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Used Amps and Cabs - Thoughts on how old is too old?

B

blueknigh7

Apr 21, 2008
30
42
#1
Looking to upgrade from my small practice combo into heads and cabs. I've always known that used gear can be great savings, and I'm perusing FB Marketplace, reverb, etc to try and figure out what I want to go for next. But how old is too old for someone who doesn't want to risk maintenance or something falling apart?

Obviously, there's use cases where items are immaculate, and at the opposite end - gig abused, but is there any MTBF (Mean Time Between Failures) that people go by before its "caveat emptor"? I think amps have a longer timeline than speakers, in general, but I still have no clue what that is - and it always "depends". Any anecdotes you all live by?

Anecdotally myself, I keep looking at stuff from early 2000s thinking "that's not old"....and then remembering that was 20 years old. I went for a GKRB1001-ii and cab combo recently, but had to return it because it didn't work. I think 10 years may be on the edge of what I'm comfortable with, but I'm not sure....I'm also a hobbyist - so there's no ROI for me in this exercise.
 
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#2
This is a vary good question actually.

Depends on the particular piece, how well it was maintained, if the manufacturer still supports it, if parts are still available and if you have a QUALIFIED service tech with the skill and experience to work on it.

For example, Genz Benz Shuttle, ShuttleMax and Streamliners are viable candidates (at least in North America) because the amps are still fully supported by a factory service program, parts are available and in stock, and they were inherently reliable. I do see them in for basic refurbishment after 15-20 years, once completed they are good to go.

The exception is the NeoPak, I can often repair them BUT there are some key components in the power supply that are no longer available, and if one of those parts fails, they become boneyard donor stock.
 
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#4
Are you going to be a gigging hobbyist?? If so, it might be good to go with the lighter weight stuff. Especially if you're older. If you are just going to play at home and not move anything then you can save lots of money with the lead sleds. Keep in mind that some of the great companies of the past are no longer and could be an issue as far as maintenance.
 
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#5
I think the best value on the used market these days is Genz Benz stuff. Ridiculously cheap for how good it is and you can still get flat rate factory service.

A lot of Peavey gear is essentially indestructible, and even stuff from the 80's is still going strong. It's also generally cheap enough that even if it died you'd still be ok.

Me personally I would just get something that sounds good and fits your size/weight/volume/tone needs. If maintenance is a concern skip all tube amps, or any that have a reputation as flakey or hard to work on and manufacturers that aren't in business any more.
 
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#6
ajkula66 said:
If there's a particular amp that you like and/or are interested in, ask for suggestions/experiences regarding that specific model.
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It's a bit of a chicken and egg problem, to be honest as I'm not quite sure. Ampeg has been my practice amps, but I've been eyeing used stuff like Markbass or Gallien-Kruger. Leaning slightly to the "vintage" or "legacy" lines.

pingvuiini said:
If so, it might be good to go with the lighter weight stuff. Especially if you're older.
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I do hear this! I used to lug a BA-112 down a block with a bass on my back every Sunday... It wasn't bad, but it wasn't fun. I think those days are behind me, but I may be called again into service. Definitely looking into Neo equipment for easy transport - or at least to be able to move around the house.
 
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#7
The answer is "it depends."

It's fairly common for older gear to be either unrepairable or not worth fixing. This is especially true of solid state amp. Basic vintage tube amps are usually repairable. However, tube amps with more complex circuits can be problematic, as they may use parts that are no longer available.

So part of the bargain can be that it's cheap enough that you don't worry about it failing. Do some research to determine if the piece has reliability issues. If it has a bad reputation, then pass. If it's considered reliable, make sure it appears to be in good working order and if it breaks, you buy a cheap replacement rather than fixing it.

I would consider buying a 1001RB Mk II as long as it's in good condition and the price is right. If it broke, I would do some research on how repairable it is and consider how much the current street price is. I would also consider what else is available for a similar price.
 
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#8
blueknigh7 said:
It's a bit of a chicken and egg problem, to be honest as I'm not quite sure. Ampeg has been my practice amps, but I've been eyeing used stuff like Markbass or Gallien-Kruger. Leaning slightly to the "vintage" or "legacy" lines.
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GK gets my vote every day and twice on Sundays, but it's your money to spend so...

FTR, I recently sold a GK 200MB combo from '88 which was still in untouched factory condition and functioning perfectly...
 
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#10
I have been wondering this myself. I keep seeing ampeg stuff from the 90s online. Old beat up cabs and amps and they sell fairly cheap. Are these "safe" to buy? I have no idea. I've had amps that were in their 40s and never let med down..
 
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#11
Good day. I'm new here, first post.

As a long time guitar player and a relatively new convert to focusing on bass, I've experienced this. Here's my experience.

I needed an amp large enough to play with a loud rock band. I noticed high quality used bass amps were plentiful and very affordable on the local used market. I bought a Peavey T Max 1x15 combo for very cheap. It functioned perfectly, was very powerful, did what I needed. BUT it was huge, very heavy, and super difficult to move by myself (from the house, into the car, outa the car, into a rehearsal room, back into the car, back into the house). I did the three times and immediately realized why old amps are very cheap & available.

I immediately off loaded the Peavey and purchased a light weight 2x10 cabinet and a tiny class D head. Also got a Fender Rumble 100 (fantastic amp!). Modern amps are super light and easy to move.

Do yourself a favor and get a modern light weight amp (new or used). You'll be glad to not have to move a huge back breaker of an amp.
 
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#16
The algebra feels a little different depending on if we are talking about amps or cabs (and if they're leaving the house).

For cabs, if it's going to be stationary (or mostly stationary), I would agree with the earlier recommendation for Genz-Benz. For whatever reason, this brand doesn't tend to hold inflated resale value vs. what you're getting (i.e., a backbreaking box) like other brands like Eden, SWR, and contemporary Mesas would. GKs also can be found used for a relative bargain. A well cared for 25 year old cab wouldn't concern me as much as an amp of similar vintage simply because it's a "simpler machine" (as long as I don't have to move it). If it's cabinet that I expect to move more than occasionally and I'm on a budget, I'd probably lean towards something like a Rumble cab.

I don't know that your 10 year window for amps is necessarily the right consideration: I wouldn't trust a used Ampeg PF500, for example, regardless of its date of manufacture (with the caveat that my main amp is a PF500). Whereas, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a 15 year old Shuttlemax in good condition. The amp decision has so many more variables that it really boils down to the specific amp and availability of repair.
 
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#18
agedhorse said:
This is a vary good question actually.

Depends on the particular piece, how well it was maintained, if the manufacturer still supports it, if parts are still available and if you have a QUALIFIED service tech with the skill and experience to work on it.

For example, Genz Benz Shuttle, ShuttleMax and Streamliners are viable candidates (at least in North America) because the amps are still fully supported by a factory service program, parts are available and in stock, and they were inherently reliable. I do see them in for basic refurbishment after 15-20 years, once completed they are good to go.

The exception is the NeoPak, I can often repair them BUT there are some key components in the power supply that are no longer available, and if one of those parts fails, they become boneyard donor stock.
Click to expand...
One of the reasons I recently bought a Genz Benz Streamliner 600 recently, great amp, which is also still supported.
 
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#19
Ironically, old tube amps can be easier to maintain as long as they use the most common tubes…12AX7, 6V6, EL84, 6L6, EL34, 6550, etc. The hardest parts to replace are probably the transformers (agedhorse may comment).

As far as cabinets, it's a question of finding drivers with the right specs for the cab. Luckily, there are a number of manufacturers making vintage-spec drivers that will work in older cabinets (again agedhorse may comment).

I own a late 50s Silvertone 5W guitar amp made by Danelectro and it's still rocking 65 years later. While mismatched brands, the tubes that were in the amp when I got it in 1980 were all OLD. A DuMont 6V6 (they went under in 1960), a Westinghouse 6X5GT rectifier (they stopped making audio tubes in the early 60s) and an RCA 6AU6 preamp tube. I replaced the 6V6 with a Sovtek over 20 years ago, the other two tubes are still doing fine. The speaker (maybe a Fisher?) is 3.2 ohms (common back then in small class a amps for some reason…I also had a Harmony 5W with a 3.2 ohm Jensen) but it's fine even though I used it for bass practice for a few years :wideyed:

It's the older solid state amps using particular transistors that are no longer available that can be a real problem. At one point, I owned three A.M.P. BH420 heads, so if one failed, I could use one of the others. :meh:
 
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#20
One other thing I'll add is asking yourself, honestly, if you actually want a head and cabinet or if it would make more sense to get a more powerful combo that can take an extension cab.

The argument for head and cabs is that it's more versatile: you can swap each component out or have different heads or cabs for different occasions. But this is really only useful if you're going to need or use that versatility.

I got back into playing with bands about 5 years ago after a loooong break and I immediately assumed that I needed a head and cabinet because I didn't realize that combos don't suck anymore.

In retrospect, I wish I had just gotten a Rumble 500 or Rocket Bass or MarkBass combo or something because it would be so much simpler. I am happy with my amp situation, but it's overkill for my actual needs, was more expensive, and is more to keep up with.
 
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