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Tokai Hard Puncher for $300?

#21
warwick.hoy said:
Just to argue semantics (and parrot things I've gathered from the intertubez). Fender never sued anyone.

Norlin (Gibson's Parent Company) Went after Ibanez in 1977 and it was only trademark infringement on the open book headstock that Ibanez (or more accurately Hoshino Gakki Gen) was copying. I'm fairly certain the case was settled out of court. This was the main focus and I don't think any other suits were filed until Gibson went after PRS.

I'm not saying you are wrong to say it's "Lawsuit Era" as it is pretty much the common nomenclature when referring to these MIJ instruments. I think that "Copy Era" is a bit more accurate.

:)
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This is exactly correct. The whole 'Lawsuit' was between Gibson and Hoshino Gakki. Hoshino Gakki's main brand is Ibanez, and Hoshino Gakki, (unlike Tokai to stretch being on topic here) did not have their own factory. No other firms or companies were involved. The 'open book' headstock shape (and not the 'squashed frog' inlay as is also often pointed out) was the point of the lawsuit.

Just for clarity, this is an 'open book' headstock with a squashed frog :)

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#22
That's why you will see a lot of MIJ copies advertised as "Pre Lawsuit". From a purely personal standpoint; to me "Pre Lawsuit" and "Copy Era" would denote anything manufactured prior to 1977. YMMV

It's certainly easy to see why an exact copy of a Fender Headstock would warrant bringing an infringement case to court and thus be called "lawsuits". I mean some Tokais blatantly say something to the effect that "Copy of Original Fender Design" where the Fender Tradmark/Serial Numbers would be located on the headstock

But Fender adopted an "if can't beat em, join em" stance and that's what brought about JV Squier in the 80's (Squiers were originally Fender Licensed MIJ instruments produced in the Mats and FujiGen plants for JDM prior to becoming a budget brand) followed by "Made/Crafted in Japan.
 
#23
I think there was some stink made about the 'T' in 'Tokai' being in the same font and design as the 'F' in 'Fender' (the reversed F), that and being on a Fender shaped headstock.

I believe they changed the font first, and later the headstock.

Hardpunchers are amazing basses.
 
#26
bigtexashonk said:
While there might not have been formal litigation from Fender, it did not stop Fender attorneys showing up at the Los Angeles Port docks to saw the headstocks off "lawsuit" basses. Certainly prompted Tokai to alter the headstock design.
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I believe those were Fernandes Stratocasters, not basses, and it was in the 80's. But, I've only ever 'heard' that story; I've never seen concrete proof that it happened.
 
#27
Great basses, I own two, lent one to a friend to learn bass on. I have also bought two others for friends who have tried mine and loved them.

Roughly B width necks, nicely rounded and comfortable. They balance well, sound like a good P should, and have really decent fretwork and body contours.

Not so great are the tuners, the A string ones tend to slip, and the finishes are good but nothing special. Most have slightly metallic paint. I have also had trouble with higher tension strings in very dry climates (high altitude) with the truss rod running out of adjustment, but in normal conditions you can get a nice flat neck with .105 Rotos, for example.

Buy it.

They are very focused sounding and do punch hard, and they take a beating.

For 300 you can't go wrong.
 
#28
One Drop said:
Great basses, I own two, lent one to a friend to learn bass on. I have also bought two others for friends who have tried mine and loved them.

Roughly B width necks, nicely rounded and comfortable. They balance well, sound like a good P should, and have really decent fretwork and body contours.

Not so great are the tuners, the A string ones tend to slip, and the finishes are good but nothing special. Most have slightly metallic paint. I have also had trouble with higher tension strings in very dry climates (high altitude) with the truss rod running out of adjustment, but in normal conditions you can get a nice flat neck with .105 Rotos, for example.

Buy it.

They are very focused sounding and do punch hard, and they take a beating.

For 300 you can't go wrong.
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At this point I'm just waiting for a response. He's about an hour away from me, but the ad has been up for 2 months. Either nobody local knows what they're looking at, or he's a flake in some way.
 
#29
Be careful how much info you post online about a bass you're *hoping* to buy and that others are clearly fond of.

I found the listing within 30 seconds of looking ;)

If the listing is that old, it's probably already sold and just ignoring replies because he's too lazy to take down the ad. Happens a lot.
 
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