The world is topsy turvy

[ac100X]

In the San Francisco Bay Area we can only dream of houses costing only $500,000 (or 250 new Fender P basses).

 

[jd56hawk]

yup, that's the one. I originally missed the part about the finish contamination but my point about discounting a pre distressed instrument because of additional distressing being somewhat humorous stands. My post was never intended to do anything other than point out the irony of this. All that said I think that the JMJ bass is a very cool instrument that I would love to have, relected or not. but I would prefer NOT.

Yes, definitely funny.
Contamination is funny, too.
Sounds like something a Japanese seller might say.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

That wasn't really my point. There's debt that's unavoidable but it's important to realize that the debt dealers do not give us impartial financial advice. When we bought our first house together, we worked out what we could afford and that was significantly lower (like 25% lower) than what the bank was offering us. My having lived through the 90s UK housing bubble where bass and sax gigs were putting food on my table, there was no way we were going to buy more house than we could comfortably afford.

From working inside the banking industry for most of 30 years, I totally understand predatory lending. And having dealt a fair amount of people in financial crisis, myself included when we first got married. I would love to expand on my post. Unfortunately it would violate the rules of this message board. But if you send me a PM, I can give out more information you may find enlightening and or useful.

Cheers.

 

[JazznFunk]

So billionaires may be an exception to this general rule. But even they seem to behave like they need more money.

Wherever you are on the spectrum, remember that someone with more than you thinks they are not rich, and someone with less than you thinks you are rich.

*Really, income is a bad way to look at this. Net worth is a much better measure, but it's subject to the same definition problem.

Honestly, it comes down to this: in 'Forrest Gump', there was that one scene where he says 'Momma said there's only so much fortune a man really needs, and the rest is just for showing off.' 'Lifestyle creep' is a real thing, as is income inequality.

If you've got enough left over after all is said and done to 'show off'.... then you're doing better than many.

The billionaires act like they 'need' more money because they're addicted to it like a drug. They confuse 'want' with 'need.' And you can't take any of it with you when you go.

The late Chris Cornell succinctly summed it up in 'Halfway There', from the last Soundgarden record:

'If you've got a car
and somewhere to sleep
someone who loves you and
something to eat-

I would say you're doing better than most
but maybe not as well as some.'

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Just wait until the "Bass subscription" plans start!

Base (bah dum tssh) Price: Unplugged use only ($15/mo)
Tier 1 Plan: Output enabled, Electronics activated for Bridge pickup only ($20/mo)
Tier 2 Plan: Output enabled, Electronics activated for Bridge and Neck pickups ($25/mo)
Artist Tier Plan: Output and both pickups enabled, Volume and tone knobs for both unlocked ($35/mo)
Pro Tier Plan: All features plus live performance and recording allowed without being sued ($50/mo)

Legal Disclaimer:
- All basses are outfitted with 5G wireless capabilities and always-on microphone to ensure proper activation of tier options. Any loss of connection, tampering, or unreasonable damage will result in a fine of up to $50,000.
- We reserve the right to acquire and store location and audio data for quality assurance. Age verification is required to prevent minors from handling basses or playing Seven Nation Army more than once per week.
- We acquire rights to all performances and recordings made on this bass when the subscription ceases.
- You may purchase the bass outright for its retail price at any time during the plan. 5G and microphone will not be removed, bass electronics will cease to work if connection to authentication servers is interrupted or we discontinue the service. In which case the bass will only be usable unplugged.
- We can revoke/cancel your subscription at any time as we see fit with no purpose required.
- If "Can't Stop" by RHCP is played at any time on this bass, it will self-destruct.

Hilarious!! In the list of disclaimers, this was missing. We are not responsible for liabilities that arise due to service interruptions

 

[DWA2469]

The current housing situation is a bit more nuanced than that. I worked in real estate advertising from 2006-2008 and saw the bubble and the bust firsthand. Lost my job, and bounced among 3 different jobs in the 3 years after trying to stay afloat.... on top of playing gigs to pay the bills. Those years fundamentally changed my perspective on credit, risk, banking, and the push to own a home. Greed was rampant and everyone wanted to cash in, at all levels. But I digress...

Lax lending standards leading up to 2008's meltdown, with shadow banks lending to people who absolutely had no income and no way to pay back those loans, and predatory practices where they didn't (and weren't required) to disclose the massive resets, did entice people to buy homes they couldn't really afford because 'homes always go up in value!' They were making MASSIVE commissions off of pushing these toxic loans, and the shadow banks/creditors were selling the new no doc/no income loans as fast as they could print them to investment banks to be packaged up into securities - crap sold as gold. When people stopped paying their loans and went into bankruptcy, the leveraged MBS's and credit default swaps sold as 'investment grade' instruments on Wall Street that they were selling people all around the world unwound and sent the entire system into massive collapse. The banks were ultimately at fault, not the buyers. But a lot of people DID make a lot of poor buying decisions fueled by 'easy equity' and greed, for sure. People should have known better, but so should the sharks who sold them the loans.

Then, the rich individual buyers who were insulated from the chaos, and corporate real estate interests (BlackRock, etc) snapped up those foreclosed homes after the crash when the average person couldn't afford them, while they were rebuilding their lives and their employment, during one of the worst unemployment periods of the new millennium. Then, they turned around and rented those homes out in the ensuing years while amassing equity, preventing the average homebuyer from having a shot at purchasing anything at a reasonable price as the economy recovered and home prices blossomed again. Now, we have a problem of not enough supply on the market, and not enough new homes being built. Builders went from selling air and floorplans in open fields for future homes to be built pre-2008 to building virtually NOTHING in the almost 20 years since. The people who own homes are staying in them, and they often have multiple homes that they now rent out short and long term... never to be put on the market again for families to buy as their starter homes. Lending standards are so tight now that new home buyers are almost completely shut out of the market, when you consider that the median home price in many areas of the country is around $500-600k. When we bought our new-construction 'starter' home in 2015, it was right before the current run-up in prices.... we could NEVER afford the home we have now if we were in the market at its current valuation - tax value and resale value. On one level, I agree with you... now is NOT the time to try and buy a home. Smart decisions have to be made about income vs what one can afford - and banks will not lend to you without proof of income and assets these days. It's a TOUGH thing to get a home loan now. And wages have not kept pace with inflation and home prices for sure.

So- one can talk about the 'excessive supply of money' and inflation, but that's only part of the issue with housing. There are no 'bankers bearing gifts' anymore. That said, there are a LOT of people working to dismantle the safeguards put in place after 2008 to protect consumers. History doesn't necessarily repeat, but it often rhymes.

The house I owned from 2000-2010, there is no way I could afford to move back to that neighborhood! It is crazy!

 

[JazznFunk]

The house I owned from 2000-2010, there is no way I could afford to move back to that neighborhood! It is crazy!

Our home is only 10 years old, and was a very modest one-level new construction. It was the ONLY way we could control costs in the market back then, since we couldn't compete in bidding wars with the all cash offers from out of state buyers who wanted our 'cheap' real estate for existing homes, and it truly was a rare turnkey 'starter home' in our area. My wife saw the 'future build' signs before they even broke ground, called, and got the info. She saved our butts in every way possible because our search even THEN for a home that wouldn't have required major work was getting nowhere. Our recent tax reassessment saw an almost 130% increase in its valuation because of other homes which sold around us in the same neighborhood (larger floorplans, more upgrades from the start). Everyone loves to talk about equity, but the property taxes are the snake in the grass waiting to bite. Our home's tax value is higher than its current market value, in an already 'hot' area. Unless we have to move for work, etc or eventually can no longer afford the taxes, this will be our 'forever home'.

 

[Plectrum72]

Top 10% could still be paycheck to paycheck depending on the cost of living in your area. Additionally, you can be in the top 10% and still be considered middle class. If you are debt free (or at least revolving credit debt free), you should be doing well. However, if you have student loans, a mortgage (or worse, rent), children, and a car loan (on top of basic utilities, groceries, gas, etc.), you (like many) may be one medical emergency away from being underwater instead of swimming for shore. Some basic stats for the US below.

Key Income Thresholds for Top 10% (2025-2026 Data):

• National Household Threshold: Approximately $210,000 - $251,000 annually.
• Individual Earner Threshold: Begins around $135,000 - $148,000.
• Regional Variations (Income):
  • • West: $227,000
    • Northeast: $222,000
    • South: $205,000
    • Midwest: $198,000

Key 2026 Middle Class Income Metrics

• National Range: $74,021 – $222,064.
• Median Household: ~$111,032.
• Regional Differences: In 2024, the minimum income for the middle class ranged from $39.4K in Mississippi to $69.9K in Massachusetts.
• Cost of Living Impact: In expensive, high-concentration areas like San Jose, California, the middle class can range from $90,819 to $272,458.

 

[JazznFunk]

However, if you have student loans, a mortgage (or worse, rent), children, and a car loan (on top of basic utilities, groceries, gas, etc.), you (like many) may be one medical emergency away from being underwater instead of swimming for shore. Some basic stats for the US below.

Most people have a mix of all of the above, so the universal 'time bomb' is the catastrophic medical emergency. Given the state of health care in this country (unaffordable at all levels unless you have regular employment with healthcare provided as a benefit), pretty much EVERYONE is susceptible to that one. Even if you have health insurance, all it takes is an insane deductible or for them to deny coverage for whatever reason they come up with. Then you're screwed.... especially since the provision against using medical debt to tank your credit was revoked by the 'powers that be' not too long ago. One of the biggest scams and dangers to peoples' financial security is having the only affordable health care coverage options tied to full time employment.

(apologies to the OP for this getting so off topic)

 

[BioDriver]

There is going to be a point where they find out that nobody can afford to buy anything anymore. That point is approaching rapidly.

We’ve reached a point where every segment is outpacing inflation thanks to the way we calculate it. When YOY price indexes are growing at over twice the YOY wage growth, demand for nonessentials is going to go way down. This is economics 101

 

[Major Seven]

There is going to be a point where they find out that nobody can afford to buy anything anymore. That point is approaching rapidly.

New cars.

 

[Major Seven]

The genuine scratches probably highlight the fakery!

When I tried the Fender CS basses the "relic" work was laughably fake - it didn't even include belt-buckle rash on the back. Not something I would pay a cent for.

If the new scratch is not original part of the fake relic does that affect the value/price?

 

[DWA2469]

Our home is only 10 years old, and was a very modest one-level new construction. It was the ONLY way we could control costs in the market back then, since we couldn't compete in bidding wars with the all cash offers from out of state buyers who wanted our 'cheap' real estate for existing homes, and it truly was a rare turnkey 'starter home' in our area. My wife saw the 'future build' signs before they even broke ground, called, and got the info. She saved our butts in every way possible because our search even THEN for a home that wouldn't have required major work was getting nowhere. Our recent tax reassessment saw an almost 130% increase in its valuation because of other homes which sold around us in the same neighborhood (larger floorplans, more upgrades from the start). Everyone loves to talk about equity, but the property taxes are the snake in the grass waiting to bite. Our home's tax value is higher than its current market value, in an already 'hot' area. Unless we have to move for work, etc or eventually can no longer afford the taxes, this will be our 'forever home'.

I had to sell the house mentioned because of divorce! My new Wife and I built a new home in 2022 on 7 acres she inherited and her father GC'd the project for nothing, otherwise we would not have been able to afford what we ended up with! And I can tell you being my 3rd home, the Sq Ft cost to build made me sick! And it was done way below cost!