Titanium saddles

[slantedpanted]

OK - ive read quite a bit bout titanium saddles - any fist hand users that can elaborate?

From what ive read titanium saddles maintain the warmness from brass saddles and the definition and highs from steel = best of both worlds?

And most of all - is the upgrade worth the $$?

 

[PhiDeck]

Did what you read involve double-blind testing? Links, please.

No first-hand experience here. However, spending spare cash on lessons - rather than pimping an adequate bass - is recommended by many.

 

[lowendgenerator]

All this snake oil makes me wish I had a CNC machine. I'd be making saddles out of every goofy metal I could think of. Hell, I'd even make some from bone. How cool would THAT be?

Sorry, I looked up the price on a set of 4 titanium saddles, and threw up a little.

 

[T-Bird]

Hi.

All this snake oil makes me wish I had a CNC machine. I'd be making saddles out of every goofy metal I could think of. Hell, I'd even make some from bone. How cool would THAT be?

No need to be wishing, buy one, problem solved.

Then try to make some saddles out of titanium and find out first hand why they're so expensive. Why anything milled out of titanium is so expensive when it's about 2 to 4€ per kilo as scrap.

BTW, any particular reason You think that making saddles would be impossible on a simple manually operated machine??.

Regards
Sam

 

[exmaxima1]

Sorry, I looked up the price on a set of 4 titanium saddles, and threw up a little.

I saw $95 for a set at one website!!

A 3/8" x 1' round Grade 2 (easy to machine) bar costs less than $20 at McMaster. I have a lathe and a Bridgeport, so maybe I'll make up a set for my Classic Vibe P-Bass and see how it goes...

 

[lowendgenerator]

I was just ranting about all of these boutique parts that people rave about. I honestly can't hear the difference between a BADASS bridge, or a cheap Squier. It seems like more marketing gimmick than anything else. The only reason I put BADASS bridges on my Fenders is because the screws don't back themselves out and disappear while I'm gigging. It's happened!

Maybe someone can tell me why a brass nut will give you more zingy open string notes, but brass saddles will give you a "warmer" tone?

I know I'm being a fly in the ointment, I just don't see what everyone else sees.

 

[testing1two]

I know I'm being a fly in the ointment, I just don't see what everyone else sees.

Actually, you just can't hear what certain people hear and that's ok. Some folks can't taste the difference between regular and decaf. If it doesn't improve your situation then dismiss it and keep on truckin.

In this example there are audible differences between low-mass and high-mass bridges and there are audible differences between Aluminum, Brass, Steel, and Titanium. In regards to the TI saddles, I tried a vintage styled titanium bridge with titanium threaded saddles and there was an noticeable increase in sustain and brightness in terms of note clarity. However, that wasn't what I wanted on the particular P-bass in question so I went back to a stock steel bridge & steel threaded saddles.

So, was there a noticeable difference? Yes. Was it better? Not for me.

 

[PleyswethSqwerl]

Actually, you just can't hear what certain people hear and that's ok. Some folks can't taste the difference between regular and decaf. If it doesn't improve your situation then dismiss it and keep on truckin.

In this example there are audible differences between low-mass and high-mass bridges and there are audible differences between Aluminum, Brass, Steel, and Titanium. In regards to the TI saddles, I tried a vintage styled titanium bridge with titanium threaded saddles and there was an noticeable increase in sustain and brightness in terms of note clarity. However, that wasn't what I wanted on the particular P-bass in question so I went back to a stock steel bridge & steel threaded saddles.

So, was there a noticeable difference? Yes. Was it better? Not for me.

It seems like titanium saddles would be really cool on a 1960s jazz bass with concentric knobs.
The reason being is that those basis is not known for a slap in note definition, I think it would be a cool enhancement for this particular instrument.

 

[96tbird]

So much lol. Why not use depleted uranium? I heard it sounds like most energetic of all, dude. Better to just give your cash to charity.

 

[PleyswethSqwerl]

So much lol. Why not use depleted uranium? I heard it sounds like most energetic of all, dude. Better to just give your cash to charity.

fortunately, saddle material does make a difference. I bought a KSM foundation bridge with aluminum saddles in and all aluminum base and it just didn't give me the tone I was looking for.

I now have a hipshot vintage bridge on my base and there is a significant difference in tone.

Titanium seems to give clarity to the note while being warm sounding. This may not be ideal for somebody who wants a warmer sounding instrument. However, if you were into slap bass. It's perfect. Simultaneously some people just can't hear changes in sound when bridge swapping. That's what makes us all unique some people see things here things, and do things differently than others.
Is it better or worse? That's objective, and subjective, however I hear a difference. Thus I gave an "OPINION"

Respectfully.

 

[96tbird]

fortunately, saddle material does make a difference. I bought a KSM foundation bridge with aluminum saddles in and all aluminum base and it just didn't give me the tone I was looking for.

I now have a hipshot vintage bridge on my base and there is a significant difference in tone.

Titanium seems to give clarity to the note while being warm sounding. This may not be ideal for somebody who wants a warmer sounding instrument. However, if you were into slap bass. It's perfect. Simultaneously some people just can't hear changes in sound when bridge swapping. That's what makes us all unique some people see things here things, and do things differently than others.
Is it better or worse? That's objective, and subjective, however I hear a difference. Thus I gave an "OPINION"

Respectfully.

No, let me be clear. I didn't single you out there, my opinion was to the discussion in general. It only happened to be below your post. Not singling you out at all.

But since you are addressing me directly, what you speak ofcannot be heard as soon as the drums and guitars kick in. I'm suggesting all these tiny nuances are lost in a mix. My plea is that it's a miniscule change for an outrageous amount of cash, that money would be better spent helping the unfortunate.

For illustration, go listen to your favourite band with your favourite bass tone ever. Did that player have titanium saddles? Highly unlikely. And if they did can you hear it? You have to even wonder if they used their stage bass on recordings, or if they used the studio's old Precision with fresh Rotosounds, quality preamp with eq. etc.

I apologize for being harsh.There's just so many other things we can spend on that will actually yield meaningful results. Titanium saddles are definitely several parsecs down the list. Yes it's just my opinion, and I admit that the way these products are marketed push all the wrong buttons with me, so I point out the negative. I like to say that I don't like to give advice, but I do have information to share and we're all here to share information and experiences, positive and negative.

Again, not directed at you, apologies.

 

[totalnoob]

OK - ive read quite a bit bout titanium saddles - any fist hand users that can elaborate?

From what ive read titanium saddles maintain the warmness from brass saddles and the definition and highs from steel = best of both worlds?

And most of all - is the upgrade worth the $$?

You know, musicians should really start making double-blind tests, because about 90% of these assertions are coming from them hearing with their eyes instead of their ears.

 

[PleyswethSqwerl]

No, let me be clear. I didn't single you out there, my opinion was to the discussion in general. It only happened to be below your post. Not singling you out at all.

But since you are addressing me directly, what you speak ofcannot be heard as soon as the drums and guitars kick in. I'm suggesting all these tiny nuances are lost in a mix. My plea is that it's a miniscule change for an outrageous amount of cash, that money would be better spent helping the unfortunate.

For illustration, go listen to your favourite band with your favourite bass tone ever. Did that player have titanium saddles? Highly unlikely. And if they did can you hear it? You have to even wonder if they used their stage bass on recordings, or if they used the studio's old Precision with fresh Rotosounds, quality preamp with eq. etc.

I apologize for being harsh.There's just so many other things we can spend on that will actually yield meaningful results. Titanium saddles are definitely several parsecs down the list. Yes it's just my opinion, and I admit that the way these products are marketed push all the wrong buttons with me, so I point out the negative. I like to say that I don't like to give advice, but I do have information to share and we're all here to share information and experiences, positive and negative.

Again, not directed at you, apologies.

I don't think you were being harsh at all. I think you were merely stating your opinion. The cash that we would fork out is very "minuscule" as a bridge in general is no more than $64 to maybe $129. This amount of money wouldn't be able to help the unfortunate unless you're talking about buying multiple packs of smokes for a few of them. All the stuff is trial and error and so that you can have the experience that you like with your instrument because regardless, if it's lost in the mix or not. When you are confident with your sound and what you hear and how your instrument feels. Your band practice goes better. You also play with more confidence. Example: if a basketball player likes to play with Nikes, however he's afforded with a pair of Reeboks. They are very minuscule differences in the shoes at all especially if they are both basketball shoes. However, if he is confident with the Nikes, he's gonna play with confidence.

 

[96tbird]

I don't think you were being harsh at all. I think you were merely stating your opinion. The cash that we would fork out is very "minuscule" as a bridge in general is no more than $64 to maybe $129. This amount of money wouldn't be able to help the unfortunate unless you're talking about buying multiple packs of smokes for a few of them. All the stuff is trial and error and so that you can have the experience that you like with your instrument because regardless, if it's lost in the mix or not. When you are confident with your sound and what you hear and how your instrument feels. Your band practice goes better. You also play with more confidence. Example: if a basketball player likes to play with Nikes, however he's afforded with a pair of Reeboks. They are very minuscule differences in the shoes at all especially if they are both basketball shoes. However, if he is confident with the Nikes, he's gonna play with confidence.

Fair enough. Although I never saw a charity that would turn its nose up at a $90 donation.

 

[totalnoob]

I just don't see what everyone else sees.

The problem is, people are strongly convinced they hear a difference even when there isn't any - the brain has a way of creating an auditory-like experience out of visual clues. But a simple double-blind test would prove otherwise. What is baffling is how strongly people cling to this fallacy - so strongly that they refuse to put these alleged sound differences to a scientific test. It's not "I know there is a difference, and I know a double-blind test will prove it, so let's do it". Instead they go "It is obvious that there is a difference, and I refuse to put this to a test".

 

[totalnoob]

All this snake oil makes me wish I had a CNC machine. I'd be making saddles out of every goofy metal I could think of. Hell, I'd even make some from bone. How cool would THAT be?

Sorry, I looked up the price on a set of 4 titanium saddles, and threw up a little.

Believe it or not, just this morning I had exactly that business idea.

 

[micguy]

The problem is, people are strongly convinced they hear a difference even when there isn't any - the brain has a way of creating an auditory-like experience out of visual clues. But a simple double-blind test would prove otherwise. What is baffling is how strongly people cling to this fallacy - so strongly that they refuse to put these alleged sound differences to a scientific test. It's not "I know there is a difference, and I know a double-blind test will prove it, so let's do it". Instead they go "It is obvious that there is a difference, and I refuse to put this to a test".

It is relatively easy to do a test where you can hear (or not) the differences involved in this sort of thing - you string a bass with a couple of identical D strings, one in the D string location, one in the A string location (so neither is near the fringes of the pickups' magnetic fields). Is there a difference between different saddle materials? Yes. Is it small? Yes, but in some cases, you really can hear these things. To some folks, small differences matter. To others, it's not worth bothering.

One of the oddest things I ever ran across was a Hipshot "vintage" bridge that didn't sound right - the attack of the notes was metallic. Turns out, the tail on that bridge (made out of stainless) that covers the ball ends, and that the strings anchor into, resonates - if you tap it, you can hear a ring in the bass's output. When you played a note, you excited that resonance, and while it wasn't OBVIOUS, it was "there". It took a few experiments (swapping bridges between very similar basses) for me to figure out what was going on - I'm a Physicist (Acoustical), and as such, I'm well versed in how to design good experiments. Anyway, I eventually realized that I was hearing the sound of the bridge in the attack on my notes, and a bridge swap removed that artifact.

No matter where you stand on such things, bashing others as delusional isn't helpful. Yes, a lot of folks get wrapped up in confirmation bias, but there are folks who can hear minor audio details - the abilities of some people in that arena can border on scary at times. 40 plus years of doing controlled listening tests at my work have shown me that you can't discount things that you might think aren't there.

 

[Killing Floor]

I had a T style guitar with a DeTemple bridge that had Ti saddles. In my mind it seemed to be very bright unplugged but I could not tell a difference amplified. But my ears have cicadas in them so maybe it was different. I know for sure those saddles made the body lighter so if that is a consideration it's an easy solution.

 

[PleyswethSqwerl]

Believe it or not, just this morning I had exactly that business idea.

Not your reply but the original reply is overly broad and unduly burdensome, it's not reasonably calculated to lead the discovery of genuine resolution. Sure you could make saddles out of anything. Get a CNC machine and if the tone is great, and you can sell that tone to the world then sell it. However your assertions are "seemingly" colloquially "obtuse" as to assert that people are annoying and stupid for even considering such options or entertaining the topic. If we all felt like this, lets all just start our own grocery stores. Let's all just start our own shoe companies. Let's all just start our own instrument companies. Sound and great ideas begats "consumers" which allows us to feed our families. If you have a great idea, then present it and if we like it, we will support it and buy it. However it "seems" you are making a mockery as to the subject matter. If this is not your intention, I apologize. As it's an intriguing topic about tone

 

[totalnoob]

Not your reply but the original reply is overly broad and unduly burdensome, it's not reasonably calculated to lead the discovery of genuine resolution. Sure you could make saddles out of anything. Get a CNC machine and if the tone is great, and you can sell that tone to the world then sell it. However your assertions are "seemingly" colloquially "obtuse" as to assert that people are annoying and stupid for even considering such options or entertaining the topic. If we all felt like this, lets all just start our own grocery stores. Let's all just start our own shoe companies. Let's all just start our own instrument companies. Sound and great ideas begats "consumers" which allows us to feed our families. If you have a great idea, then present it and if we like it, we will support it and buy it. However it "seems" you are making a mockery as to the subject matter. If this is not your intention, I apologize. As it's an intriguing topic about tone

So your issue is with the dude I replied to?