Tried Some New Basses Today

[mcnach]

Your second paragraph there about basses that played well but just needed a bit of a setup, that describes the Cort bass I played at that shop. The bass played well, just needed a couple of minor tweaks to get it playing how I like.

That 4-string Musicman was just hard to play. I couldn't play parts that were easy on other instruments. I have to believe there was more that was wrong with that bass than just a simple setup.

If I walked in to a shop, determined to buy a bass, and none of the basses played to "my standards", then I'd pick the one that played best and see if they would set it up knowing I was planning to buy that day.

But so far I've never been to a guitar shop where there wasn't at least one bass that was almost flawless of the shelf. Usually it's an Ibanez or an American Standard/Special Fender bass.

Perhaps as I play more I'll get a better idea of which instruments are "salvageable", but in the mean time, I'll continue to judge basses by their "off the wall" playability. And I'll continue to GAS for Ibanez...

Seems like You do what works for you, nothing unreasonable there.
I only really objected to extending a verdict on one bass to the whole model.

With regards to the Stingray... well, maybe you just don't like Stingrays. Many find the neck too chunky and unwieldy. I did too at one point but later I changed my mind, go figure.

I personally think a neck makes or breaks a bass for me. The profile, how it feels... some just won't do, and a set up won't get it to the point that I fall in love with it. That can be judged even on a badly set up bass. Conversely, you may find a bass with a great neck and balance that buzzes like hell and has too high action etc... but you may realise all it needs is to be adjusted to your preference.

 

[grendle]

And what I don't understand is why you guys think I have extended that verdict to all of the same model or brand.

I never did that, people need to quit making things up.

I did, havent played one I liked yet from MM. I'll still try them looking for one with the magic though.

 

[grendle]

Seems like You do what works for you, nothing unreasonable there.
I only really objected to extending a verdict on one bass to the whole model.

With regards to the Stingray... well, maybe you just don't like Stingrays. Many find the neck too chunky and unwieldy. I did too at one point but later I changed my mind, go figure.

I personally think a neck makes or breaks a bass for me. The profile, how it feels... some just won't do, and a set up won't get it to the point that I fall in love with it. That can be judged even on a badly set up bass. Conversely, you may find a bass with a great neck and balance that buzzes like hell and has too high action etc... but you may realise all it needs is to be adjusted to your preference.

Amen

 

[mcnach]

What else to a setup is there other than trussrod adjustments, saddle height adjustments, pickup adjustments, and screw tightening?

That kind of stuff doesn't work miracles.

First of all, I apologise for my tone, I reread it and it sounded a bit off.

Set up involves very basic things, like You point out, and sometimes nut work, fret levelling... however, it is amazingly common to get substandard work done. A proper set up does not work miracles... true... but can get pretty close!

Some apparently minor adjustments by someone who really knows can have a very profound result. That's all.

 

[mcnach]

And what I don't understand is why you guys think I have extended that verdict to all of the same model or brand.

I never did that, people need to quit making things up.

It truly gave me that impression on your first posts.... but maybe I misunderstood. It would not be the first time ;-)

 

[kmarc]

question?? I want to buy a bass; went to the bass stores and is a bit confuse as to which to buy. My aim is to play in church. Price range is $300- $750..can some one advice me.

Thanks

Kmarc

 

[WoodyG3]

What else to a setup is there other than trussrod adjustments, saddle height adjustments, pickup adjustments, and screw tightening?

That kind of stuff doesn't work miracles.

If you go to buy a bike, would you test ride it with the saddle at the wrong height, the tires under-inflated and the derailleurs and brakes poorly adjusted?

Just sayin'...

 

[KingRazor]

If you go to buy a bike, would you test ride it with the saddle at the wrong height, the tires under-inflated and the derailleurs and brakes poorly adjusted?

Just sayin'...

Yes, but a bass with poorly set saddles, a bowed neck and a poorly cut nut can still produce sound, can still be played (even if uncomfortably), and (probably) won't kill you.

A messed up bike at worst could seriously hurt you riding down the road, assuming it even worked.

Just sayin'.

 

[chunger]

What else to a setup is there other than trussrod adjustments, saddle height adjustments, pickup adjustments, and screw tightening?

That kind of stuff doesn't work miracles.

Really depends on the bass. . . for instance, a grossly mis-adjusted Sadowsky or Fodera can undergo miraculous transformations with a few tweaks on the trussrod and saddle heights. Why? Because everything was built dead-nuts perfect from neck straightness/contour, to fretboard level/radius/fall-away, fret installation/leveling/finishing, nut slots.

On a production-line instrument, you roll the dice, and play the game of tolerances and percentages. If all the planets align, you can get a miracle with a few tweaks, but more often than not, further interventions are necessary to get it right ("right" is different for different folks).

 

[WoodyG3]

Yes, but a bass with poorly set saddles, a bowed neck and a poorly cut nut can still produce sound, can still be played (even if uncomfortably), and (probably) won't kill you.

LOL. No, I doubt the bass would kill you, you are right! My point is, though, that you really can't tell what a bass can do and how good it can really sound if it isn't set up well.

I agree with you to the point that you can tell some general things about a bass even when it is set up poorly. You can check the balance, you might be able to tell how the neck profile feels, the comfort of the body contour in playing position, etc.

 

[ThingsAbove]

Even though I have yet to bond with an MM instrument, I want a Big Al S-S-S. Ain't instrument shopping kinda fun?

+1

 

[CapnSev]

In the limited experience I have had, strings and setup have NOT made a huge difference in how a bass felt or played.

No offense, but your experience is limited indeed.

 

[One Drop]

It's usually extremely dry here at altitude, but the humidity can fluctuate by extremes. I've had silky setups that make the bass feel like it plays itself turn to stiff and unresponsive ones, or to buzzing rattling messes in a matter of hours. The tones change, along with the feel.

It's unfortunate that when shopping for a bass set up is so important as it's rare to find ones that are set up well at all in stores.

 

[lobster57]

Holy over reactions batman.

I also have yet to play a Stingray I really dug. They are obviously very well made, high quality instruments, but there is something about them that I don't enjoy. I find that they don't sit right on me, either standing or sitting. This is very likely a result of my massive gut and in no way a "fault" of the bass. But my gut is part of me. I'm also not a fan of the necks on Stingrays, not sure what it is really but they don't feel quite right in my hand. All that said I have played a couple of Sterlings that I enjoyed, not enough to drop the cash for, but they were very nice. Maybe its the narrower neck, but I don't really have preference for J-necks over P-necks...

 

[malthumb]

Holy over reactions batman.

I also have yet to play a Stingray I really dug. They are obviously very well made, high quality instruments, but there is something about them that I don't enjoy. I find that they don't sit right on me, either standing or sitting. This is very likely a result of my massive gut and in no way a "fault" of the bass. But my gut is part of me. I'm also not a fan of the necks on Stingrays, not sure what it is really but they don't feel quite right in my hand. All that said I have played a couple of Sterlings that I enjoyed, not enough to drop the cash for, but they were very nice. Maybe its the narrower neck, but I don't really have preference for J-necks over P-necks...

Yes, but what YOU are missing is that HE tried two of the same model bass. HE hated one and HE liked the other because of playability. Arguably, the major difference between the playability of two basses of the same model of similar vintage is SETUP but HE is adamant that more experienced bassists don't know what THEY are talking about when THEY say the setup could be the difference. I hope that I have helped YOU.

Peace,

James

 

[MontzterMash]

Sheesh, one of those was a four, the other a five - not the same. Why all the nonsense over all this to beat up on this guy?

Feel is important and subjective, I liked his post and am glad he shared his experience - isn't that what this is for?

He's had the patience of a saint. Maybe comes from spending good fun time playing rather than bickering.

 

[KingRazor]

Yes, but what YOU are missing is that HE tried two of the same model bass. HE hated one and HE liked the other because of playability. Arguably, the major difference between the playability of two basses of the same model of similar vintage is SETUP but HE is adamant that more experienced bassists don't know what THEY are talking about when THEY say the setup could be the difference. I hope that I have helped YOU.

Peace,

James

They were NOT the same model of bass. One was a 5-string fretless with that fancy nut that is different for each string. One was a basic fretted 4-string.

 

[malthumb]

They were NOT the same model of bass. One was a 5-string fretless with that fancy nut that is different for each string. One was a basic fretted 4-string.

They are both Stingrays. The difference between a 4-string fretted and a 5-string fretless will be neck profile and radius and possibly string height if the fretless is strung closer to the fingerboard. String height is part of set-up. You did not say that you preferred one neck profile over the other, so that does not seem to be the difference.

The nut will only matter in terms of how the bass is setup. Ooops.....There's that word again.

Other than that, Stingrays are Stingrays in terms of playing FEEL. Different pickup configs and different preamp options will get you different tonal range but not different feel.

 

[malthumb]

Sheesh, one of those was a four, the other a five - not the same. Why all the nonsense over all this to beat up on this guy?

Feel is important and subjective, I liked his post and am glad he shared his experience - isn't that what this is for?

He's had the patience of a saint. Maybe comes from spending good fun time playing rather than bickering.

I TOTALLY enjoyed his first post. It was very well written and very informative. The thing that's baffling to me is that when people who have been playing longer than he's been alive offer VERY SOUND advice, he continues to maintain that "nope....can't be that".

That's like going outside in a snowstorm and complaining about the cold, but ignoring people that tell you you may want to zip up your coat. It really is that basic.

The other equally obvious possibility is he just prefers fretless to fretted (being able to slide all over the place.)

 

[One Drop]

I think the truth lies between the extremes. Set up are extremely important, but every bass has it's own range of adjustability and its own tolerances. Some basses will take a very low action beautifully, others won't. Some just seem to pay themselves, are resonant, others cannot be set up to play well at all and can be real duds tonally no matter what.

But in general I feel most modern basses are built within tolerances that means they can be set up to play nicely with a decent range of different action, and they are rarely anywhere near their best hanging on the wall of a big box store. As a matter of fact, I'm amazed they sell any, so bad do they usually feel coming off the hangers.

If I required extremely low action I'd be pickier, no doubt, but even with my preferences (fairly straight neck, a bit of fret buzz in any position if I dig in a bit) most basses will react well to a decent set up and sound and feel better than they do coming off the wall at a typical shop.

BTW I asked the same question years ago, namely why don't shops set up all their basses? The answer, from many retailers and shop employees, was simply that there isn't the time, and hiring an extra employee to keep them set up (in addition to the one who is doing paid set ups, of course), is simply uneconomic. The exception seemed to some smaller shops with mostly high end instruments, who make higher margins and sell less quantity.

The other thing is that what one person considers a good set up might be radically different than another's, making it a less interesting proposition, especially if your clientele is mostly newer layers who won't appreciate a good set up as much and might be turned off by one that is different than they are used to.

Anyway, the best way to go IMO is to keep an open mind and not be afraid to find out your opinions change as you go. I've had most of my assumptions overturned with experience, and I'm sure that won't stop anytime soon!