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The vintage sound

#25
We have plenty of 60s/70s bands at the venue I run. Searchers, Tremelos, Gerry and the Pacemakers - those kinds of bands, and without fail the authentic sound comes from the guitar and the player. Their bass rigs are old, tired, battered and road worn. They play solid and low. They don't play clever and they don't add in twiddly bits. So the guitars are the support right at the bottom. The old cabs go 'duh' and have no top end at all, because the songs don't need it. They palm mute, pick, pluck and that's about it. They don't play 5 strings, and they don't use pedals - just plugging straight in. A Fender Jazz straight into the amp - and it sounds just as it did in the 60s. See a more modern player, with after market pickups, and an amp with a clean, modern, bright tone, and some pedals and it doesn't sound authentic. I've got an old semi-acoustic 4 string - made in Finland I think, and it sounds horrible, dull and flat sounding. However, turn it up, and play it loud and it goes back in time.
 
#26
Except for Entwistle ;) Man, that's cool you work with all those bands. I work with a lot of their counterparts in the States. Always loved the British Invasion pop bands.
 
#27
I go for the "old" bass sound because I suck, and it fits good with my playing and our songs. Old tube amps sized for the situation, and old, huge bass cabs with 15s give you that sound. And like others have said, just hobble any modern gear by dialing down the treble and making sure they don't really do much below 100Hz, and you have the vintage rig. Turn down the treble on your bass until you can hear the point that mid-bass takes over, and you have it nailed.

Example:
http://youtu.be/6GjUVoyI9JU

Fender Modern Player Telecaster Bass, Magnavox-era V4B amp with B25B cab with (2) new Eminence Legend 15s. Ampeg run flat on the EQ, and the tone on the bass turned about half-way down. It sounds vintage to me, but I may be wrong.

Chris
 
#29
paulears : I agree fully although I seem to remember seeing more Precisions than Jazz basses. One more thing - they also didn't have a whole lot of really low bottom end either. The Fender Bassman and Ampeg SVT seem to be the stereotypical amps of the era.

This scenario began to change in the mid-70s. Roundwounds were used more often and guys began going for a lot more high end in their sound, likely emulating Entwhistle. More low end also actually. The Acoustic and Sunn folded horns became popular as did after-market pickups for Precisions, particularly DiMarzios and BadAss bridges and brass nuts became common mods.
 
#30
Frank in the Searchers used to play a Jazz, but mostly now does play Precision - although because he's not a big lad, it's a huge guitar. John is now playing a new Rickenbacker 12 str - which sounds just the same as the old one to my ears. I've been trying to learn some popular songs from the 60s - California surf music, and on many of the recordings, although you can hear a bass, what is being played has to remain a mystery. What I thought I had heard being wrecked by a youtube clip clearly showing the bottom string being played, yet missing from the audio - I thought it was the octave E!
 
#33
Jim Carr said:
Oh---want to add that I have used or owned almost all the big and small american and british bass amps of the 60's and early 70's (Fender, Ampeg, Vox, Sunn, Kustom, Standel, Traynor, Epiphone). With a few exceptions from '68-'73 (SVT, 2000s, ACC 360/310), they were mostly ALL quite limited for live performance in medium to large crowded bars, IMHO. Any typical 210 Vox, Fender vibroluxe, super reverb, twin, or 412 Marshall would bury them. With two guitars, drums, keys, and a vocals only PA—forget it.
Click to expand...

Traynor is Canadian. (Sorry, I couldn't resist)
 
#34
Much of 60's Brit Invasion stuff had a sound do to the way it was recorded.
Lots of tape saturation and mild distortion. You could hardly hear the bass part.
I had to play the 33 rpm (thats vinyl for you digital babies) at 45 rpm to hear the bass at all. Cassady, McCartney, Chandler (classic EBO player) began to change the tone of the bass. Recording also began to be taken more seriously as well. The basses used as well Framus, Hofner, EBO all strung with flats had weak pitch definition. When combined with drums and guitars and engineers that had little real experience recording this style of music ran through all analog recording gear and you get a glorious warm ball of sound that had a unique sound. There is a show on Palladium called Later with Jules Holland and a few episodes back a very young band was emulating the sound of a early 60's Brit blues band, think Pretty Things or Stones. Very simple kit, short scale EBO bass and simple guitar riffs. Close to sound of the original tone of the 60's.
 
#35
Type-55 said:
Much of 60's Brit Invasion stuff had a sound do to the way it was recorded.
Lots of tape saturation and mild distortion. You could hardly hear the bass part.
I had to play the 33 rpm (thats vinyl for you digital babies) at 45 rpm to hear the bass at all. Cassady, McCartney, Chandler (classic EBO player) began to change the tone of the bass. Recording also began to be taken more seriously as well. The basses used as well Framus, Hofner, EBO all strung with flats had weak pitch definition. When combined with drums and guitars and engineers that had little real experience recording this style of music ran through all analog recording gear and you get a glorious warm ball of sound that had a unique sound. There is a show on Palladium called Later with Jules Holland and a few episodes back a very young band was emulating the sound of a early 60's Brit blues band, think Pretty Things or Stones. Very simple kit, short scale EBO bass and simple guitar riffs. Close to sound of the original tone of the 60's.
Click to expand...

Didn't Chandler play an Epiphone Rivoli?
 
#40
Type-55 said:
Sorry had my numbers mixed up. Gibson Model EB 2 is the one referring to the 30" hollow body, single neck pup made by Gibson and used by many Brit Invasion pop bands.
Click to expand...

The Epiphone Rivoli was much more popular in the UK. I owned an EB2. Then I bought a used Fender P in January 68. After one rehearsal with the Precision the Gibson felt like a plank. I never played it again.
 

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