Uber bassists- I don't get it.

[jerry]

Did I miss a meeting where it is mandatory to listen to music we don't care for?

 

[Herrick]

What's that one Michael Manring song? The Enmormous Room? No wanking at all and it's one of the most beautiful things I've ever heard. It's not really fair to bass one's opinion on these bass players by watching a few YouTube videos that only showcase their technical chops.

Edit: Well the good thing about this thread is now I know what I'm going to listen to on my lunch break

 

[glocke1]

I would strongly disagree. Have you seen Stanley or Wooten, Marcus Miller in concert? They are killing the groove along with amazing technique. They are not mutually exclusive. Phil Lesh is one of the worst bass players to become famous. Its laughable that he would even be mentioned in the same sentence as the other players you mentioned.

Have you actually sat down and listened to Phil?

Spend some time listening to some shows from 1972-1978 or thereabouts. There is some amazing playing in there.

 

[twinjet]

Am I the only one who finds the quote "virtuosos" boring and just plain wanking? Michael Manring, Les Claypool, Stanley Clark, Alain Caron, Just about anybody who endorses Fodera, including Victor Wooten and many others.
I admire their proficiency, and technique, but then say to myself 'Now play a song'.
There are highly adept players I love- Phil Lesh, Chris Squire, etc. that CAN play that stuff, but somehow always keep the music first. I NEVER thought that John Entwhistle was wanking, no matter how fast he was playing. Mark King is about the only guy who ever slapped a bass that I could listen to a whole song.
I'm not saying everyone should play bass like Chris Hillman, or Timothy Schmitt, there's lots of room for advancing the art, but most hi-tech players sound like they are only playing to impress, not drive the song.
Discuss.

I feel Victor Wooten has absolutely advanced the art. Ask anyone who has gone to Wooten Woods.

Bela Fleck and the Flecktones weren't exactly showcasing Victor Wooten either, despite his talent.

Oh my God is this true.
Check out anything by them -- Sea Brazil, Big Country or A Celtic Medley are my absolute favorites of theirs. Yes, Wooten solos on these, but he is not the center of attention. I encourage everyone who dismisses Wooten as just another flashy player to check this out. He really is a master of the instrument.

 

[SLO Surfer]

Sorry to break hearts here, but bass is just not that interesting as a "soloist" lead instrument.

 

[TonyP-]

I like to think you can be busy, show some technique and still write a great tune.

 

[Dynacord]

To me, any playing should be to make the song sound better. Playing for the sake of showing off technique/talent is just that - showing off.

Jamestown played Ain't No Mountain High Enough, Darling Dear, Mercy Me, My Girl, and Can't Hurry Love - 'nuff said.

I would certainly call Jamerson a virtuoso though. And he had a very busy style by the standards then. No argument, he clearly made the songs better.

 

[Element Zero]

I have been digging a bit deeper since posting this.
Many of the players I mentioned have indeed have discographies of them playing a supporting role.
I will admit that a lot of the players mentioned, I got my impressions of from Youtube. If you search a particular bass player on Youtube, the first several hundred videos are of said player soloing. Youtube does not give a well rounded view of a players body of work. The most viewed videos are of their 'wow me' chops.
I also did not take into account that perhaps the highly technical stuff IS the reason some people like it, and they are giving the listeners what they want. I saw an early incarnation of G3 Satriani, Vai, and Johnson. They didn't get a lot of applause, and people leaving the concert talked more about 64th. note sweep picking than if the music moved them in any way. They still probably thought it was money well spent because of the display of dazzling technique.

I’m glad you’ve revised your opinions after digging deeper into songs some of these artists are involved with instead of YouTube chops videos. There’s a wealth of musical information in nearly every SONG that every artist you listed has recorded.

 

[bearfoot]

The argument that virtuoso players are one-dimensional is not valid.

Victor Wooten, for instance, has done more than just pound out 32nd notes.

 

[dbsfgyd1]

Am I the only one who finds the quote "virtuosos" boring and just plain wanking? Michael Manring, Les Claypool, Stanley Clark, Alain Caron, Just about anybody who endorses Fodera, including Victor Wooten and many others.
I admire their proficiency, and technique, but then say to myself 'Now play a song'.
There are highly adept players I love- Phil Lesh, Chris Squire, etc. that CAN play that stuff, but somehow always keep the music first. I NEVER thought that John Entwhistle was wanking, no matter how fast he was playing. Mark King is about the only guy who ever slapped a bass that I could listen to a whole song.
I'm not saying everyone should play bass like Chris Hillman, or Timothy Schmitt, there's lots of room for advancing the art, but most hi-tech players sound like they are only playing to impress, not drive the song.
Discuss.

I’m been a firm believer that the tune should drive what the bass part is. The foundation of a bass part is based off the rhythm of the melody line( and the drummer darn well be doing this too), and making the chord changes sound logical.

Yes, there are places to step out and show your stuff, but for the most part, us “lunch bucket working stiffs” better learn to stay in the pocket and worry about not stomping on the what the rest of the enterprise is doing.

 

[buldog5151bass]

I would certainly call Jamerson a virtuoso though. And he had a very busy style by the standards then. No argument, he clearly made the songs better.

Yes, but my point was, he served the song. Someone playing bass a few weeks could figure out My Girl.

 

[Somnambulance]

That’s certainly an opinion you have there OP.

 

[Hand slap]

Smeet- You are correct, and if this turns into a bashing post I will delete it.

Whatever, he is just voicing his opinion, Just sayin

 

[diegom]

Did I miss a meeting where it is mandatory to listen to music we don't care for?

Reminds me of my mother, "How do you know you don't like broccoli if you never tasted it???".

I think we owe it to ourselves to open up, listen AND THEN define why we don't like something...Too busy, too basic, too noisy, too repetitive, too repetitive, too wanky?
That's how tastes are formed. Then again, if you choose to be in a musical "echo chamber" (listening only to stuff you already know you like) and that satisfies your needs, BRAVO!!! I'm not one to judge... I feel fortunate we have so many choices now... (Perhaps too many and not enough time to listen to all!!!)

 

[Nev375]

Am I the only one who finds the quote "virtuosos" boring and just plain wanking? Michael Manring, Les Claypool, Stanley Clark, Alain Caron, Just about anybody who endorses Fodera, including Victor Wooten and many others.
I admire their proficiency, and technique, but then say to myself 'Now play a song'.
There are highly adept players I love- Phil Lesh, Chris Squire, etc. that CAN play that stuff, but somehow always keep the music first. I NEVER thought that John Entwhistle was wanking, no matter how fast he was playing. Mark King is about the only guy who ever slapped a bass that I could listen to a whole song.
I'm not saying everyone should play bass like Chris Hillman, or Timothy Schmitt, there's lots of room for advancing the art, but most hi-tech players sound like they are only playing to impress, not drive the song.
Discuss.

When I read that it sounds like this in my head:

"I'm only comfortable listening to the kind of music that I'm comfortable listening to. Why would anyone bother to play anything else? If I'm not comfortable listening to it then how could other people possibly like it? Besides, that stuff is super hard. Why would anyone want to challenge themselves like that? Isn't it much easier staying in one's comfort zone? I think so!

People who challenge themselves are only trying to impress other people. Well I'm not impressed because that implies that there's more to music than what I'm comfortable listening to and that makes me feel uncomfortable because I don't understand it. I better not say that though, because people will perceive that I have an overdeveloped ego. So I'll just put a little disclaimer and say not every bassist should sound like the bassists I like and that should keep folks from noticing.

Now let's see how many people validate me."


I'm going to assume that my interpretation is WAY off, but that's the impression I'm getting.

 

[rtav]

“Anyone who plays more than a couple of notes at a time above the 12th fret generally gets a big “NO” from me. That = playing treble, not bass.“

Are you being serious? That's pretty hard line...

And besides, who plays treble? Treble generally describes a frequency range - it’s not the bass-neutering lap harp of satan that only “real” or “true” bassists can discern (and avoid like forced sterilization).

And while we’re here, do you mean any string above the 12th fret, or just the C on my 6-string trebles?

Just looking for some clarification, thanks.

 

[fhm555]

My dad once told me if you can’t pat your foot to it you are playing with yourself.
I honestly don’t think he meant it like it sounds but it’s hard to ignore the truth in it no matter how it reads to you.

 

[bearhart74]

E

Did I miss a meeting where it is mandatory to listen to music we don't care for?

that meeting never happened. you missed the one that George Orwell organized. The topic was why we should only listen to preapproved music.

 

[JimK]

I would certainly call Jamerson a virtuoso though. And he had a very busy style by the standards then. No argument, he clearly made the songs better.

I concur. No one that talks smack about "busy bassists" ever, ever cites JJ.

 

[Chickenwheels]

(Jaco Pastorius, Guitar Player, August 1984).
Players with chops often live or die by them, unfortunately.
Here’s Wooten playing on a real song. He manages.