Transcribing to improve as a bassist?

[TheIndieKid]

I know that ear training/transcribing is a vital skill to have. I desperately need to learn more songs. However, to improve, should I actually need to know the chords that the bassline takes place under? I know if the bassline is outlining a major arpeggio and can identify patterns, but to improve my vocabulary, should I know the chords?

 

[BassChuck]

And possible substitutions, dependent on the style.
Also know the inversions. Certain chord sounds that are need for specific styles depend on bass notes that are not the root.

 

[mambo4]

Yes. You should always know the chords you are playing. When I transcribe, the chords are typically filled in first. It narrows the common note possibilities of the measure from 12 to 4, speeding things up significantly. It also transforms your knowledge from "how to play this new piece" to "a new way to support these chords", Combined with understanding functional harmony ("Roman numeral analysis"), you gain a phrase you can play in the same type of chord progression in any key. Transcription changes from learning songs to building a deeper musical vocabulary.

The pdf link in my Sig has a good intro to the roman numeral stuff.

 

[buldog5151bass]

Yes. Among other things, it will help you learn chord progressions. Originals or cover, jazz, rock, blues, whatever, it is a great skill to have. It will also help you talk with the other musicians.

 

[TheIndieKid]

Do you guys use guitars to transcribe or 10ths, 11ths and various other intervals on bass to figure out the chords?

 

[Mushroo]

but to improve my vocabulary, should I know the chords?

Yes. Knowing the chords to the song is like knowing where the lines are on the highway. If you can see the lines, then you can drive with confidence that you won't swerve off the road.

If you don't yet have the skill set to figure out a song's chords by ear, then you can get them from a trusted, published songbook or from your teacher.

Do you guys use guitars to transcribe or 10ths, 11ths and various other intervals on bass to figure out the chords?

No. I figure out the chords by ear, without a guitar or bass in my hands. But if you do need a chordal instrument for reference, as a learning tool, then I recommend piano/keyboard (not guitar).

 

[TheIndieKid]

My English was atrocious then but I think you know what I meant. Using dyads on bass to figure out chord quality etc

 

[Mushroo]

My English was atrocious then but I think you know what I meant. Using dyads on bass to figure out chord quality etc

Your English is fine! I understand what you meant, and I recommend transcription by ear, pencil and paper only.

My ear-training professor was not a bassist, and so he taught us an ear-training method that is generic and universal. Anyone can use it no matter what instrument they play.

It's possible, I suppose, that there is another method of ear-training which is bass-specific, only bassists can use it, and you need to have a bass in your hands to do it. But I don't know that bass-specific method; I never met anyone who wanted to teach it to me. All I know is the universal method that anyone can use (no bass required).

 

[mambo4]

Do you guys use guitars to transcribe or 10ths, 11ths and various other intervals on bass to figure out the chords?

Since I transcribe for performance, I cheat and Google the chords, rather than try figure them out. Many chord progressions are common enough that I can reliably guess, though. It's worth grabbing a guitar or piano and playing the chords to get them in you ears. You will pretty quickly start to notice common progressions this way (especially w functional analysis).

Upper extensions can be useful.The meat and potatoes of most bass lines will outline 1 3 5 7 of the chords. The other notes used will tell you a lot about the style. Many times (but not always) upper extensions will be ignored by the bass. It's worth knowing the upper extensions being used so as not to clash with your choices, and sometimes including them can lead you to interesting motion.

 

[Malcolm35]

Yes again you have to know the chords. Find the roots (name of the chord) in the first five frets. Pound just the root until what you are doing flows with the music.

Now add the 5th of the root note for root on the first best and the 5th on the 3rd beat for the old R-5 bass line. Yes change roots as they change.

How? I Call up some fake chord sheet music. This will give you the lyrics and the chords used over them. Now follow the lyrics (recite them under your breath) and play your root-5 bass line over them. Google search words chords, name of the song will get you fake chord sheet music on the song you want.

Misc Traditional - Home On The Range (Chords)
Yes, I know, however, I bet you know the tune. Kinda important you can recite or sing the lyrics while moving through the song.

You don't want to use sheet music, everyone needs some structure to get started. Good luck with transposition.

Where is the 5th of any root? Up a string and then two frets toward the bridge. Get that into muscle memory.

 

[Allan Allan]

Yes. You should always know the chords you are playing. When I transcribe, the chords are typically filled in first. It narrows the common note possibilities of the measure from 12 to 4, speeding things up significantly. It also transforms your knowledge from "how to play this new piece" to "a new way to support these chords", Combined with understanding functional harmony ("Roman numeral analysis"), you gain a phrase you can play in the same type of chord progression in any key. Transcription changes from learning songs to building a deeper musical vocabulary.

The pdf link in my Sig has a good intro to the roman numeral stuff.

I don't see the signature

 

[zoonose]

I don't see the signature

Use the desktop site in your browser.

 

[BrotherMister]

Transcribing is such a valuable way to develop. Transcribing the chord changes as well as the bass line is even better. Transcribing all of it is even better etc Eventually you'll just be able to hear the changes and pretty much do it all by ear. Case and point I got called for an emergency sub gig on Saturday night and had to learn a 3 and half hour setlist in an 1 and a half drive. Ears pay off big time for that stuff.

I'd also recommend a keyboard instrument. Even just the cheapest one is a great tool for really getting to grips with how the bass note relates to everything else and what other options and ideas can sound like.

 

[deste]

I know that ear training/transcribing is a vital skill to have. I desperately need to learn more songs. However, to improve, should I actually need to know the chords that the bassline takes place under? I know if the bassline is outlining a major arpeggio and can identify patterns, but to improve my vocabulary, should I know the chords?

I'd just erase the question mark from the thread's title:
Transcribing to improve as a bassist
(and also as a pianist, as a drummer, as a bassoonist...)

 

[MrLenny1]

Yes, chords are very important. Get a cheap acoustic 6 string
or piano and learn chords. Helps to hear chord tones, intervals...

 

[phillipkregg]

For a bassist, I would argue that an intimate knowledge of chords and key signatures is more important than scales.

Of course, if you have that, the scale knowledge will catch up with that really quick.

I would also recommend that you get an inexpensive keyboard and learn to play chords on that so you can hear the differences between them better. Most of the best bass players (and best musicians in general) can play keys at least somewhat competently.

 

[mambo4]

I don't see the signature

Also linked in the stickies at the top of this subforum here Music Theory Book - Free Download

 

[Allan Allan]

Also linked in the stickies at the top of this subforum here Music Theory Book - Free Download

Thank you

 

[Real Soon]

Yes. To all of everything.

I'm no one's idea of a masterful performer, but because I can pick out not just roots, but qualities of chords, and also inversions (like when an acoustic guitar solo player wants to invert the V chord so the "bass" is a half-step under the I), I can survive gigs that pay and get callbacks even with minimal or, sometimes, no rehearsal. That stuff is stressful and not my preferred approach, but the money is the preferred color of green. And I learn new songs every time.

The stuff I spent time and effort learning takes only that: time and effort. Chords, chord inversions, chord progressions. Then, things like passing tones, getting more advanced into secondary dominants, walking bass, color tones, etc.

Learning some guitar along the way certainly won't hurt, and can only help really. But also, you can approach chords on bass via diads, triads, and tetrads even if it's more for theory than performance. Janek Gwizdala has a lot of damn good material on using harmony on bass.

And to start with the harmony thing, go find Take A Walk On The Wild Side by Lou Reed via Velvet Underground. Diads there, and it sounds great and characteristic.

 

[Acoop]

Everything is in the major scale and once you understand how to move through it you have a better understanding of song form and chords. If you’re playing jazz you’ll have to understand all twelve keys but if you’re playing rock most songs are E, G & A, 1,4 & 5. It’s easier to understand and visualize on the piano.