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Double Bass The Bace ... Something Different.
- Thread starter Acoop
- Start date
Just like Damon said, that is standard DB technique. You didn't even go so far as to get ONE lesson from a competent instructor, or crack open any basic DB method book?
Yeah, but DBs that small generally sound like a cardboard box. For what it will cost you to get one that might sound as good as a respectable cheap plywood 3/4, you could buy a fine carved 3/4, a years worth of lessons on it, a nice bow, and have enough left over for a Squier Precision, a set of flatwounds, and a wee amp for when the load-in of the DB is just too ridiculous.
That statement is now 15.5 years outdated, double basses that small have a much fuller sound than they used to be years ago.
That statement is simply not up to date anymore. Updated string technology renders that statement OUTDATED
Yes and no. They sort of exist, however not quite as small as you say. Certain classical solo player have incredible small basses both old and new. They are extremely expensive when they sound like anything. They are either an older bass with a serious pedigree or a new commission from a famous maker.
There are probably less than 20 or so (just an educated guess) in existence worldwide and they are all worth north of 20k (another educated guess) so they are far from the norm. That is why a regular 3/4 bass plus lessons is still the best way to go by far.
As far as always amplifying: the best amp/pick up combinations in the world sound just OK for double bass and most depend on the body of the instrument still putting some lows into the room.
So again, not a real solution.
We get that you really want this "Bace" to be something but, it isn't.
As I said too. By the time you pay for a wee bass that sounds as good as an ordinary 3/4 plywood, you'll have spent enough on said wee bass to have bought a fine DB, a Precision, a good amp, and a bunch of lessons on both. The laws of physics haven't been repealed.
A lot of smaller basses sound great. My old bass is a 3/4 on the small side - you heard it in Memphis. There are decent sounding 1/2 size basses out there. Smaller than that and you lose projection. You are generally dealing with a ratio of clarity vs. low end, though I am sure it is even more complex than that.
I've always figured that there must be a trade off between loud and low. If you want both, you'll need a big bass. (This is just my guess based on the physics, but if someone were to tell me they could do loud, low, and small, I'd suspect snake oil.) As you go smaller, I think you should expect to sacrifice low end or volume.
As for easier to make, I've heard mixed things. I've heard that a bass is easier to make than smaller instruments like violin and cello because the tolerances are much tighter on a violin. Every cut needs to be super precise--or so I've been told. OTH, I knew a violin/viola/cello maker who only ever made one bass, and he swore he'd never do it again haha. His shop was pretty small, so perhaps it was the shop that was the problem, not the bass.
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I have a carved 5-string 4/4 with a 110 cm scale. It is built for a low B for orchestra but I use it with a high C.
Since it must work at least as good for low B as a 3/4 (105cm) for the E, it has a really strong E. On the other hand it is a bit harder to play (but I am used to it) and doesn’t sound as clear in the uppermost thumb positions where I hardly ever get.
But using a high C on the 110 cm scale is not a good idea. It is hard enough to get a high C that plays well with the lower strings and doesn’t cut into your fingers. But on that rather long scale the tension is even higher.
Since it must work at least as good for low B as a 3/4 (105cm) for the E, it has a really strong E. On the other hand it is a bit harder to play (but I am used to it) and doesn’t sound as clear in the uppermost thumb positions where I hardly ever get.
But using a high C on the 110 cm scale is not a good idea. It is hard enough to get a high C that plays well with the lower strings and doesn’t cut into your fingers. But on that rather long scale the tension is even higher.
Wow, the C string is a C3, which is the same as the low string on a viola, right? So you're talking about 110cm vs 37-38cm for the same note on a viola if I'm not mistaken.
Correct, same pitch as the low viola C string. But the top jog a viola is much thinner, so the pressure on it needs to be a lot lower than the pressure on a DB top.
Even a few high D and E strings for DB exist (for high solo tuning or high fifths tuning). But they are only available on request and probably a lot more expensive.
The problem for strings that high is that in most cases the common core material of the lower strings cannot be used as no windings were possible because of the high core mass for this pitch or they are tuned higher with a significantly higher tension (that hurts with thin and low stretch steel core strings).
Even a few high D and E strings for DB exist (for high solo tuning or high fifths tuning). But they are only available on request and probably a lot more expensive.
The problem for strings that high is that in most cases the common core material of the lower strings cannot be used as no windings were possible because of the high core mass for this pitch or they are tuned higher with a significantly higher tension (that hurts with thin and low stretch steel core strings).
Gollihurs (all hail?) stocks Obligato high E for $120 shipped now. I’ve committed to it set at only 3mm height over a full set of RM Spiros on my Shen — it’s been a nice change from bowing raw gut.
The tradeoff is between having strigs long enough to get good tension and body volume sufficient to reinforce low frequency fundamentals, versus having the string length short enough and the body small enough to be practical in the playing. The DB already gives up one finger per "fret" and goes to fourths tuning, just to make fingering it practical, and the inevitable weak E string is the result, and it still requires far more shifting than the rest of the violin family. The fact that each designer has to give up important things in making the necessary compromises is why DBs (and violas) have so much more phenotype variation, compared to violins and celli.
