tweeter, which I already knew and liked, it a Ciare PT262 and sounds definitely good crossed that high (5000hz).
All in all, not a cheap experiment but worth it, expecially because I learnt a lot in the process.
Glad you like the madness going on my facebook page

 

[agedhorse]

There's no problem learning here, but it helps to be open minded to what physics brings to the table. There are a few folks here that really do know what they are talking about and have the credibility to back it up.

 

[Triad]

Yeah, we're definitely lucky here.

 

[BadExample]

Breaking in speakers can lead to speaker damage when you don't understand what you are doing...

What do they do, over excursion then? I tend to play music trough mine, fairly quietly, or just let them break in in the cab

 

[agedhorse]

The suspension components break down which greatly deteriorate the TS parameters

 

[Arjank]

Tuning makes (or can make) a difference in the system response. Breaking in a typical woofer used for sub and bass guitar applications generally has no significant difference in the system response, both double-blind listening tests and numerical measurements generally confirm this. That said, in electric guitar speakers, there can be some differences as the ear is MUCH more sensitive to midrange voicing, and the break-up modes of the driver are in part a function of any softening of the otherwise stiff, lightweight paper and suspension. Of course, if breaking in the driver were to cause a large shift in parameters, what mechanism prevents the changes from continuing? Does the driver sound it's "best" at hour number 68? In actuality, the changes are very small.

True, I have encountered this many times with fullrange drivers. Softening the suspension (after "break-in") with these type of drivers will have a big impact on the break-up modes in mids/highs. This not only happened with drivers that had a thin paper cone/suspension but I also encountered this with a 4" fullrange hifi driver with a rubber suspension.

 

[BogeyBass]

speakers sound different after the spiders break in and the paper/cloth surround breaks in, not mystical myth. its pretty basic, after few hours of playing or basic test signal applied for few hours its completely noticeable. measure the ts parameters fresh out of the box won't be same after few hours of operation everything will losen up and ts parameters will match published specifications after break in. dont believe me i dont care to argue on talkbass again. seen it million times with tested woofers, and yes heard it a million times with cheap speakers. its pretty well known with garbage guitar speakers and flea market junk like mcms and pyles. they sound a hell of alot better after break in. no myths just basic stiffness from glues from assembly...really really simple. higher quality drivers its not super noticable with pa music, music instruments notice little more. big big difference i have noticed with krappy speakers . sold a krapload of loaded cheap drivers in pre built partcle board rat fur wanna be pa enclosures at the flea market and yes we ran them through basic test signal for few hours to wake em up.

anyways yes 130 to 150 liters is ideal for the sigma pro 18a2 if we are talking about the driver i recommended. having heard the thing in multiple enclosures yes basically around 5 cubic feet is fine. it does really well in small boxes hence the reason i recommended it. does really well in a sub type enclosure and again ill just recommend what ive always stuck it in. plain jane BB4 sub enclosure basically 4.5 to 5 cubic feet and tune it smack dad to fs at 28hz. and yes port length is pretty long going that low so if you hit 28 to 35ish all good. another sub type enclosure is the basic chepyshev alignment and that would be around 140 liters tuned slightly higher to 30hz...see where this is going. if you wanna get near a basic butterworth alighnment and wanna see the pretty little bump everbody likes to see then yes...almost same volume with the sigma just tuned higher to 40 hz.

not gonna repeat myself or argue with armchair experts dont understand basic reflex functions and the whole purpose of using 18" drivers and not 15" drivers to make the same pretty little graph in a sim. want the restricted movement of the cone way the hell below the fundamental and within range of the speakers fs or impedance curve. hence the reason why we use a 18" around 25hz not a 15 around 40hz and yes in 5 cubic feet its not a 6 cubic or 7 cubic earth crushing sub. its a speaker designed for smaller portable enclosures but still a low Fs so we get decent transient response way the hell below mid bass. not 50 not 40 hopefully 30 or lower for reflex Fb not talking source signal....ohhh yay we got 28hz speaker fs. wanna see pretty bump turn up the EQ.

anyways you can do a salt/rice test to try and confirm if the cab is tuned to a disgusting 70hz or something reasonable like a butter worth at 40hz or a sub at 30hz. if not we need to add some length to those ports. or simply reduce the size of the existing ones by using a smaller flared tube which would fit in the 6" hole and just add 2 more. you can tune few dibble dabbles below fs like 25hz and wow its a sub now, wont be crushing deep bass we need 6 or 7 cubic feet to do that. and good luck fitting those ports in a enclosure.but if you heard a accurate sub it aint tuned to 40hz like a dam 15. all else fails then plug the ports, low and behold the driver does fine sealed...in take a guess....5 cubic feet. yes maximum flat delay response with a sigma is just about 150 liters and .7 is actually 90 liters so 130 liters is just about perfect for the sigma. if it magically shows 40/45 hz with rice test cool should be good and would not be hard to lower it. i just have feeling its super high tuned and your really gonna enjoy the speaker at 40 or 30 hz definitely not at 70. eminence designs are leaning more towards power handling and butterworth alignments all good if its in that ballpark. im not eminence just dude on the internet so guess i dont know anything right? lol

500 hz is okish for the sealed back midrange, having played with it on active crossovers, thats about the minumum i would go, it cleans up a little better at 700hz

 

[agedhorse]

BogeyBass - Do you just vomit a bunch of disconnected words and hope they make sense?

There is so much inaccurate stuff in what you wrote that I can't even begin to sort it out.

Who is calling who an armchair expert? You might just take a look in the mirror, your rambling is the definition of armchair IMO.

 

[Triad]

He said he liked my choice of the Sigma 18, let's stop there
Bummed about it, just found out that another UK vendor actually HAS the Faital 18FH500 in stock

 

[GruntSplatter]

I have 2 Big Ben's. I called Eminence and they recommended the 800w rms Kappa Pro 18LF-8. I replaced the speakers in both cabs. They take everything I throw at them and sound great while doing it..