Not really. You can learn how to develop fingerings in real time with notation and you can do the same with tablature as I mentioned earlier. It is completely possible to read it in real time.
+1.
+11.
That's a bold statement.
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Tabs or music
- Thread starter oldscarrow
- Start date
Not really. You can learn how to develop fingerings in real time with notation and you can do the same with tablature as I mentioned earlier. It is completely possible to read it in real time.
+1.
+11.
That's a bold statement.
G'day
a question for all those that have learned to play bass well.
If you consider yourself to be a good bass player,...could you tell me, did you learn to play bass by reading bass tabs, or did you learn to read music. And if you did learn to read music, are you a better bassist because you learned to read music, and any other comments are appreciated, (except for those that might be telling me I have this in the wrong section....get over it, I am still finding my way around this forum) to everybody else...thanks
well, people that read music can also play tabs, but people that read tabs often can't read music. Tabs is "easy" compared to reading music (which becomes easy pretty quickly) so I think learning to read is better than going straight tabs.
I read music (some would say I do it pretty well), but boy am I glad I finally got tab. It was actually hard to make the transition - it only happened recently. Indeed, just in the past two days, all of a sudden, I can read tab pretty fast - as long as it isn't too high up on the fretboard - for some reason, anything above 7 starts to confuse me!
When you're used to reading the staff and each note is spatially delineated, it's tough to see a bunch of 7's that mean different notes on different strings. Having written that, it sounds stupid, because I'm looking at some tab and it seems to much easier (now) that reading the bass clef.
But since I can "hear" the music on the staff (the notes and their intervals are so obvious once you learn it), I don't know what I'd do without that ability. It's also very easy to learn keyboard once you learn the staff, so it's cool to be able to play out the whole song (treble and bass) when you're first learning a piece.
At any rate, I rely heavily on tab to actually play bass, preferring to have both in front of me at the same time whenever possibly (along with the chord notations). I need the music for the rhythm (unless I really know the song well) and I need the tab for the fingering, still. I've been playing about a year and half.
When you're used to reading the staff and each note is spatially delineated, it's tough to see a bunch of 7's that mean different notes on different strings. Having written that, it sounds stupid, because I'm looking at some tab and it seems to much easier (now) that reading the bass clef.
But since I can "hear" the music on the staff (the notes and their intervals are so obvious once you learn it), I don't know what I'd do without that ability. It's also very easy to learn keyboard once you learn the staff, so it's cool to be able to play out the whole song (treble and bass) when you're first learning a piece.
At any rate, I rely heavily on tab to actually play bass, preferring to have both in front of me at the same time whenever possibly (along with the chord notations). I need the music for the rhythm (unless I really know the song well) and I need the tab for the fingering, still. I've been playing about a year and half.
I'm definitely a music reader. I do a lot of gigs where it's necessary. What I find convenient is the number of tabs on the net. For example, I had to learn an older rock tune the other day. I was having a brain fart about the best way to finger one passage. I looked up some tabs, and found one that had a very smart way to play it. That day tabs were very helpful.
I've been playing for a few years, and I started TAB because I only knew treble clef. I kept reading an E but my mind said C...now that I've played a while, I've been really making an effort to read bass clef because I know it will make me a better musician. The trouble I run into is the availability of sheet music for current tunes. Yeah, you can use your ear, and I'm usually pretty close. Yet, there are times when I read music after I've learned by ear, and it's not 100% the same. I'm a little OCD in this dept.
Sure, music stores have it, but most of it is only what sells. Usually bass music is pretty limited there, and often only includes the obvious items such as RHCP, Metallica, etc...that's why I think TAB is so popular. What I want to know is where everyone here who reads music and plays covers gets their stuff?
Sure, music stores have it, but most of it is only what sells. Usually bass music is pretty limited there, and often only includes the obvious items such as RHCP, Metallica, etc...that's why I think TAB is so popular. What I want to know is where everyone here who reads music and plays covers gets their stuff?
I get it from the audio - make my own chart. Transcribing - the flip side of reading. Hugely important skill IME. If someone avoids it because they feel they're no good at it, I say they need to practice it that much more urgently! But I seem to be a bit of a freak in this regard.
I've never once bought music for a bass line or tried to look for it on the internet. (Lyrics, now that's a whole different thing.
)
From listening to stuff, from knowing about music, from copping chord changes from the keyboard and/or guitars. First, I've never approached doing covers as requiring me to regurgitate the recording, so very often the feel and the "shape" of the recorded bass line is much more important than copping every tiny bit. Most of the music I play is covers of recordings (by Booker T & The MGs, the Funk Bros., Jemmott/Lovell/Dupree, Rainey/Purdie/Dupree, Wyman/Watts, etc.) where other takes would vary from what we've heard a million times. It's stuff where the bass line is a reaction to what everyone else did on that particular take, so my job is to play it so it sound like a BAND with the people I'm performing. And unless everyone does exactly what's on the record (impossible in most cases given overdubs and instumentation) then it's foolhardy for me to presume that the bass line sacrosanct to anyone that matters. And bassists in the audience that ain't workin' tonight really don't matter.
Second (and more importantly), part of correclty learning to read music also helps you to HEAR better. That helps cop stuff off recordings. And the language of music opens up one's ears to other things than what might lie under the fingers well.
jte
Tabs are for amateurs
This is simply the truth.
In my 30 years as a pro bass player (and still going) I never met any musician who relies on tabs. I would like to see a poll where we can see what kind of bass player are using notation vs tabs. We'll find out that pro musicians are using their ears and or notation not tabs.
Tabs are incomplete. They actually show you where to play the notes and often suggesting wrong fingerings which is a really bad thing IMO. It doesn't give you the name,the rhythms,the harmonic contents,the phrasing,the dynamics etc... At least a written chart gives you musical informations and it is up to the player to interprete the music to the best of his/her capacity,experience and taste.
Plus I'm left-handed so it doesn't make sense to me to read tabs right
Sly
That's a bold statement.
This is simply the truth.
In my 30 years as a pro bass player (and still going) I never met any musician who relies on tabs. I would like to see a poll where we can see what kind of bass player are using notation vs tabs. We'll find out that pro musicians are using their ears and or notation not tabs.
Tabs are incomplete. They actually show you where to play the notes and often suggesting wrong fingerings which is a really bad thing IMO. It doesn't give you the name,the rhythms,the harmonic contents,the phrasing,the dynamics etc... At least a written chart gives you musical informations and it is up to the player to interprete the music to the best of his/her capacity,experience and taste.
Plus I'm left-handed so it doesn't make sense to me to read tabs right
Sly
I never thought of that, but that's yet another good objection to spending much time on tabs.
Standard notation is the "standard" notation for a reason, I first learned by using tab, and only a year ago began using standard notation, but i'm incredibly glad I did because it's essential to being a versatile and "good" player
When I first learned music it was on the piano and guitar, almost simultaneously, therefore standard notation was the olny way to go. Also, most published tab was just crap and there were no computer programs for tab (probably weren't any computers for that matter, ). When I first switched to bass I just couldn't get bass clef, and there still wasn't much quality tab, especialy as published on the internet (most of it is just a collection of strings with no measures, time signatures, durations etc... then I found a tab for "Money" and by listening to the album and studying the tab it started to work. Then I found a quality Tab Program which not only allowed me to Tab a song but translated notation to tab and vise a versa. It'll also play back your tab thru a midi interface. Since I started teaching bass, I have found that tab gets the message across to the student faster (in the beginning stages at least) than notation, even if they can read on another instrument. Instead of concentrating on the notation being an indicatiob of what note to play, what the duration is etc... they can see that string and that fret. The tab I give students is both the bass tab with the notation (and lyrics most times) and I write my tab with messures, duration indicators and dynamics and special effects (slides, pull-offs, hammer ons etc...). I agree that in the long run, tab has its limitations compared to notation, but its a tool to learn and enjoy the instrument by employing, so glory be! Thats why we do it. Also the student starts enjoying playing sooner and I find that keeps their interest longer. Finding quality tab is the hard part, the ONLY complete, correct quality collection I have found is "The Beatles Complete Scores" although "The Bass Tab White Pages" aren't totaly useless. I hope I don't offend the purists, but thats my take on it.
RC
Tigard, OR
RC
Tigard, OR
What's a wrong fingering?
If you re-read the thread you'll find that they can.
I am left-handed and I can read them just fine.
I can read tabs pretty quickly. The majority of my guitar students < 15 and most don't want to read music or find it too hard for whatever reason, so they end up just wanting to use tabs. I've found some terrible tabs and rewritten them, and have found some brilliant ones that contain rhythm markings througout, along with alternate fingerings and are 99.9% perfect when played along to the song.
I've got left handed students that can read them fine. If the fingerings are weird it's very easy for anyone with experience to rewrite the tab so the fingerings suit how you play. You can write the implied and/or actual chords and harmony above the tab itself, along with the rhythm markings.
In conclusion, most of the bad things people say about tab is simply through stubborness or ignorance. But, once again, notation is still preferable.
In a nutshell, tabs = bassist, notation = musician.
I've got left handed students that can read them fine. If the fingerings are weird it's very easy for anyone with experience to rewrite the tab so the fingerings suit how you play. You can write the implied and/or actual chords and harmony above the tab itself, along with the rhythm markings.
In conclusion, most of the bad things people say about tab is simply through stubborness or ignorance. But, once again, notation is still preferable.
In a nutshell, tabs = bassist, notation = musician.
I find this a lot and I think the real problem is with the state of guitar and bass education. There are 3 year old string, piano etc players that can read notation.
Reading tabs is like painting by numbers. It is for kids.
There is a time where you need to separate the men from the kids.
Sly
There is a time where you need to separate the men from the kids.
Sly
Now I'm not one to use proof by authority, but this is a really telling sign.
What it comes down to really is the ability of tab and music notation to convey a complete set of information. Tab just doesn't do it. Music notation can convey finger position and which string to play on, which is usually done by writing the position number or the string name above a passage and then a line, so it has the ability to show exactly what tab shows. Not as efficiently visualized, but all the information is there plain as can be on the page. Unless you have the special "note tab" that I talked about earlier, tab, by its very nature, cannot convey the actual musical notes behind the numbers. Playing 18 on the A string will result in an Eb, but you have no understanding that you are playing the note Eb. It's musical paint by numbers.
When playing standard notation, I've found that I can interpret patterns on a wider scale FAR more efficiently than could ever be achieved by tab. If, for example, I see a scale E to E in C major no accidentals in two octaves, my mind takes those 15 notes and "chunks" them into a musical "word" that my muscle memory can interpret readily. If I saw 15 numbers in a row on several lines in tab, there would be no way that sort of thing could happen. It's just impossible - there is too much information that has to be processed since numbers aren't a visual representation of the music, only the lines of the tab are what's helping out with visualizing the strings. Film session cats and people who are at the pinnacle of the reading game are able to do this, look at a sections of music and interpret it like we do words of the alphabet. When we read, we don't go letter by letter, we read entire words at once. Same thing with these guys although they do it at a superhuman level (like us reading entire sentences or paragraphs at once the same way we do words). I have never seen a person sight-read tab at anything close to resembling a professional level, and the thought that a person could ever read tab the way that pro session guys do is out of the question.
Reading tabs is like painting by numbers. It is for kids.
There is a time where you need to separate the men from the kids.
Sly
Hey! I used the same metaphor, you beat me too it.
But its totally apt.
- Dec 18, 2000
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I figure the best way to hook kids on lessons is to give 'em crack or something after a couple songs.
By the way, parsing bighonkingmessesofgoobldeygookdoesn'tworksonice, in music or text. Be kind:
- Dec 18, 2000
- 13,201
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- Disclosures
- greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
Most composers usually* don't care to tell you where on the neck to play the note - you're supposed to be clued in enough to make that decision in the context of the music. They care that you can read your part, and that others will be able to also.
As for sightreading tab in realtime, yeah, right. Mary Had A Little Lamb. Neil Young's Rockin' In The Free World. All these and more.
* before some bumblehead says Yes They Do notice I said, Usually
As for sightreading tab in realtime, yeah, right. Mary Had A Little Lamb. Neil Young's Rockin' In The Free World. All these and more.
* before some bumblehead says Yes They Do notice I said, Usually
I basically don't use either 
I can't remember *ever* being given tab or standard notation for a song. If I am given anything it is either a cd/mp3 or the lyrics with the chords written in. But this is < 1% of the time.
Usually I am just given the song title. I find the mp3, download it and learn the song by ear.
I do use a mismash of tab and chord charts to write down the song since I have a terrible memory. e.g. I normally just write out the chords with slashes to give a rough approximation of the time and tab out parts that I want to remember the actual notes.
I can't remember *ever* being given tab or standard notation for a song. If I am given anything it is either a cd/mp3 or the lyrics with the chords written in. But this is < 1% of the time.
Usually I am just given the song title. I find the mp3, download it and learn the song by ear.
I do use a mismash of tab and chord charts to write down the song since I have a terrible memory. e.g. I normally just write out the chords with slashes to give a rough approximation of the time and tab out parts that I want to remember the actual notes.
