I can see alot of guys moving that way for ampless /iem rigs it is looking like it will tick alot of boxes. It is a great time to be a bassist.
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The Great Bass Preamp/DI Comparison
- Thread starter chadhargis
- Start date
Haven't been following the Berg Super Pre development; I assume it will be more like a Helix Stomp than a tube DI(?)
Yeah, no real tube but I hear a heat tube emulator. Drive and compression but no other "effects" like a Helix. More like a BAmp in a pedal. Best guess from what I've seen.
Although I haven't had time to re-evaluate since HX 3.50 dropped, I went down this same road a few months ago comparing the HXS to a UA6176 and a Noble (with additional Lightning Boy Audio transformers). For straight-ahead P and flats gigs, it's the Noble for me.
But for event band gigs (or, really, anything calling for multiple modern bass-synth tones), the HXS's insane versatility-per-pedalboard-square-inch has saved me a lot of gig-to-gig reconfiguring.
Here's a dedicated Super Pre thread (pg 17 provides a rough pic, and footprint dimensions)…
ummmm,....anyone have any info on this? Bergantino content
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So do you have/keep both? I love the form factor and all in one part of the HXS. My thought when starting this exploration was to get to an all in one device. Replace my analog stuff. I just can't seem to pull the trigger. I'm not sure how much I'd change settings on a gig. Do I make a patch for every song? Use just one great sounding patch all night? It seems like for live use and multiple patches that the XL version would be better, but it's also bigger. The HXS fits on my Nano. Do I put it on that, keep my tuner pedal and use the Tap Tuner button as a 3rd effect option?
Analysis Paralysis
Thought I'd throw in some input here as I heavily rely on my HXS for all my gigs. The Stomp is quite flexible, so you can set it up in a way that works best for you.
I can elaborate further if you like, but:
I generally use one main patch for most of my gigs that has my most used effects, and then have a small handful of patches for any songs that have highly specific sounds. Synth stuff is handled by a Future Impact or C4. FS1-3 on the Stomp are assigned to effects. FS4-5, tuner and various other control functions are on the Morningstar.
My main patch currently uses 7 of 8 blocks in the signal chain:
Deluxe comp > 10 Band EQ > Bass Octaver > Auto Filter > Teemah overdrive > Obsidian distortion > 4-Voice Chorus
But for an 80's band that often counts off the next song even as the current one is ending, I have multiple (12!) copies of that patch saved with specific blocks (or combos of) turned on, and we have a MIDI setup that calls up specific patches as needed (for the entire band), controls lights, and click/backing tracks. Patch changes come super quick and turn on several effects at once, and there are even a couple changes in the middle of songs that go from synth pedals to HXS and back. Stuff I couldn't do if I had the tapdance of a traditional analog board.
5sg.
That sounds so cool. I've dreamt of being in a band that is that organized. What is the source of all the midi triggers? Are the triggers programmed from start to finish or does someone in the band push the buttons? Tell me more!
Our synth guy has his stuff set up like that. He swipes to a new song on his iPad and his keys all switch to the new setting. It may be thru Mainstage on his MacBook Pro. We don't have it set up for the whole band though.
I typically don't switch amp models unless I'm trying to cop a specific tone. I use the SVT amp and pretty much set it and forget it. There are a lot of options out there for the "SVT in a pedal" type preamp...but none come close to the Line6 gear. For less money than I'd spend on a Noble, Oracle, etc....I have a pedal that's small, portable, has multiple effects, can switch sounds on the fly, can be midi controlled or control other midi devices, and loads more stuff.
From a purely economic standpoint, the Pod Go is the common sense piece of kit. I've seen them selling for $300 on Reverb. I think I paid $550 for my used HX Stomp and I do use some of the extra features, but the Pod Go is what I reach for more often as a stand along. It has a bigger screen, a volume pedal (which is great for doing swells on a Jazz bass that has two volume controls making it hard to do it with the volume knob). The Pod Go really has all the power I'd ever need. But the HX Stomp could be a stand alone rig...just toss it in your gig bag and go.
I'll try to keep this as brief as possible, as I know this is the Great Preamp thread, but @SteveC brought up the question originally, so it makes sense to continue a quick post about it. If anyone's interested further, feel free to DM me directly and I'm happy to answer questions, or if there's even enough interest, I could maybe start a thread on how it's all set up. 
It's entirely automated.
The MD has a laptop that runs Show Buddy, which functions essentially like iTunes in action. Each song has a file that lets you load backing tracks, program lighting cues, and add MIDI commands at any given point in the song. You can arrange show files in a playlist, and then the only thing you have to do to get through the show is hit the go button for each file. The MD has it wired to a foot pedal under his keyboards.
EDIT: The MD also has commands programmed to control the Future Impact as well, which we use quite a bit for songs as well. Lots of synth bass in 80's stuff.
There are pros and cons to running a click of course, but it does allow for all that cool automation that couldn't really be done otherwise. We're a 5-piece band, so it lets us fill out the sound a little bit too. We have things like the party crowd noise for Love Shack, song cues, and bits and pieces for songs that would require other/more equipment all programmed into the backing tracks. (i.e. we're not Milli Vanilli. No programmed vocals! lol). Lighting is programmed with cool stuff like bringing up spots to highlight specific people at certain times, stage washes, strobes, etc. as well. It brings the show to a much higher level, with way more consistency from night to night.
I have a couple redundancies programmed into my setup to let me control my board that way as well.
1) ForScore for charts lets me program MIDI commands, so just your synth guy, I can change my entire board up just by pulling up a chart. Add in a bluetooth page turner, and again... don't even need to mess with the board.
2) I've also got MIDIPad, which basically functions as a touch controller for my board. I don't use this app much anymore though, since the addition of the MC6.
3) The Morningstar is where it's at. I've got it set up so that I can do the patch changes for the 80's band on my own if needed, including momentary changes in the middle of songs. You can program up to 16 commands per footswitch with a variety of presses (short press, long press, double press, momentary, etc). And I've got my expression pedal routed through the MC6 so I can use it with the Stomp, C4 or FI (or multiple at once).
5sg.
It's entirely automated.
The MD has a laptop that runs Show Buddy, which functions essentially like iTunes in action. Each song has a file that lets you load backing tracks, program lighting cues, and add MIDI commands at any given point in the song. You can arrange show files in a playlist, and then the only thing you have to do to get through the show is hit the go button for each file. The MD has it wired to a foot pedal under his keyboards.EDIT: The MD also has commands programmed to control the Future Impact as well, which we use quite a bit for songs as well. Lots of synth bass in 80's stuff.
There are pros and cons to running a click of course, but it does allow for all that cool automation that couldn't really be done otherwise. We're a 5-piece band, so it lets us fill out the sound a little bit too. We have things like the party crowd noise for Love Shack, song cues, and bits and pieces for songs that would require other/more equipment all programmed into the backing tracks. (i.e. we're not Milli Vanilli. No programmed vocals! lol). Lighting is programmed with cool stuff like bringing up spots to highlight specific people at certain times, stage washes, strobes, etc. as well. It brings the show to a much higher level, with way more consistency from night to night.
I have a couple redundancies programmed into my setup to let me control my board that way as well.
1) ForScore for charts lets me program MIDI commands, so just your synth guy, I can change my entire board up just by pulling up a chart. Add in a bluetooth page turner, and again... don't even need to mess with the board.
2) I've also got MIDIPad, which basically functions as a touch controller for my board. I don't use this app much anymore though, since the addition of the MC6.
3) The Morningstar is where it's at. I've got it set up so that I can do the patch changes for the 80's band on my own if needed, including momentary changes in the middle of songs. You can program up to 16 commands per footswitch with a variety of presses (short press, long press, double press, momentary, etc). And I've got my expression pedal routed through the MC6 so I can use it with the Stomp, C4 or FI (or multiple at once).
5sg.
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Thanks @fivestringgecko, that was an educational read. I've done some work with click and sounds programmed in Ableton, but this is next level. Better get myself a Stomp it seems.
After a couple weeks of circular logic and analysis paralysis, I think I am going to just keep what I have (Empress Bass Compressor/Bass Soul Food/REDDI) for now. It sounds amazing. It's not THAT bad to carry in the Pelican case and set up. All my cables are made to fit this set up. All the back and forth debate with myself has wore me out mentally. Gonna forget about it for a while and just play and enjoy the amazing sound of my basses.
I hear ya. I get in that same mode and then realize I need to just simplify and keep what I've got.
That's what I ultimately did, but I went the other direction.
As the OP in the thread, you can get a glimpse into all the various preamps I have bought, tried, and sold. If I added up the money I have lost searching for "the tone", I would probably cry.
I finally realized...I have a problem. It's called boredom. I try something, love it....then a few days, weeks, months later....I'm like..."eh...it's good...but I bet _________ sounds even better" and the cycle begins.
I finally decided to try the digital stuff again because when I get tired of a specific tone....I have thousands of options to try. Ultimately I end up coming back to where I stated, but my lust for the perfect tone is satisfied for a brief period.
I am ultimately an Ampeg sound person. I own two Ampeg amps...an STV-7 Pro and a PF-50T. My preferred patches on my Line6 devices are the SVT. I've come to the point that I really don't tinker much with my patches anymore. It's sort of like that scene in the moving Wargames where they make the computer play tic-tac-toe with itself until it figures out that there is no way to win. It's the same with tone. My needs will always be changing, my ears (as I age) will continue to change, my skill will continue to change. So it's a moving target. There is no way to "win" unless you have a piece of gear that can change with you.
Regarding the OP (fully recognizing that it is several years old now), I got my first chance to try a (new) Tone Hammer DI box not too long ago. I was already aware of the AGS limitation, but when I plugged it up in place of my usual Radial JDI, what I immediately noticed was that my signal was unacceptably hissy. Not that the hiss was really that noticeable from my bass amp, but it was unacceptable enough in my monitor that I figured it would be also unacceptable in the House feed. Does this match anyone else's impression/experience with the standalone Tone Hammer Preamp/Direct Box ? Tks.
Not at all. My Tone Hammer was quiet...at least to the best of my memory.
The problem with these mega threads is that so much time as passed and I've gained so much experience with gear as well as my skill improvement...that what I typed all that time ago may no longer apply. I'm sure if I went back and listed to some of the stuff that impressed me years ago, I'd be indifferent to it now.
Yeah, another word for boredom could be G.A.S. or vise versa.
Again, you make a good argument for trying digital. It gets maybe 90% or better to analog sound. And yeah, lots of options that are updated fairly regularly. Although I don't know how many new amps/cabs have been added recently? Tastes change. What you have liked for the last couple years may be different now. Gig changed. Personnel changed. Whatever.
I guess I have never "needed" an amp to get "my sound" for a while now. That could be an argument either way. See how easy it is to suffer analysis paralysis?
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