The 'feel'

[buddyro57]

As a member of the over-50 generation, I would say Don't worry, the experience you had was a rite of passage that we wll go through. If you want to play again with the older guys, buy some Beatle and Cream records and really spend some time living with them- then try it again- see what they say- maybe they'll be impressed that you cared enough to invest time in getting the elusive "feel" that they are talking about. Above all, don't be discouraged by it, after years have passed, you may find yourself saying the same thing to a bunch of younger players....its kind of the way things go.
Keep pluckin' way at it!
JS

 

[Disappear]

As a member of the over-50 generation, I would say Don't worry, the experience you had was a rite of passage that we wll go through. If you want to play again with the older guys, buy some Beatle and Cream records and really spend some time living with them- then try it again- see what they say

Ironically enough, that's what we're playing. When I bought my first bass, that's what I started playing when I was learning. I'm starting to get it, or so they say. They did hear a great improvement from week one to week two. I'll be practicing until I'm dead though so I got time to learn.

 

[rokkitt]

As you surely know by now, 'feel' is the hardest thing to quantify or break down into bits that you can talk about.
I have spent a huge amount of effort and time developing good feel in my playing, and am often complimented on it. And I would say...
The single biggest factor is time. Or 'timing' if you prefer.
And possibly the worst thing you can do is rush. Rushed fills sound particularly awful. Dragging is bad, but rushing is worse.
And as stated by others, to achieve great 'feel' you absolutely have to relax, and know the material. Don't overthink stuff, let the music play you.

Juat to share....

Yes, Timing.

I auditioned and did well. The second call back I kinda lost it.

The drummer told me to go back to the metronome. It worked for me.

I am more in the pocket and mote confident. Now I can concentrate on what the other musicians in the auditiom room are doing. And follow or lead them as needed.


Also, stay simple. No need to show off, do your job. Lock down the bottem end.

And---dynamics. Play softer over the verse, let the singer shine thru! ---keep that lower volume at a consistent volume. Don't waver in time, and don't waver in volume.

Choose a dynamic level for each part of the song, and then lock that in solid, and keep that volume level thru that part.

Change levels when the chorus comes up. -louder- but be ready to reign it in on verse 2!

So, timing and dynamics.

Also, chart out songs and learn the parts. Bring your book to the audition, glance at the parts to be sure--- or read out of the book as you play.

You will know the parts and the arrangement, and then you can focus less on playing and more on feeling the song, and helping/letting/allowing the whole band to "BREATHE"!!!!


Easy to say. Harder to do. I am not quite there yet myself, but I am getting close.

Experience will bring it out of you. Its in there, keep playing and practicing.....

Rokkitt

 

[bassinplace]

Last night I auditioned for a band. They're a bunch of veteran players with some younger people because they're awesome and want to share experience/teach hands on/just want to play. I was blown away when I first walked in there because the main guy had a '70 fender jazz, 3 different ampeg heads not to mention a 4x10 and a 8x10. I started playing along with Can't buy me love and Sunshine of your love and such with them. The one guy who I contacted for the audition said I was good but I lacked the feel. That got me all worried about everything I was doing and took from my confidence. I was worrying about how long the note was, how hard to attack, whether to play the root note to keep a beat or whether to fancy things up with fills here and there. I don't exactly know what it all means and if anyone could offer up any advice on it.


I thought I was actually starting to get the hang of everything. For the record, I love that I got called out on this. I feel it'll advance my listening skills and playing skills.

I've been playing bass for about 6 mos. now, but I've been a drummer for 16 yrs and I know the kind of experience you're referring to. Don't worry about it, what they're basically telling you is you are not at the proficiency level that they are, chops wise. Doesn't mean you won't get there, it just means that this was a stepping stone along the way. Just keep playing out, keep doing what you're doing. As long as your having fun, that's all that really matters. It all comes together with time.

 

[Disappear]

I've been playing bass for about 6 mos. now, but I've been a drummer for 16 yrs and I know the kind of experience you're referring to. Don't worry about it, what they're basically telling you is you are not at the proficiency level that they are, chops wise. Doesn't mean you won't get there, it just means that this was a stepping stone along the way. Just keep playing out, keep doing what you're doing. As long as your having fun, that's all that really matters. It all comes together with time.

Thank you for that comment. It's probably one of the best I've read on this page so far.

 

[Stumbo]

Here are a few TB links you might want to check out:
Playing behind/ahead of the beat
"Feel"
Playing "in the pocket"

 

[Buxtehude]

Read Victor Wooten's "The Music Lesson". In it Wooten spends a lot of time talking good sense about groove and feel in an entertaining manner. Who better to learn feel off.

 

[lunarpollen]

You can have all the technique, dexterity, and skill in the world and not have any "feel"... And then there are those who have crude technique, who can't play anything complicated or especially clever, but who have amazing "feel"... It's really difficult to explain or define in words. "Feel" sort of exists at that intersection of sensuality and emotion. It almost seems innate and instinctual, but it's definitely something that can develop over time.

 

[slybass3000]

The main thing about the feel is that you have to understand and be aware (feel) what you are playing and the impact it has on the music. Very simple. It is part of listening while you play.

 

[NCD]

I'm in the reverse position of the OP. I've had great feel for decades but theory always frustrated me to the point that I walked away from music entirely... six times.

This went on until I learned arpeggios in ii-V-I and 12 bar blues. Now when I get frustrated with theory I walk away from the theory for a day or so but I walk TO the instrument, and just play by goofing off with the arpeggios and changes I know. This has kept the fun in playing for me, so I don't quit. I just go back to theory the next day, after I've had my fun break.

Now... about feel.

In layman's terms, do this:

Hum the line. Leave the bass in the stand and just hum a line, any line. Put your heart into it... give the notes personality , it's in the way that you hum them.

Feel it come from the top of your chest, where it joins your throat. Like a singer, let it literally flow from your heart, up out your throat and give the line life in the way you hum (sing) it.

Now... what if you did the same exact thing but instead of humming from your chest, you take that emotion that comes from your heart and let it flow through the bass, using the bass to make the sound instead of you humming it?

James Jamerson Jr. said the best advice his dad ever gave him was: "If you don't feel it, don't play it."

Listen to the youtube vid of Ryan Butler doing the line for Darling Dear. Now, hum it with all the subtle emotions that you hear in the line.

I'm working on that line and I can tell you that even after you have the notes and they rhythmic timing down, there are two more things that you need...

- You need to pay attention to if there is silence between notes or if they're allowed to ring as they flow from one to the next. even if that silence is only for less than a tenth of a second. Getting that right makes all the difference in the world to the way the line comes alive when you play it.

- You need to sing the line, through your bass, like a playful spirit skipping along and enjoying some teasing horseplay with friends as it skips, bobs, weaves and dances along. That's what I've always understood the term feel to mean.

When you have that down, you use your "voice" inflection to almost instinctively attack harder or soften your play at the right times... kind of the way you instinctively keep your voice down in a theater or raise it to speak to someone across the street. You don't think about it, you jsut do it because it seems like common sense once you have that feel.

But it does take time to get the hang of. I developed mine over the years of listening to music with a critical ear when I was a kid.

Good luck.

 

[Russell L]

Here:

Take a one-measure line, a simple one, simple as possible, and play it til you drop. Relax, and let your hands become floppy. Hit with a light touch once you get going for awhile, as if you hands were weightless. Don't ever stop, just keep going. Over time, you will begin to feel the lick differently. Over more time, and you will begin to manipulate it to feel different according to what you have in mind. Do different dynamics, different punctuation, whatever along the way. Just don't stop. And don't give up just because nothing happens in the first few minutes. But, don't analyze it, just let it happen. The "Feel" will begin in your hands and move up your wrists and arms into all of you. You may have to go for thirty minutes straight the first time, but the magic will come. Let your mind clear and let the lick become your "Om" like in transcendental meditation.

I swear to you that this works. This is no bull, and I'm not some kook. It works so good that it has become all I wanna do at practice anymore, and I've been playing for decades. I'm also a working bass player with more gigs than I can shake a stick at. Just try it, ok? When it dawns on you, then you will know exactly what everyone means by "feel" and "groove."

 

[BassyBill]

Wow, Stumbo - you dug up an old thread here!

 

[pacojas]

You can have all the technique, dexterity, and skill in the world and not have any "feel"... And then there are those who have crude technique, who can't play anything complicated or especially clever, but who have amazing "feel"... It's really difficult to explain or define in words. "Feel" sort of exists at that intersection of sensuality and emotion. It almost seems innate and instinctual, but it's definitely something that can develop over time.

+1

NAILED IT!!!

feel has absolutely nothing to do with proficiency. we all know rank amatures who just FEEL IT! it freaks me out when i hear/see it. it's not just music.

actors, artists, athletes, etc. are all included. even soldiers can have a "feel" for survival,combat, and mayhem.

 

[Stumbo]

 

[makkE]

Here:

Take a one-measure line, a simple one, simple as possible, and play it til you drop. Relax, and let your hands become floppy. Hit with a light touch once you get going for awhile, as if you hands were weightless. Don't ever stop, just keep going. Over time, you will begin to feel the lick differently. Over more time, and you will begin to manipulate it to feel different according to what you have in mind. Do different dynamics, different punctuation, whatever along the way. Just don't stop. And don't give up just because nothing happens in the first few minutes. But, don't analyze it, just let it happen. The "Feel" will begin in your hands and move up your wrists and arms into all of you. You may have to go for thirty minutes straight the first time, but the magic will come. Let your mind clear and let the lick become your "Om" like in transcendental meditation.

I swear to you that this works. This is no bull, and I'm not some kook. It works so good that it has become all I wanna do at practice anymore, and I've been playing for decades. I'm also a working bass player with more gigs than I can shake a stick at. Just try it, ok? When it dawns on you, then you will know exactly what everyone means by "feel" and "groove."

This is something I have stumbled upon lately as well. It's fun and does a lot to improve both playing and listening.

One thing I do to train "feel" is taking a piece or line I wrote and try to play it every couple of days, but I try to put one prominent emotion into it - just like I feel that day. Be that angry, jolly, sad, content, hopeful, whatever. Just trying to approach it diffrently all the time, and bring out the feel of the moment as good as possible.

 

[Russell L]

This is something I have stumbled upon lately as well. It's fun and does a lot to improve both playing and listening.

One thing I do to train "feel" is taking a piece or line I wrote and try to play it every couple of days, but I try to put one prominent emotion into it - just like I feel that day. Be that angry, jolly, sad, content, hopeful, whatever. Just trying to approach it diffrently all the time, and bring out the feel of the moment as good as possible.

Thank goodness someone else has also found this to be true. It's beyond study, but just takes time and letting go. The hardest thing is to find feel quickly in a live situation when the song only lasts 3-4 minutes. I tried that yesterday at a gig. What I found was that having found it at home, I could get a reasonable facsimile of it because I could recognize it, so to speak.

 

[mambo4]

feel has absolutely nothing to do with proficiency.

I disagree. I believe "Feel" requires proficiency, at least to the degree that technique issues for the particular piece are no longer a matter of conscious thought.
With your mind freed from worrying about mechanics and theory, you can focus your awareness to the emotional content of the music.

Chops, technique, theory, accurate tempo, rhythm subdivisions... etc these are the parts, which you can teach
groove/feel is a result of mastering these parts to the degree that they don't inetrfere with your ability play what's inside your head/heart.

Groove/feel can't exist without the other stuff.

I really dig Anthony Wellington's take on awareness.

 

[dvh]

I disagree. I believe "Feel" requires proficiency, at least to the degree that technique issues for the particular piece are no longer a matter of conscious thought.
With your mind freed from worrying about mechanics and theory, you can focus your awareness to the emotional content of the music.

Chops, technique, theory, accurate tempo, rhythm subdivisions... etc these are the parts, which you can teach
groove/feel is a result of mastering these parts to the degree that they don't inetrfere with your ability play what's inside your head/heart.

Groove/feel can't exist without the other stuff.

I really dig Anthony Wellington's take on awareness.

Entirely agree. Thanks for the link. Inspiring and motivating!

 

[Russell L]

Well, that's a fact that there must be some proficiency. Try turning your bass over and getting a good line going with feel, playing backwards. Gotta get a little good at it first.

 

[miltslackford]

If you are a little bit paranoid now about your 'feel', and the reason is you haven't really considered it before, then it's probably a good thing in the long run. We all go through phases where people make us realise something we haven't considered and we need to up our game to feel at ease with ourselves.

Feel does develop through time, but remember that it develops through LISTENING really hard, and adjusting with intention, then listening again. Reggae is a good style to study for feel, since the lines are simple but it gets you to focus really hard on feel.