Amazing... I have never seen anything like this before... As others have already mentioned: Can't wait to see it when it's carved..!!!!!
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There's another storm brewing!
- Thread starter pilotjones
- Start date
Yes, the epoxy is messy, but I made a helluva mess using titebond too, so I'm not sure it's too different. It is a little more runny until it starts to gel, so it flows further than TB. It will run to the low end of a surface that isn't level faster than TB.
I cover the active area of the bench in wax paper before I do a glue-up. It's pretty cheap and it biodegrades. It would be nice to have a glue-up bench covered in melamine, where any glue would just pop off.
At this point I'm kind of torn between bevel-type carving, like an SG or like Suraj and others have done, or rounded à la Lefay or Ritter. I'm not thrilled with the look of mixed bevels and roundovers, either on examples I've seen so far or in my CAD.
I cover the active area of the bench in wax paper before I do a glue-up. It's pretty cheap and it biodegrades. It would be nice to have a glue-up bench covered in melamine, where any glue would just pop off.
At this point I'm kind of torn between bevel-type carving, like an SG or like Suraj and others have done, or rounded à la Lefay or Ritter. I'm not thrilled with the look of mixed bevels and roundovers, either on examples I've seen so far or in my CAD.
With the overall aesthetic of the design, I vote rounded rather than beveled, but I'm pretty sure it'll look fantastic either way.
Agreed that a combo of the two doesn't usually work.
But, hey, yours could be one of the exceptions...
Agreed that a combo of the two doesn't usually work.
But, hey, yours could be one of the exceptions...
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I feel like bevels might give a slightly more interesting look to all of the colored laminates.
Wing Separators
I started on the laminations that will separate the wings from the neck beam. I'm assembling them to either side of the neck beam, and some time after they're both done, the wings will go on.
First I made sure the surfaces on the sides of the neck beam were flat enough for a joint, since the veneers will just space out these surfaces in whatever form they are in. I was considering mounting sandpaper to the plate of one of the three mid-sized planes I have, but none of the plates are particularly flat. I found that the out feed table of my little jointer is pretty flat though, so I used that.
Did the scribble with pencil thing, and sanded until most was gone. The surfaces were pretty good off the router.
Glued up the first of the two separators. Nine layers of veneer in one shot--it was interesting to do. Lots of opportunity for "oops." Here it is in the clamps. It's upside down, so the veneers are under the beam. You can see some of the red layer there.
All the other surfaces at that end of the beam are masked off.
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This was very good. Malty but super crisp and clean. A session beer with some flavor. Snappy. A 70's hard ash J.
I started on the laminations that will separate the wings from the neck beam. I'm assembling them to either side of the neck beam, and some time after they're both done, the wings will go on.
First I made sure the surfaces on the sides of the neck beam were flat enough for a joint, since the veneers will just space out these surfaces in whatever form they are in. I was considering mounting sandpaper to the plate of one of the three mid-sized planes I have, but none of the plates are particularly flat. I found that the out feed table of my little jointer is pretty flat though, so I used that.
Did the scribble with pencil thing, and sanded until most was gone. The surfaces were pretty good off the router.
Glued up the first of the two separators. Nine layers of veneer in one shot--it was interesting to do. Lots of opportunity for "oops." Here it is in the clamps. It's upside down, so the veneers are under the beam. You can see some of the red layer there.
All the other surfaces at that end of the beam are masked off.
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This was very good. Malty but super crisp and clean. A session beer with some flavor. Snappy. A 70's hard ash J.
Got the first one out of the clamps, and used a flush cut saw to take off the excess.
Set up the second separator lamination. Glued it.
So, while it's in the clamps, would anyone care to speculate on what the 9-layer veneer laminations look like?
Set up the second separator lamination. Glued it.
So, while it's in the clamps, would anyone care to speculate on what the 9-layer veneer laminations look like?
Ha, thanks. Any other guesses? Think complexity of nine layers made simple...
Tonight I got some more Steinway-related stuff. Four boards (two before I cut them to fit my car) of hard maple. One board straight grain, no runout, the other straight with some ripple. Both 1-3/4" x 5-1/8" in near-s4s condition. Each about 5'7" after cutting.
They may have some bow to them, but I'll let them sit for a year before I make any judgement, as they've been in a garage for the past thirty years. They were the backbone of a string winder.
Tonight I got some more Steinway-related stuff. Four boards (two before I cut them to fit my car) of hard maple. One board straight grain, no runout, the other straight with some ripple. Both 1-3/4" x 5-1/8" in near-s4s condition. Each about 5'7" after cutting.
They may have some bow to them, but I'll let them sit for a year before I make any judgement, as they've been in a garage for the past thirty years. They were the backbone of a string winder.
This was very good. Malty but super crisp and clean. A session beer with some flavor. Snappy. A 70's hard ash J.
This is the beer i use to drink in this days!
I like weissbier too!
The Bigger Picture
Got the second separator lamination out of the clamps, and cleaned it up. Here's a close up of the lamination.
Then I wanted to make a "negative image" paper form to put over the beam and wings in position. Between the old Storm King and this Dark Storm, the line from the bass-side lower bout to the bass-side horn has changed, so I printed out a fresh print from CAD, checked its dimensions, taped it up, and cut it out.
And that's where the plot thickens.
I laid it over the beam and wings - as I had previously done with the Storm King body template - to find that there wasn't enough wood in some places!
It turns out that my SK body template, which I used to make SK as well as to lay out and cut the wood for DS, is half an inch shorter than the CAD. I'm pretty sure that three years ago I knew that the printer was compressing things in one direction and had just lived with it, but in the intervening time I had forgotten this.
As it turns out, I think I'll be able to use the actual, proper CAD design by shifting the wings to make it just fit. But there will be almost no tolerance in the glue up, it will have to be aligned very accurately.
Negative overlaid on the parts (upside down to show the back with the wing separator laminations, which will be hidden by the fretboard on the top side)
Proper positive overlaid on the parts, with maybe only 2-3 mm to spare in some places
Got the second separator lamination out of the clamps, and cleaned it up. Here's a close up of the lamination.
Then I wanted to make a "negative image" paper form to put over the beam and wings in position. Between the old Storm King and this Dark Storm, the line from the bass-side lower bout to the bass-side horn has changed, so I printed out a fresh print from CAD, checked its dimensions, taped it up, and cut it out.
And that's where the plot thickens.
I laid it over the beam and wings - as I had previously done with the Storm King body template - to find that there wasn't enough wood in some places!
It turns out that my SK body template, which I used to make SK as well as to lay out and cut the wood for DS, is half an inch shorter than the CAD. I'm pretty sure that three years ago I knew that the printer was compressing things in one direction and had just lived with it, but in the intervening time I had forgotten this.
As it turns out, I think I'll be able to use the actual, proper CAD design by shifting the wings to make it just fit. But there will be almost no tolerance in the glue up, it will have to be aligned very accurately.
Negative overlaid on the parts (upside down to show the back with the wing separator laminations, which will be hidden by the fretboard on the top side)
Proper positive overlaid on the parts, with maybe only 2-3 mm to spare in some places
I've been following this build with sheer fascination. I have trouble understanding when you talk about the "plan", but after each step, it just looks amazing.
Is it possible to take 1mm off the outside of the whole body? Or would that force you to redesign the control cavity as well.
Thanks!
Not a problem!
I think that the cool thing about it will be that the rainbow stripes will be hidden on the back, with just a touch showing from the front at the cutaways. The rainbow with black separations looks nice. I did another test without the blacks, and it was not nearly as good.
Thanks. I probably need to do a better job explaining the planning.
Yeah, I may try something like that. At least since SK1 was 1/2" shorter, I know I have some leeway. I'd like to preserve as much of the additional 1/2" as possible for balance reasons, since there's wenge in the neck.
The controls are definitely a consideration, but they are not set in stone yet. One thing that does enter into it is the fact that I already have the control cover cut into the treble wing, and that interacts the positions of both the controls and the pickup mounting screws.
Ah. I know the feeling. I have had similar problems on earlier projects. I had a printer that printed a slightly skewed image. Nobody will notice this under normal use, but using this as a base for a template is a bad idea....
It does seem like you can save this one, though. the glue up needs to be pretty exact, but I have no doubt that you are able to do that.
Alternativelyytou could cut a narrow wedge from the body wings (the part that run along the neck beam). This will rotate the wings a bit so that the horns fit closer into the "corner" of the pieces. That should give you a bit more room to work with. This will alter the angle of the grain pattern and the lid for the electronics cavity, but not drastically.
Everything looks very good so far. Especially the separator lams. They look incredibly nice and crisp.
It does seem like you can save this one, though. the glue up needs to be pretty exact, but I have no doubt that you are able to do that.
Alternativelyytou could cut a narrow wedge from the body wings (the part that run along the neck beam). This will rotate the wings a bit so that the horns fit closer into the "corner" of the pieces. That should give you a bit more room to work with. This will alter the angle of the grain pattern and the lid for the electronics cavity, but not drastically.
Everything looks very good so far. Especially the separator lams. They look incredibly nice and crisp.
I'm sure your explanations are fine - everyone else seems to be ok with them. I think it's my spacial relations and mental rendering processing chip - seems to give out after trying to deal with too many data points. I guess I need to upgrade my video board
Yes, I've been trying to figure the best way to make some accurate alignment pinholes.It does seem like you can save this one, though. the glue up needs to be pretty exact, but I have no doubt that you are able to do that.
Great idea!
Or, maybe take a thin, parallel slice off the joining surface, which then shifts over the entire piece while maintaining the grain directions. The only downside to that is it reduces the amount of leftover body that I have to make knobs out of, but I'll probably do that.
Thanks. I used that old block plane to take down some of the separator lams closer to the main surfaces. It worked pretty well. Or probably more accurately, I got a little better at using a plane.Everything looks very good so far. Especially the separator lams. They look incredibly nice and crisp.
Those laminated curls remind me of the rainbow cookies you can get at Italian bakeries...
Mmmm, you're making me hungry.
Planning the wing assembly
I decided to keep the design as is, to not trim up the wings, and to just do an accurate job gluing up. So I retransferred my index hole from the front to the back to be sure it is right, re-checked my centerline accuracy, and adjusted my wing positions with with respect to the neck beam, using the template. I have at least 2 mm to spare at any point now. Then I planned the alignment dowel placement, the wiring channels, et cetera--the features that have to be put into the wings or neck before gluing.
Next steps are making a hole drilling jig for drilling the alignment dowel holes, putting in those other holes, then making a glue-up board, and doing the glue-up.
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Let this serve as a warning.
I bought a mixed 12-pack of Sam Adams because it was the best thing they had available while I was at Target. Most of the garden variety SA are OK enough, but this...
was disgusting. It tasted like blueberry pop tarts. It tasked like someone put beer and fruit rollups in a blender.
The glass is empty because I tasted it, and then poured it down the drain.
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