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Twisted neck, composite headless

#21
I agree that it is going to be a lot of work. That is probably the biggest hurdle since I have a few too many hobbies. (Don't let my wife know!) :D

I really like the Torzal (yes I have been to the website numerous times). It is really a beautifully executed design. My wife would kill me if I bought it because of the price, although I think it would be worth it (the money, not the dying).

My instructor is coming over tonight. I'll tell him that I need to learn better left hand technique. He said that I'm doing the best any of his students had after just a few lessons, but I'm sure I can improve on my technique. I still think a twisted neck would make practicing for 3+ hours at a stretch much more comfortable. There are a ton of people with CT/tendonitis issues so I can't be the only one.

Gabe: I've flown my Thorn @ 115ozs (50ozs/sqft) in 40mph winds at Eagle Butte and could have doubled the weight in that lift.

Arx: Thanks for the input on using the standard tuners! I didn't want the tuners to hang off the end as they will probably get damaged easily. I would like the body to extend past the tuners or have the tuners come off the side to protect them.

I do have a fair amount of tools, but would have to buy a couple of the bass specific hand tools (fret clippers, etc). I can do a lot with just the CNC router, mind you. I attached a pic of it. My workshop is messy, what can I say?

Jay: I think I have looked into Status and Parker, but will look again. Thanks!
 

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#24
AndreasMergner said:
I do have a fair amount of tools, but would have to buy a couple of the bass specific hand tools (fret clippers, etc).
Click to expand...

Or improvise them.
Here's some big pictures of my flush cutting fret clippers, and a before/after test cut:

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a fret-saw is the only bass-specific tool I had to buy for my build.

-Nick
 
#25
Nick: Thanks for those pics. I can grind myself a fret clipper no problem. I'm not sure why I didn't think of that!

Yes, a fret saw was my other tool I needed. I figure I'm going to have to do that by hand since the frets are angled -- either that or mount a dremel with a thin cutoff blade to the CNC machine! It would probably take less time to do it by hand than to program it in my CAM program. I could probably make the fret placement marks with a V bit on the CNC also.
 
#28
AndreasMergner said:
Nick: Thanks for those pics. I can grind myself a fret clipper no problem. I'm not sure why I didn't think of that!

Yes, a fret saw was my other tool I needed. I figure I'm going to have to do that by hand since the frets are angled -- either that or mount a dremel with a thin cutoff blade to the CNC machine! It would probably take less time to do it by hand than to program it in my CAM program. I could probably make the fret placement marks with a V bit on the CNC also.
Click to expand...

If you've got the bandwidth (or time) you could look through the other files in that directory. It's got pretty much the whole build. (If not, I'll probably be posting a scaled down, commented pictorial of the whole thing pretty soon)

You can see how I did my frets. I wanted to do a fanned fret, but didn't want to build a neck on my first go. Of course, the fretboard was already attached, so it either meant finding a way to level the neck, or cutting by hand. I just marked them out, and then cut them by using the saw with a very simple depth stop that I rigged up. I used a piece of aluminum angle to keep the cuts perpendicular to the board.

You would probably need to be a little more creative with the angle piece, maybe trim it so it's only held by a thin strip in the middle of the board, which wouldn't be bothered by the twist.

Marking with the CNC would probably be good if its precision/accuracy are both quite good, otherwise a good aluminum/steel rule and a knife to mark with is pretty decent.

-Nick
 
#31
AndreasMergner said:
Nick: Thanks for those pics. I can grind myself a fret clipper no problem. I'm not sure why I didn't think of that!

Yes, a fret saw was my other tool I needed. I figure I'm going to have to do that by hand since the frets are angled -- either that or mount a dremel with a thin cutoff blade to the CNC machine! It would probably take less time to do it by hand than to program it in my CAM program. I could probably make the fret placement marks with a V bit on the CNC also.
Click to expand...

What is the step size on your CNC rig? And if you don't mind my asking, how much did it cost you to build? I've been toying with the idea of building one myself.

Feel free to PM me if it's too off topic, or you don't want to post it publicly.

-Nick
 
#32
SDB Guitars said:
There are bits for those CNC routers that are only .022" or so... those would be perfect for fret slots.
Click to expand...

I have never heard of them so small. I have a 1/16" bit and it seems tiny. I did an online search but didn't come up with anything. Do you have a source?

Nick: I'll go through your pics. Thanks! The CNC has travel of 76" x 27" x 12" with servo steps of .001". It has some play, so figure within .005" or so. I'm not sure what the exact price was....probably $6k plus another 4.5 for software. I have probably 800 hours of labor into it. Unless you are going to make 20 basses, it won't be worth it to build your own CNC. Plus, a project like building a CNC will make the twisted bass look rather simple. I would buy a used CNC if I did it again. Take a look at CNCzone.com for tons of info.
 
#35
I checked McMaster previously, but looked in the wrong place. I found them now. Thanks guys!

I'm not cutting for speed, so I should be alright. I'm also only going to be cutting a small amount of wood for each fret. I don't forsee any problems. I have a standard router that goes to 40K RPMs anyway.
 
#37
The Mcmaster bits only have cutting length of .11". They are pre-broken. :) I think using the bits in a CNC might be less stressful than using them on a hand held router, but I could be wrong.

After thinking a bit, I realized that things aren't so simple. I plan on cutting the neck, then putting on the carbon fabric, and then cutting the frets. I'm not sure that bit will like cutting through carbon.

It looks like I need to get the tuners and bridge before I can come up with a dimensioned design. I'm still flip flopping between something decent and something cheap.
 
#38
AndreasMergner said:
The Mcmaster bits only have cutting length of .11". They are pre-broken. :) I think using the bits in a CNC might be less stressful than using them on a hand held router, but I could be wrong.

After thinking a bit, I realized that things aren't so simple. I plan on cutting the neck, then putting on the carbon fabric, and then cutting the frets. I'm not sure that bit will like cutting through carbon.

It looks like I need to get the tuners and bridge before I can come up with a dimensioned design. I'm still flip flopping between something decent and something cheap.
Click to expand...

On a bit that small I don't think you'll be cutting anywhere near that deep in 1 pass anyways. Is the shaft long enough that you can still cut deeper in multiple passes?

I'd go with something moderately cheap for hardware. I went with Gotoh Tuners (they're nice), and hipshot single string bridges (waste of money)

You are following proper safety precautions cutting your carbon fibre right?
 
#39
I can cut deeper, but the channel will increase in size. Looks like fret wire tangs are about .075", so I should be ok.

I have a whole room air filtration system and also a full face air filter helmet thingy called an Airshield (highly recommended). I won't be making much carbon dust, but it probably would stay in my lungs a while.

I was looking at the Hipshot A and some Gotoh compacts. That's close to $140 whereas I could get some hardware significantly cheaper on eBay or elsewhere. I guess it would probably be best to bite the bullet and get something decent instead of getting possibly poor results due to poor hardware.

I was thinking of trying the Guitar Fetish pickups. Maybe a MM and a P version? I still need to research on pickups.
 
#40
AndreasMergner said:
I can cut deeper, but the channel will increase in size. Looks like fret wire tangs are about .075", so I should be ok.

I have a whole room air filtration system and also a full face air filter helmet thingy called an Airshield (highly recommended). I won't be making much carbon dust, but it probably would stay in my lungs a while.

I was looking at the Hipshot A and some Gotoh compacts. That's close to $140 whereas I could get some hardware significantly cheaper on eBay or elsewhere. I guess it would probably be best to bite the bullet and get something decent instead of getting possibly poor results due to poor hardware.

I was thinking of trying the Guitar Fetish pickups. Maybe a MM and a P version? I still need to research on pickups.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I bought some q-tuners pickups. They're really expensive, but they sound awesome. I don't have much to compare them to mind you. They're WAY fatter than the active barts on my Ibanez BTB555. Though the rest of the bass may be involved in that as well.

In my limited experience (built 1 bass, played a few basses) I think if there's one place to go cheap, it's probably the bridge. (ymmv, no flames please)

Bad tuners are awful. Pickups, obviously, have a significant effect on the sound. Doesn't mean they need to be super expensive to be good, though.

Bridges otoh, don't do a lot but sit there and hold your strings in place. Sure, they can have an effect on your sound, but much less than your pickups, or falling out of tune because of bad tuners.

Of course, if you're already spending >$1000 on parts, what's another $100 to make it look pretty, right? ;)

-Nick
 

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