TC Electronic Staccato Underpowered

[Musicman20]

Not actually discussing the comments on power, I'm referring to the other attacks on the company, and Uffe himself. So..,ummm.

 

[BurningSkies]

Obviously all threads will have negative views, but we don't necessarily 'bite' everytime Ampeg is mentioned. Everyone has the right to a view, but once its mentioned a few times, I think thats enough. What does anyone gain from slandering a company?

First off, slander by definition is spoken rather than written. Second, slander by its definition has to be spoken falsehood intended to defame.

Therefore, people stating the facts cannot be charged with any kind of slander.

 

[JimmyM]

Not actually discussing the comments on power, I'm referring to the other attacks on the company, and Uffe himself. So..,ummm.

I don't like the way TC operates. I feel they operate in a rather arrogant way. And Uffe's posts on here about the amp did nothing to make me feel differently. That is my opinion. That is not slander any more than someone complaining about the job their country's politicians are doing is slander.

It's very clear you have strong emotions vested in your purchase of their amp, and it's very clear you have no idea what the legal definition of slander is. But let me give you a hint...when the head of the company admits that their amp is 236w RMS but they called it 450w because they think that's what it performs like, someone else stating it is not slander. And I highly resent you accusing me and others of slander when all we're doing is stating truth.

 

[Musicman20]

I give up....I highly resent all your arrogance throughout most of these threads, but that's another matter.

I do however, wonder WHY the owners of such amps must feel so 'used/stupid' for buying these products and enjoying them. We clearly don't, do we? So, why labour the point?

I think its yourself who has strong emotions, for unknown reasons. Yes, YOU ARE stating truths from the Bass Gear tests, we aren't saying you aren't its EVERYTHING ELSE. The constant whining, moaning, and aiming comments at TC purely to point score.

BTW - Yes, 100% apologies for the incorrect legal term...my bad. Rushed comment without thinking, amended. We all no doubt know the correct legal term and the definitions considering the internet provides everyone with such a huge amount of information...but that shouldn't be discussed here.

 

[JHAz]

Who suggested owners feel used or stupid? I'm pretty sure everybody has said if you like what it does, that's cool. BEcause it is.

 

[JimmyM]

I honestly don't care what you feel about your purchase. If you're happy with it, then be happy. But once again, people considering it for purchase have the right to know so they can make an informed decision. If you can tell me honestly that you wouldn't have cared to have that knowledge when you bought yours, then fine. Most of us like to know exactly what we're buying when we buy it, though.

 

[BurningSkies]

I give up....I highly resent all your arrogance throughout most of these threads, but that's another matter.

I do however, wonder WHY the owners of such amps must feel so 'used/stupid' for buying these products and enjoying them. We clearly don't, do we? So, why labour the point?

I think its yourself who has strong emotions, for unknown reasons. Yes, YOU ARE stating truths from the Bass Gear tests, we aren't saying you aren't its EVERYTHING ELSE. The constant whining, moaning, and aiming comments at TC purely to point score.

I'm not moaning about anything. How you feel about your amp is your business and if you've found an amp you love, you're one up on a lot of people.

I'm a bit sorry that TC wasn't up front with everyone about their product so that you could have known, then decided you wanted it anyway because it was loud enough and sounded the way you wanted.

I think you're misconstruing the intent of some of the posters on this subject.

 

[Rick Auricchio]

[TC's way of misrepresenting the amp's specs] lowers standards across the entire industry instead of raises them when it could've done just the opposite if they hadn't been so foolhardy as to think this somehow would've gone unnoticed.

+1.

I have no argument that what TC did was wrong and foolish.

Nevertheless, it is annoying to see most TC-related threads become cluttered with a discussion of this issue. The original issue hasn't changed, but now we're not answering a posted question; we end up with a thread hijack discussing a different---though valid---issue.

Post a link to a discussion of the issue so that people are aware of it; but there's no need to rehash everything we've already said.

 

[RCCollins]

There are a whole lot of lowish-wattage amps that perform well above their wattage rating, but TC is the only company I can ever remember actually lying about their wattage. Bummer, because they do make some VERY good effects units.

 

[JHAz]

I honestly don't care what you feel about your purchase. If you're happy with it, then be happy. But once again, people considering it for purchase have the right to know so they can make an informed decision. If you can tell me honestly that you wouldn't have cared to have that knowledge when you bought yours, then fine. Most of us like to know exactly what we're buying when we buy it, though.

+1. I understand why some folks may feel that it's overdone, but whenever somebody starts a new thread about these amps, it's fair to assume they haven't read the previous ones. I, for one, would want to know these facts before I purchased.

Luckily, apparently, the system works well enough for the people who like the sound that few have felt a need to sell after buying without the info. The info came, originally, from an indepth and generally very positive review in Bass Gear Mag, which anybody interested in the amp (or in bassing in general) would do well to peruse. You can even see it for free on the net.

 

[Musicman20]

I'm not moaning about anything. How you feel about your amp is your business and if you've found an amp you love, you're one up on a lot of people.

I'm a bit sorry that TC wasn't up front everyone about their product so that you could have known, then decided you wanted it anyway because it was loud enough and sounded the way you wanted.

I think you're misconstruing the intent of some of the posters on this subject.

It wasn't directly aimed at yourself...it just seems there is a 'crusade' against TC, after their frankly HUGE success with these products. They took a huge slice of the market.

Yes, they should have been up front. 100%, but I think there is more than meets the eye. They have agreed to the BGM review, which was a very thorough review, but I do have a feeling they have a response/statement coming soon...not directly from TC btw.

 

[Musicman20]

Most of us like to know exactly what we're buying when we buy it, though.

I wish Ampeg would have told me their Vietnam 810E cabs sounded so dull and dark...but I had no idea they would be different. I was PROMISED by the UK dealer it would sound the same as the USA made model.

Guess what, it didn't. Did I seek revenge? No, I let it go. This is probably the third time I've mentioned it in 4 years.

 

[JimmyM]

I wish Ampeg would have told me their Vietnam 810E cabs sounded so dull and dark...but I had no idea they would be different. I was PROMISED by the UK dealer it would sound the same as the USA made model.

Guess what, it didn't. Did I seek revenge? No, I let it go. This is probably the third time I've mentioned it in 4 years.

Congratulations...you have it completely backwards. The USA 810e cabs are the dull and dark ones, and most from 98-06 are made with OSB. Don't even go there with me...I have studied those 810e's intently and I know which are which. And the Vietnamese Ampeg gear was made for about a year and a half before they moved out of that factory...in 2008. And then they fired the idiot in charge of the company later that year and got a whole bunch of new people. But back when they were screwing up, I was totally on them for it. Get your story straight before you come at me with that stuff.

 

[wateroftyne]

Jimmy, while I agree with you re TC & honesty, I have to say that you frequently come across as someone gleefully grinding an axe. IMO, of course.

 

[BurningSkies]

It wasn't directly aimed at yourself...it just seems there is a 'crusade' against TC, after their frankly HUGE success with these products. They took a huge slice of the market.

Yes, they should have been up front. 100%, but I think there is more than meets the eye. They have agreed to the BGM review, which was a very thorough review, but I do have a feeling they have a response/statement coming soon...not directly from TC btw.

It would be nice if they did make a cogent statement about things, even if its in the form of an editorial piece in a magazine such as BGM. It would also be nice if they made the information easily available to the average bass-gear consumer, like on the spec sheets on their website rather than buried in the APM document.

I'm not sure how to explain their 'dual' personalities...with their pro audio gear, I've never ever heard them doing this kind of thing, yet with their MI stuff, here they are, and I mean that in terms of the wattage, the pitch for using their 3 cabs by obfuscating their minimum impedance rating, etc.

 

[Musicman20]

Congratulations...you have it completely backwards. The USA 810e cabs are the dull and dark ones, and most from 98-06 are made with OSB. Don't even go there with me...I have studied those 810e's intently and I know which are which. And the Vietnamese Ampeg gear was made for about a year and a half before they moved out of that factory...in 2008. And then they fired the idiot in charge of the company later that year and got a whole bunch of new people. But back when they were screwing up, I was totally on them for it. Get your story straight before you come at me with that stuff.

The Vietnam-made 810E I had (briefly) sounded dull. A fellow bassist had an earlier USA model, not sure of the year, (it could have been mid 90s, I'm not sure) and side by side, it sounded dull. I was so miffed, I had to just trade it. Were they MDF or birch? Again, I've no idea. Whether I had a rebadged revamped USA model that they labelled 'Made in Vietnam', we will never know. No matter what the 'facts are' re: Vietnam models, it sounded dull. Anyway, I digress, the quality and tone was not what I expected, at all. That is a straight story, as far as I'm aware.

 

[JHAz]

Well, I feel your pain on purchasing something that turns out to be different sounding from what you expected. But the salesman saying it sounded like a US cab is different from the manufacturer listing an amp as 450 watts when it's half that. That's more like selling an 810 cab that has 4 speakers and 4 passive radiators, then claiming it works as well as a real 8 speaker cab once somebody opens it up and finds there aren't 8 speakers in there

 

[GrowlerBox]

There are a whole lot of lowish-wattage amps that perform well above their wattage rating.

That's true, but I think in large part that's due to widespread misunderstanding regarding the contribution of an amp's potential power output to the loudness of a rig, the fact that relatively few speaker cabinets can make much use of more than a few hundred watts, and the actual meaning of "headroom". I think TCE would have been much better off educating potential purchasers regarding the value or otherwise of power as an isolated specification rather than perpetuating a myth and trying to cash in on it.

Not accusing you of any misunderstandings, you understand , merely using your comment to illustrate a point.

 

[BurningSkies]

That's true, but I think in large part that's due to widespread misunderstanding regarding the contribution of an amp's potential power output to the loudness of a rig, the fact that relatively few speaker cabinets can make much use of more than a few hundred watts, and the actual meaning of "headroom". I think TCE would have been much better off educating potential purchasers regarding the value or otherwise of power as an isolated specification rather than perpetuating a myth and trying to cash in on it.

Not accusing you of any misunderstandings, you understand , merely using your comment to illustrate a point.

This and don't forget things like harmonic distortion and any kind of 'hard wired' compression do the same.

 

[gnjpowell]

Hmmmm played my RH450 at a gig last weekend and had PLENTY of hall-filling sound. Can never run over 12:00 noon on the volume control. My point of reference is a QSC PLX1804 at 900W/ch. The RH450 has PLENTY of power and in no way doubt their published specs. RH450 is a very nice and powerful little amp! Some sour grapes here.....