Tube(like) Solid State

[jessicabass]

Hello all, from some suggestions on buying a new head I bit the bullet and went to sam ash to try out some Hartke heads on my Hartke 8x10. I just found the tube preamps on these to sound too sterile or maybe even synthetic. I used a sansamp bass driver before and it had this sound. While I was there, for kicks I tried a Markbass head and WOW! I was impressed, I loved that tube(like) solid state sound. But the price tags are way to high. Are there any other solid state amps without the huge price tag that have that tubey feeling to them? Or are there any hybrid amps that actually sound good?

 

[billfitzmaurice]

Are there any other solid state amps without the huge price tag that have that tubey feeling to them? Or are there any hybrid amps that actually sound good?

The main difference between SS and tube sound lies in the natural compression characteristics of tubes. So if you want tube sound the way to get it is with a good compressor. 'One Knob Wonders' don't count.

 

[lomo]

Give a listen to a Mesa Walkabout.

 

[stingray69]

Don't know if you've tried any of the Acoustic stuff, but IMO they sound very Ampeg-ish in nature, offer "light compression" per the manual (probably helps in lending to the tube-like tone of it), and the price vs. power is really great.

 

[Chef]

If jessica thinks the markbass stuff is too expensive, the walkabout is out. Even used, they're generally more expensive then and LMII or F1 is new.

 

[lomo]

If jessica thinks the markbass stuff is too expensive, the walkabout is out. Even used, they're generally more expensive then and LMII or F1 is new.

Yup. My bad-missed that :-(

 

[eyeballkid]

try an ashdown ABM evo II 500.. the tube drive on that makes a very warm and beautiful tubeyness.. i loved it as much as my ampeg classic..... make sure you get the UK made version.. you can get em for $450-$650 used and WELL WORTH IT!.. they come up on ebay quite often.. the rackmount chrome face ones are real sexy.

or... consider a used mesa boogie big block or M6...

 

[Lukejt]

Yorkville/Traynor?

Just picked up a Yorkville XS400 for $200 on the Bay, and I watched a full tube Yorkville 200watt head sell for $147 on Ebay last week!

 

[JimmyM]

jessica, it's been my experience that the majority of hybrids and ss heads sound very solid stately. the lmii/iii is a rare exception, although there are now 2 or 3 small but expensive amps that get close.

but if you want that tubey ampeg sound and don't have a huge budget, get a sansamp vt pedal.

 

[Chef]

the ampeg b100 is very good at that, but, not terribly loud.

 

[B-string]

The G-K fusion hybrid does tube sound VERY well, but then G-K uses full plate voltage on the preamp tubes. It is prob. out of your price range though. The MB Fusion may have a better price point but no idea when it will see the light of day?

 

[edbass]

The main difference between SS and tube sound lies in the natural compression characteristics of tubes. So if you want tube sound the way to get it is with a good compressor. 'One Knob Wonders' don't count.

I believe that compression is just one small part. IMO dynamic soundstage and harmonic distortion characteristics contribute far more than compression to the tonal nuances of an all tube amp. Even if compression was the main difference, the compressors generally considered tonally the finest in the world only really come close to the natural compression dynamic of a tube output stage, and they use tubes themselves.
It’s far cheaper to use tubes in your amp’s output stage than in your Fairchild 670.

Many players find personal satisfaction in all kinds of tonal options, and if it sounds good to you, more power to you!
But… as adamant as some seem to be regarding the magical properties of EQ and processing options, if you want tube sound the way to really get it is with a tube amplifier. Hybrids can sound great, SS amps can sound great; but they can't and don't sound like an all tube amp in the real world.
Often on paper or at 85 dB in your home; when compared to in your ear at 100+ dB in a severely “acoustically challenged” live environment are two different things entirely.
Transistors are cheap and light, output transformers are expensive and heavy, and while most quality tube amps are on the high side there are plenty of used and even some "like new" options that will give you actual tube sound rather than a processed sounding imitation without breaking the bank (or your back).

As previously posted, slightly used recent model Traynor YBA200's regularly sell for <$500, and if you are diligent and patient you can find similar deals on other REAL tube amplifiers. I would suggest that the OP try as many amps as possible to see what really hits the mark for them tonally, but also because of the practical considerations regarding tube vs. SS amps.

i.e.; Real butter costs more than oleomargarine, doesn’t store as long, and is more fattening. Some people probably actually like the taste of oleo better than butter even; it’s also a personal choice with practical tradeoffs. Like tone.

Like with tube/SS; much efforts (and many talkbass posts...) are used to try to get the "olemargarine" to simulate "butter", but you never seem to see any effort to get "butter" to simulate "oleo".
I wonder why that is...

 

[RBASS930]

Get the SS head of your choice, and add the Tech 21 Sansamp Character Series VT Bass.

 

[Baird6869]

I used to use one of Ampeg's all time worst Solid State heads (B2-RE) with a Sansamp RBI and it sounded pretty damned good (and tubey).

Also, I am currently using a GK 1001RB-II with a $100 Boss Compressor stomp pedal and it also sounds good. Maybe not as tubey as my SVT-CL, but it offers a lot of that tube sound.

I would recommend playing a few different things in a full volume rehearsal or gig before making up your mind. In some cases, I actually prefer my GK in the mix (with certian kinds of music) to my SVT-CL or even my beastly 1200W Genz Benz GBE1200.

Tubes don't necessarilty always sound better than SS IMO.

 

[JimmyM]

I believe that compression is just one small part. IMO dynamic soundstage and harmonic distortion characteristics contribute far more than compression to the tonal nuances of an all tube amp. Even if compression was the main difference, the compressors generally considered tonally the finest in the world only really come close to the natural compression dynamic of a tube output stage, and they use tubes themselves.
It’s far cheaper to use tubes in your amp’s output stage than in your Fairchild 670.

ya, i wish it was as easy as slapping a comp on a ss amp to get a tubey sound. never worked for me.

 

[debassr]

I think the Ampeg Micro VR sounds very tube like. And it's only like $300 bucks.

 

[MrLenny1]

Used Eden WT 400 are selling for $400 or so.
Tube pre, SS power amp.

 

[rbonner]

Don't know if you've tried any of the Acoustic stuff, but IMO they sound very Ampeg-ish in nature, offer "light compression" per the manual (probably helps in lending to the tube-like tone of it), and the price vs. power is really great.

I disagree on the Acoustic sounding AMPEG. What I found was the B600H and B810 sounded very vintage Acoustic sounding and I don't know how that character would sound with a VT hung on it.

I'm quite pleased with the 4PRO AMPEG as a hybrid, but they are also quite expensive.

Jessica, the Hartke 810 is the same platform as the acoustic B810. It's a budget / slight underachiever.

Maybe just picking up a used AMPEG V4 head to set next to the Hartke may be an answer depending on the romp you need for band needs.

It's hard to beat the LM amp as light and powerful and maybe it should be a save up situation?

An inexpensive QSC SS power amp in the 800 watt bridged range plus a VT might be all you need.

BOB

 

[stingray69]

I disagree on the Acoustic sounding AMPEG. What I found was the B600H and B810 sounded very vintage Acoustic sounding and I don't know how that character would sound with a VT hung on it.

An inexpensive QSC SS power amp in the 800 watt bridged range plus a VT might be all you need.

BOB

Well, I do have to admit - I'm not too experienced on the tone of the vintage Acoustic gear. Not too many opportunities to find or play many. I'd like to think it does an accurate approximation of it though, but I'm no expert. Although a lot of vintage Acoustic guys on here knock the newer Acoustic as not sounding like the vintage stuff (but that's about par for the course I suppose). I guess what I'm trying to say is that to my ears, the Acoustic stuff doesn't fall into the "SS sterile" sound, IMO. I have coupled the VT pedal with an Acoustic B600H - with excellent results!

A VT pedal into my QSC PLX-1602 was great too, but I found it to be too limiting (EQ-wise) in some gig situations where room acoustics were far from ideal. But then I'm an admitted EQ junkie, lol. I like to have a fairly powerful EQ section going into any gig situation to deal with the room sound getting in the way of "my sound".

 

[rbonner]

Well, I do have to admit - I'm not too experienced on the tone of the vintage Acoustic gear. Not too many opportunities to find or play many.

Yeah the Acoustic stuff is very colored tonally compared to most modern SS gear which is more transparent.

The new B600H is very tonally colored. Which is fine if you are looking for that "Acoustic sound" which I find very distinct. Which is OK in its own right.

I just happen to prefer the AMPEG sound, which the SVT generated and my 4PRO's simulate close enough for my acceptance.

My quote to think about is, the preamps and speaker cabs make most of the TONE characteristics of your amp. The final just passes that, wrecks it or changes it.

BOB