Yeah, I understand your point, but I would expect a 1000 watt non-tube bass amp to be a fair fight for a 200 watt tube bass amp.True, but a 900W amp solid state should be able to match the 200W in some way?!
I realise the tubes will make it sound massive anyway....I was just giving an indication that watts means nothing
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TC Electronics RH450 vs Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0
- Thread starter otto B
- Start date
Just look at Ampeg, they have there classic tube 300w on some of the same stages as there SVT4PRO 1600w!
They don't make em like they used to. :-(
And by the way, I've not owned a shuttle yet but I'm working on it. I bought a RH450 and loved the features besides the tubetone (very poor). But I thought the bottom end is very poor quality and sounds broken up the further you stand from it. I use a wireless and like to hear the sound from the crowd in sound check. And when I'm 5-10 feet from it I love it but IMO it falls apart in distance. Markbass is where the best low end is at IMO. But Ive really got gas for the 9.0 now so I'll tell you what I think when I get ahold of one.
Don't shoot me RH450 Users, I like the LED lights.
They don't make em like they used to. :-(
And by the way, I've not owned a shuttle yet but I'm working on it. I bought a RH450 and loved the features besides the tubetone (very poor). But I thought the bottom end is very poor quality and sounds broken up the further you stand from it. I use a wireless and like to hear the sound from the crowd in sound check. And when I'm 5-10 feet from it I love it but IMO it falls apart in distance. Markbass is where the best low end is at IMO. But Ive really got gas for the 9.0 now so I'll tell you what I think when I get ahold of one.
Don't shoot me RH450 Users, I like the LED lights.
Cool! Post up when you do your direct comparison. I'm also with you that the Markbass low end is just about perfect. The RH450 is much more 'upper bass/low mid' sort of punch that I also dig, but it is a different thing that will either speak to a player or not.
I never use the tubetone, so can't comment on that. I know that there are a LOT of different variations of tube tone, and I guess whether you dig the RH450's emulation or not depends a lot on what you are looking for. The Ampeg tube guys seem to really dig the tube emulation on the RH450, while others don't. Who knows!
I tell you what though, I like the spectracomp alot. I felt like it squashed the sound just about right. (Live at least) I'm not sure how the recording side would do.
KJung- can you tell me how the Low end in the same situation does with the Genz Benz? Compared to markbass? I'm kinda looking for the "HiFi" in my sound but I would like close to the markbass low end. Or is it closer to the RH450 low end?
KJung- can you tell me how the Low end in the same situation does with the Genz Benz? Compared to markbass? I'm kinda looking for the "HiFi" in my sound but I would like close to the markbass low end. Or is it closer to the RH450 low end?
I have not had the pleasure of trying the 9. Genz, in general, is more on the 'bright' side than the deep low end side. The Shuttle 6 was a bit thin down there, unless you engaged that 'deep' boost button, and then it got too flubby for me... too little or too much.. didn't dig it for my tone. However, I understand the 9 is a bit fatter in its inherent tone down low, so that might be 'just right'.
I'm not a fan of the Genz tube preamp... just not voiced right for me... not totally clean, not really tubey to my ear... don't know what it is... bright grind or something ( of course, many love that... IMO there for my tone goals). However, I am quite impressed with the solid state channel of the Shuttle Max amps, and those amps also have variable voicing filters versus the utterly useless on/off filters on the 9 and 6 (IMO). You should consider the Max 12 if you are running two cabs. The FET channel is very cool... brighter than the RH450, and you can dial some additional controlled low end in with the variable bass boost control.... it is not a micro amp (almost full size two rack space), but very light. Nice amp.
In the grand scheme of "subjective voicing" descriptions, where would you put an Ashdown ABM500?
I don't need alot of volume but its always nice to have it. The 12.0 MAX has cought my eye for those very reasons. But how do these shuttles do at volume @ 9:00? Do they sound the same throughout the powerband or do they sputter at low RPMs (if I can use those terms)?
I saw some cats demo the RH at NAMM and thought it sounded good, but when Doug Johns showed me the ropes of the 9.0, I thought it sounded even better.
So what it seems here is that the RH450 and the shuttle 9.0 are two very different amps and it depends on weather you like the HiFi grit, or the smooth low mid sound. Am I right?
Were all just looking for that sound that plays like a record in our head. Although with me when I find it a new version plays two weeks later. I need alot of gear.
Were all just looking for that sound that plays like a record in our head. Although with me when I find it a new version plays two weeks later. I need alot of gear.
I have really enjoyed reading through all the comparisons between the RH450 and the GB shuttle 9.0. great stuff!!
I'm looking to update my rig with smaller set up. I just sent kjung a message yesterday saying i had my mind set on a shuttle 6. but, now after reading this thread i'm back to indecision i have played through an old eden traveller head (non standard tube) and 210 xlt cab for years...record with an avalon u5 di. main basses...kinal mk21 5 string bass (sadowsky jazzs pups & electronics) and a 6 string mollerup with passive nordstrand dual soaps. both amazing basses. play mostly jazz/funk and lots of black gospel.
tough to decide between the rh450 and GB 6 (or has kjung has suggested GB 9 better). so, to get this right...
based on eq set flat...the RH450 leans more towards the smooth, buttery end (overall very flexible amp) vs the GB more modern, precise hi-fi tendencies, yes?
I'm looking to update my rig with smaller set up. I just sent kjung a message yesterday saying i had my mind set on a shuttle 6. but, now after reading this thread i'm back to indecision
i have played through an old eden traveller head (non standard tube) and 210 xlt cab for years...record with an avalon u5 di. main basses...kinal mk21 5 string bass (sadowsky jazzs pups & electronics) and a 6 string mollerup with passive nordstrand dual soaps. both amazing basses. play mostly jazz/funk and lots of black gospel. tough to decide between the rh450 and GB 6 (or has kjung has suggested GB 9 better). so, to get this right...
based on eq set flat...the RH450 leans more towards the smooth, buttery end (overall very flexible amp) vs the GB more modern, precise hi-fi tendencies, yes?
fwiw, I finally got to play an RH450. I ordered one right after playing it. Warm/fat/tubey indeed. And the presets will actually be useful for dealing with vastly different basses. Now to figure the cab angle...
IMO, yes. The EQ and features are vastly superior on the RH450. However, if you want it bright and modern, the Genz is pretty cool. Donovan (The Fretspot) has a nice clip with the Shuttle 6 included in the comparison with the RH450.
The 9 is just a bit fatter, louder 6.
It's like herpes, once you catch GAS you can subdue it for a while then it flares up again...maybe they'll find a cure some day.
Does anyone know the 2 different frequencies the 6.0 and 9.0 High Pass Filter are set at. If I read correctly, there lies the main difference tone wise between the two. If people knew they were frequencies that weren't critical to there tone it may help there (my) teetering.
Tubetone is a great feature, the best tube tone like transistor head available, but you have to use it with moderation, around 9 o clock max.
by the way, the low end is great too, just record a good bass with that head and you 'll have a better sound than most of the studio preamps (tube or not), some neeve, etc (but a good cab, or two is important in live situation, if you take a muddy, medium cab, it will not be always totaly saved by the RH flat, like some hifi scooped head (but hifi = often sound good played in store, or house, or better with bad cabs, but poor in a mix)
- Feb 12, 2006
- 60,987
- 5
- 220,780
- Disclosures
- Development Engineer-Mesa Boogie, Development Engineer-Genzler (pedals), Product Support-Genz Benz
To basspoets,
(Hi Dave!) I can't really compare the two amps directly, but Rene Worst bought the GB shuttle and likes it a lot. I hope you'll test out the RH 450 with the pedal- for someone playing one passive and one active bass, it makes EQ'ing and gain structure much easier to set up. (The other thing I just added to my setup is a Radial Bass bone. For switching between basses, it's really handy.)
For TC cabinets, I chose 2 RS 112's, as I found the 12" speakers to have a much fuller bottom octave versus the punchier 10". 2 112's makes a nice modular setup.
(Hi Dave!) I can't really compare the two amps directly, but Rene Worst bought the GB shuttle and likes it a lot. I hope you'll test out the RH 450 with the pedal- for someone playing one passive and one active bass, it makes EQ'ing and gain structure much easier to set up. (The other thing I just added to my setup is a Radial Bass bone. For switching between basses, it's really handy.)
For TC cabinets, I chose 2 RS 112's, as I found the 12" speakers to have a much fuller bottom octave versus the punchier 10". 2 112's makes a nice modular setup.
Hi Laurence, thanks for that. ya, i am down to deciding between those two amps. i have read so much about the RH450 and it sounds like quite the amp (high convenience factor with those 2 RS 112's). just worried that after having eden (which i understand fits in the "hi fi" class) for so many years...would it work etc. so, hence my consideration of shuttle 9.0 now. also considering adding a aggy tone hammer.
i'm going to do a bit more testing as possible. but, nobody seems to have a shuttle 9 in town to test out. thanks again.
i'm going to do a bit more testing as possible. but, nobody seems to have a shuttle 9 in town to test out. thanks again.
I played Eden gear for a long time. I wouldn't classify Eden gear as hi-fi at all. Lots of low-mid emphasis and coloring, with that trademark "buttery" center thing going on. Sounds great!
All 3 things you are considering as an alternative each have their own tonal characteristics. I think the Genz Benz is probably the closest to "hi-fi" of the 3 if that is what you are after. If so then the MarkBass LMIII is what I'd direct you towards. Otherwise it's a matter of choosing the head that colors your tone the way you like it to.
