Double Bass Using Technology in the Shed (DB forum Thread)

[vin*tone]

Good zombie thread. Technology has come a long way since it started.

I use one of these now:

Really easy to four-track a band. Great quality jam recordings. I usually set the stereo mics in the middle of the room to catch drums and guitar, then run a mic line for vocals and one for a bass mic.

 

[Feral Feline]

Anybody on the DB side using the Beat Buddy?

Quick search on YT got zip-nada-bing for BB + DB.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I know I had posted about Amazing Slow Downer for the iPad a few years back, but it has become a centerpiece for practice of late in a way that is actually helping me a lot and motivating me to use practice time more effectively. After reading a lot about how our brains learn and what are effective ways to overcome stumbling blocks (see books like The Talent Code, Talent Is Overrated, and Make It Stick, etc.), I've been focusing more on the idea of working on small chunks with focus, and then stringing them together. The ASD program on the iPad is amazing for facilitating this, so I thought I'd share the process in case it might help someone else get out of a rut.

The basic theory is that on most material, I play at a certain decently high level on most of it, then struggle with a certain unusual/idiosyncratic section of the piece (translation - a small patch of "weird changes" or "difficult lines/fingerings"), then return to the higher level when the more "normal" material comes back. After teaching for many years, I'm always noticing students stumbling on certain sections of tunes time after time after time, and then encouraging them to focus on these, so it basically amounts to taking my own advice, but on a really micro level.

A few examples might be:
- For most students, the bridge of Ipanema, and how each chord flows into the next

- This little chunk of "Speak No Evil":

etc.


With ASD, I'll take my ancient little Edirol recorder to the piano and record a very basic version of the changes to the entire tune with either a metronome or DrumGenius marking time in the background; students can do the same by using a play along track with decent voicings. Then I'll upload that track to Dropbox and import it into ASD.

From there, the looping and slowdown features of ASD really shine! They are now adjustable in fractions of seconds down to the thousandth, so it's easy to create a loop that doesn't interrupt the flow of time when it resets. For the "Speak No Evil" fragment above, for instance, it would be easy to create a loop in time that only contains the Emi-->Cmi change including anticipations, then slow it down to tempo di learno and shed it for 10 minutes non stop; after that, expand the end of the loop to include the Dmi-->Bbmi chunk, and wash/rinse/repeat. Once that material starts to feel a bit more organic under the ear/fingers, expand again to include the A7alt-->Bbmi chunk that follows.

Working on little tiny connections in this way really seems to help things gel in my decaying old brain and makes it feel like some real progress is being made even when I might only spend 20-30 minutes working on it. And the slowdown engine of the program is so advanced that you can really take a lot of tempo off of a chunk of music without it degrading too much. This is especially useful when the original recorded track was made with slow practice in mind in the first place.

Currently working on the melody and changes to A Flower Is A Lovesome Thing in this manner, and finally feel like I might be getting somewhere with this tune after all these years!

 

[lermgalieu]

View attachment 3308669

I know I had posted about Amazing Slow Downer for the iPad a few years back, but it has become a centerpiece for practice of late in a way that is actually helping me a lot and motivating me to use practice time more effectively. After reading a lot about how our brains learn and what are effective ways to overcome stumbling blocks (see books like The Talent Code, Talent Is Overrated, and Make It Stick, etc.), I've been focusing more on the idea of working on small chunks with focus, and then stringing them together. The ASD program on the iPad is amazing for facilitating this, so I thought I'd share the process in case it might help someone else get out of a rut.

The basic theory is that on most material, I play at a certain decently high level on most of it, then struggle with a certain unusual/idiosyncratic section of the piece (translation - a small patch of "weird changes" or "difficult lines/fingerings"), then return to the higher level when the more "normal" material comes back. After teaching for many years, I'm always noticing students stumbling on certain sections of tunes time after time after time, and then encouraging them to focus on these, so it basically amounts to taking my own advice, but on a really micro level.

A few examples might be:
- For most students, the bridge of Ipanema, and how each chord flows into the next

- This little chunk of "Speak No Evil":
View attachment 3308684

etc.


With ASD, I'll take my ancient little Edirol recorder to the piano and record a very basic version of the changes to the entire tune with either a metronome or DrumGenius marking time in the background; students can do the same by using a play along track with decent voicings. Then I'll upload that track to Dropbox and import it into ASD.

From there, the looping and slowdown features of ASD really shine! They are now adjustable in fractions of seconds down to the thousandth, so it's easy to create a loop that doesn't interrupt the flow of time when it resets. For the "Speak No Evil" fragment above, for instance, it would be easy to create a loop in time that only contains the Emi-->Cmi change including anticipations, then slow it down to tempo di learno and shed it for 10 minutes non stop; after that, expand the end of the loop to include the Dmi-->Bbmi chunk, and wash/rinse/repeat. Once that material starts to feel a bit more organic under the ear/fingers, expand again to include the A7alt-->Bbmi chunk that follows.

Working on little tiny connections in this way really seems to help things gel in my decaying old brain and makes it feel like some real progress is being made even when I might only spend 20-30 minutes working on it. And the slowdown engine of the program is so advanced that you can really take a lot of tempo off of a chunk of music without it degrading too much. This is especially useful when the original recorded track was made with slow practice in mind in the first place.

Currently working on the melody and changes to A Flower Is A Lovesome Thing in this manner, and finally feel like I might be getting somewhere with this tune after all these years!

It's a great tool that I have sadly not used much recently because of how DRM files interact with it now. Used to be I could import anything from my iTunes library, but (well, this has been several years now) you can't - I have to take the files and convert them to non-DRM (which I don't really want to do) in order to import them into ASD. Obviously, this is not a concern in your use-case, but my typical use would probably be playing along with a recording someone else made. You're also reminding me of my great Edirol RD-9 which was stolen at a gig and which I've now replaced with an adequate but less-compact Tascam unit.

 

[Maple]

My practice over the last year has usually involved my iPad and/or iPhone. With the recently added multi-tasking feature, the iPad has become a really powerful tool. The iPad, especially with the apple pencil, is great in a band setting.

For a pdf reader - I use foreScore. I used to use iGigBook. Though simple to use, iGB was too limited in other areas for my needs. On the other hand, foreScore is a pain to set up initially but once set up, lets you do a lot more. I can quickly edit pages by drawing on them with the pencil, share those pages via AirDrop to other iPad users in the band even if there's no wifi. And bringing in new tunes (I'm often working with originals) is super easy too. On the occasion I have a set list with originals, In can attach mp3's of those tunes to the chart. then the chart has a mini player that lets me play a long to.

I keep a Spotify playlist for each band I play in - the playlist contains examples of every tune we're working on and sometimes has multiple versions of a tune so I can get a sense for how varied that tune can be performed. For some projects, I've created a shared playlist with other band mates so we could all contribute songs to the list - for example, I might like a certain version of Green Dolphin Street and someone else finds some other obscure version and throws it in there.

I use Amazing Slow Downer for playing that playlist (often tunes are in the wrong key or if I have trouble with a phrase, I can loop the phrase).

Using the multi-tasking feature, I can have foreScore and ASD open side by side on the iPad - so I can play along with Miles, Hubbard or whoever I want. The built in speaker is also pretty good at filtering out the bass so it's not so weird to play along without filtering the bass out. Note - ASD works in multi-tasking mode while Spotify doesn't. So ASD is a great tool to allow playback while reading charts.

I used to use iRealB but much less now. I'd rather play along with a recording or just go solo and imagine the melody while playing. iRealB has a few features that make it more of a crutch than a tool to move you forward. The highlighted measure marker should be turned off. And the chords played are just what's written - so if you get too used to them, you won't be prepared for a real pianist. However, for play along, I recommend...

The Peter Erskine suite of "Jazz Essentials" apps are really great for a variety of reasons. They have a multi-tracked band doing popular jazz standards. You can solo or mute any track and can record your own track to listen back to in context of the band, When I have a specific goal to work on - soloing, walking lines, experimenting with rhythms (avoiding 1), etc.. I can really go deep by playing along with these apps. My only complaint is that the song library is limited. It's also a pleasure to play along with Alan Pasqua - on most tunes, he stretches out quite a bit in the middle verses so you give your ears a good workout as you play along.

TheWoodShed - I forget who - but one of the forum members here made this app for practicing scales as described by Chris Fitzgerald. You set a start note, end note, key, tempo and it just plays tones up and down that scale endlessly until your significant other clocks you in the head.

Drumgenius - very cool. especially if you're working on clave. The Metrogenius part of it is also great if you need to work on unusual rhythms - for example, my BL has a 5/8 tune with a specific 3+2. I can set Metrogenius up to replicate that groove so I can practice soloing over it.

"Pro Metronome" by EUM is similar to the Metrogenius feature in Drumgenius - you can set up polyrhythms, set the sound of each metronome beat, etc.

"OmniTuner" on my iPhone is a good and accurate tuner for most anything but not always easy to use on the bass. So I save it as a backup. The SNARK tuner works pretty well. I keep it clicked to my music stand and then clip it to the bridge bass foot while tuning.

 

[lermgalieu]

I keep a Spotify playlist for each band I play in - the playlist contains examples of every tune we're working on and sometimes has multiple versions of a tune so I can get a sense for how varied that tune can be performed. For some projects, I've created a shared playlist with other band mates so we could all contribute songs to the list - for example, I might like a certain version of Green Dolphin Street and someone else finds some other obscure version and throws it in there.

I've avoided Spotify to date for personal reasons; but I do know there is a special Spotify integration in ASD. Does this allow you to seamlessly play along to Spotify tunes? Do you need to have a paid Spotify subscription or does it work with a free subscription? Thanks!

 

[Maple]

I've avoided Spotify to date for personal reasons; but I do know there is a special Spotify integration in ASD. Does this allow you to seamlessly play along to Spotify tunes? Do you need to have a paid Spotify subscription or does it work with a free subscription? Thanks!

I have a paid subscription but I would think it works fine either way

 

[lermgalieu]

I have a paid subscription but I would think it works fine either way

A shame they couldn’t get better iTunes integration. Thanks!

 

[oren]

I use Tempo Slow Mo instead of ASD on my iPad, and I haven’t had any problems pulling in tunes from iTunes for looping and/or slowing down.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I just pulled in a tune from iTunes on the latest version of ASD without any problem. Easy as a couple of clicks.

 

[BobbyT]

Can you guys who mentioned playing along with records and filtering out the bass go into a little more detail on your current setup and operation? What equipment and/or apps would somebody need to get started from scratch? I have a laptop and a pair of headphones and not much else...

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

@BobbyT It's a pretty simple process that doesn't require a lot of gear. Most computer programs that play music include some kind of equalizer You would simply need to roll off the frequencies below about 200-250hz, and you would be good to go.

I'm on a Mac, so pulled up the equalizer and set the parameters to what is described above. It took all of 10 seconds. Screenshot below:

 

[BobbyT]

@BobbyT It's a pretty simple process that doesn't require a lot of gear. Most computer programs that play music include some kind of equalizer You would simply need to roll off the frequencies below about 200-250hz, and you would be good to go.

I'm on a Mac, so pulled up the equalizer and set the parameters to what is described above. It took all of 10 seconds. Screenshot below:

View attachment 3310102

Cheers, thanks Chris!

 

[damonsmith]

After all this time, even I have slightly buckled and I use Drone Tone Tool a few times a week and drum genius when I have certain concerts coming up. Drum genius I consider to be part of the "playing" section of my work. Most of what is described here should't be confused with practicing the instrument.

I think we still need to be able to get on with it with just a bass, a bow a music stand and some etudes.
I would strongly recommend that each of us spend a few days week with that focus.
Daily dependence on tech to practice can't be healthy for your bass playing.

 

[lermgalieu]

After all this time, even I have slightly buckled and I use Drone Tone Tool a few times a week and drum genius when I have certain concerts coming up. Drum genius I consider to be part of the "playing" section of my work. Most of what is described here should't be confused with practicing the instrument.

I think we still need to be able to get on with it with just a bass, a bow a music stand and some etudes.
I would strongly recommend that each of us spend a few days week with that focus.
Daily dependence on tech to practice can't be healthy for your bass playing.

I’m pretty sure it depends what you’re trying to learn/practice. That said, some time with just a bow and some etudes might do wonders for me, so perhaps you are wholly correct.

 

[damonsmith]

I’m pretty sure it depends what you’re trying to learn/practice. That said, some time with just a bow and some etudes might do wonders for me, so perhaps you are wholly correct.

Learning rep. is learning rep. practicing the instrument is practicing the instrument. One can benefit the other, but, there are separate concepts for a reason. Both are important.

 

[lermgalieu]

learning rep

¿Qué significa eso?

 

[damonsmith]

¿Qué significa eso?

repertoire - learning songs or compositions.

 

[lermgalieu]

repertoire - learning songs or compositions.

Thank you!

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Just downloaded the ASD app for Mac OS, and all I can say is WOW! It's totally wonderful for my home practice because the controls are so much more fine tunable than on the IOS app. The stop & start points for loops are adjustable to the 75th of a second, so you can really get a perfect loop. The pitch control is also easily adjustable in cents, so I can either tune a recording to my bass or piano, or tune the bass to the recording.

For Bach suites and bebop heads, this means it's truly easy to record a medium slow version on piano, import it to ASD, and set the controls to loop whatever section I'm working on. It immediately brings intonation discrepancies to my attention in a way that is very welcome.

In addition, being able to transpose any track up or down by several semitones really facilitates easy multi-key practice. Wish I'd known this app was available for the home computer much sooner.