soldering is easy until you try to pick up the iron like its a pencil. Still have that scar 30 years after the fact...
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
using wire nuts instead of soldering for pickups replacement
- Thread starter diverse379
- Start date
Wire nuts are a bad idea for pickups. Pickup lead wire is typically 20-24 AWG, smaller than what most commercially available wire nuts can effectively connect. Soldering is the best solution since you need to make an electrical connection as opposed to a mechanical connection.
Usable soldering irons (pencil type) are cheap. In fact as someone noted crimp-connections are the best non-solder connects. The crimp things look like long tubes and you can even get them covered in insulation so you don't need shrink tube. By the way a hair dryer works OK for shrinking shrink-tube. If it's not hot enough use tape to block off part of the air inlet. Only use for short periods to keep from setting it on fire though.
The best soldering irons are not cheap (temperature controlled) but have the advantage that they heat up quickly. A cheap solder pencil works fine but you have to let it sit around for a while to get hot. Good enough for one-time jobs.
And speaking of expenses. A crimping tool for the cheaper crimp-on connectors will cost a lot more than a cheap solder pencil.
Standard alternative to shrink tube insulation is wrapping the joint with electrical tape. Works OK to start, but over time the glue goes nuts and one day you open the bass and the tape has unwound off of the wires! That's why folks prefer shrink tube.
Wire nuts are commonly used for communications splicing (I done it) and would be just fine for electric guitar splicing too.
They are available in very small sizes that are suitable for 24AWG hookup wire used in guitars. They are not cheap. They do not eliminate the need for a soldering iron because most connections must be soldered anyway. They provide a means of having a common point without having to solder more than one wire to a terminal. This makes a very neat wiring. It makes it much easier too.
First, you solder all your leads on the bench where you can work easily then you can install all the components in the guitar then splice it all together. You don't have to try to use a red hot soldering iron in a confined routing.
Never re-use a splice. Cut and strip the wire again then twist together. I would not use them for a connecting terminal for the coax output on active p/u 's but are fine for the power lead.
They are available in very small sizes that are suitable for 24AWG hookup wire used in guitars. They are not cheap. They do not eliminate the need for a soldering iron because most connections must be soldered anyway. They provide a means of having a common point without having to solder more than one wire to a terminal. This makes a very neat wiring. It makes it much easier too.
First, you solder all your leads on the bench where you can work easily then you can install all the components in the guitar then splice it all together. You don't have to try to use a red hot soldering iron in a confined routing.
Never re-use a splice. Cut and strip the wire again then twist together. I would not use them for a connecting terminal for the coax output on active p/u 's but are fine for the power lead.
I have used wire nuts on small wire (22 AWG) on heavy machinery that vibrated a whole more than any bass will ever vibrate. Never had a connection fail.
If there is enough length of wire twisted together and the right size wire nut used, it will work just fine. It's not the best way to wire up bass innards, though.
-
If there is enough length of wire twisted together and the right size wire nut used, it will work just fine. It's not the best way to wire up bass innards, though.
-
I don't think anyone is disputing that solder is the preferred method but we are merely pointing out that the OP's problems are not the fault of wire nuts.
Figuring out which end of the soldering iron is the handle is an IQ test...
That's one test I only failed once, lol
No. I absolutely disagree with this. Because of the vibrations, and the bass usually used being used in an environment that is prone to causing corrosion, there is nothing that takes the place of good clean solder joints.
What you have described is exactly why we all complain about bad service from the telephone company.
This is a great thread... Having never soldered enough to get good at it, I have tried several methods over the years to bodge together bass electronics. None of them have ever failed, but I have never had the stones to admit it. As usual, Pilgrim provides the good info, complete with videos.
I agree I am glad I admitted my repair approach
It was a wake up call to
bite the bullet and stop doing things half way
when it is not much harder to do things the right way.
the worst thing is if this repair failed during a gig and I had no back up bass.
YIKES!!!!
It was a wake up call to
bite the bullet and stop doing things half way
when it is not much harder to do things the right way.
the worst thing is if this repair failed during a gig and I had no back up bass.
YIKES!!!!
Not prefferrd; absolutely neccesary. Solder can't be avoided on any connections. I can only be as good as the one who knows how to solder the right way though. All splice caps can do make it possible to change out parts quickly by means of a tap or splice. Just like solder, splice caps are only as good as the user.
Marettes will work just fine. Pretty near every light switch, plug in, light fixture, in every modern house, has marettes connecting the wiring.
They will not vibrate loose if they are the right size and applied correctly.
They will not vibrate loose if they are the right size and applied correctly.
Solder is best but wirenuts should work just fine also if they're the right size and used properly.I use the little grey wirenuts all the time on#20gauge wire and smaller.There are also crimp connectors/splices available but again the correct size is critical.
Here's the problem with using wire nuts in a bass: the pickup signals are very weak- typically peaks out near a volt, and the current is also tiny, probably microamps. Copper oxidizes very quickly once it's exposed to air, but there's still a microscopic thin film of copper oxide covering the conductors. Wire nuts are supposed to cut through this oxide layer, but they're not perfect. And you still have a physical junction of dissimilar metals...the oxide film can cause a high resistance, unless there's enough current to overcome it. This is why they work sometimes, and sometimes they don't. This same problem can also occur with any kind of non-solder connector, including the modular pin connectors that EMG uses. Same deal with the push-on 'spade' connectors that some speakers use.
For pickup wiring, I would recommend these over wire nuts, spade terminals or crimp-on splicers. These connectors are designed for telephone use, are correctly sized for the wiring typically used in basses, and most importantly they are filled with a silicone gel/grease that seals out air and moisture once the connection is made. And the connection can be visually inspected once it's done too.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
Soldering is still the best way.
For pickup wiring, I would recommend these over wire nuts, spade terminals or crimp-on splicers. These connectors are designed for telephone use, are correctly sized for the wiring typically used in basses, and most importantly they are filled with a silicone gel/grease that seals out air and moisture once the connection is made. And the connection can be visually inspected once it's done too.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
Soldering is still the best way.
wow the info keeps coming.
so we finally got someone to mention resistance
which was my suspicion from the beginning.
well i will be soldering today or tomorrow and we will see how it holds out during band rehearsal tomorrow
so we finally got someone to mention resistance
which was my suspicion from the beginning.
well i will be soldering today or tomorrow and we will see how it holds out during band rehearsal tomorrow
The grey Marrettes are the correct size and if you follow the chart on the box it specifies the max # of conductors for a range of A.W.G. sizes and combinations thereof. You can't go wrong. Never re-spice twisted wires more than once though and for that reason it's a good idea to solder before twisting on the cap.
I do not advise using crimp connections with anything under # 18 A.W.G. because they are just too unreliable.. even with pro crimppers, you think it's a good crimp and everything is fine until you're putting everything back together when the damn terminal falls off!
For guitars, PA etc. I would not recommend copper conductors. Tinned copper is the industry standard. Tin is the very best conductor (for those who were not already aware)
As far as I was aware, EMG connections seem to be very positive. They are very much computer connections, the very same type you will find on mother boards on computers that do thing where human life is at stake. And yes they fail and people die but most pro guitar and bass players that run EMG's will tell you that they are bulletproof. The connections are no better or worse than splice caps used properly. There is no difference unless you play in a swamp! Watch out for the leeches!
I do not advise using crimp connections with anything under # 18 A.W.G. because they are just too unreliable.. even with pro crimppers, you think it's a good crimp and everything is fine until you're putting everything back together when the damn terminal falls off!
For guitars, PA etc. I would not recommend copper conductors. Tinned copper is the industry standard. Tin is the very best conductor (for those who were not already aware
)As far as I was aware, EMG connections seem to be very positive. They are very much computer connections, the very same type you will find on mother boards on computers that do thing where human life is at stake. And yes they fail and people die but most pro guitar and bass players that run EMG's will tell you that they are bulletproof. The connections are no better or worse than splice caps used properly. There is no difference unless you play in a swamp! Watch out for the leeches!
Another way to make good splices that I just remembered is these little terminal strips used on some Italian and Spanish applications they resemble real neat little barrier strips like those used on the balanced outs of Dbx 166's (compressor/limiter) and other PA except each terminal of the strip is a little Marr connecter.
They are made of areal nice insulation material and use solid brass terminations with common (flat blade) set screws.
You simply strip the wire, tin the end, loossen the set screw, insert the wire and tighten the set screw. What you end up with is the ultimate splices for electric guitar.
They are made of areal nice insulation material and use solid brass terminations with common (flat blade) set screws.
You simply strip the wire, tin the end, loossen the set screw, insert the wire and tighten the set screw. What you end up with is the ultimate splices for electric guitar.
