"Wanna buy a REFRIGERATOR...cheap???"

[Spanky123]

Unfortunately, I don't have access to another cab right now, but I plugged the speaker into the extension jack of another amp (30-watt Ashton practice amp) and got the same effect at low volume.

A used 8 is going to be tough. Try to play the amp through a known good cab just to be confident of your suspicion regarding the driver.

 

[T_Bone_TL]

You could do worse than to look for a different, local speaker - either 8" or bigger in in a cabinet - but of course that's what you are doing, and you're finding refrigerators. Heck, a car audio subwooferish thing might work, and might be cheap at the automobile junkyard.

What I can tell you, from my own research into my inexpensive and very old-tech combo is that the route to making the next one survive will almost certainly be to crank your bass EQ way down, or (if you have it) your high-pass filter way up. I was somewhat less than enthralled to find that my "200W 1x15" speaker coupled to a 130W amp will die with anywhere from 25-40 watts (depending what box it's in - I was looking at the "build a better, lighter box for it" option) at 65-80 Hz. Fortunately, I haven't found that out by blowing it.

As it happens, it has a setup to split for bi-amping in the preamp section, and if I take the high part of that and set the crossover at about 125 hz, I can wail the full 130 watts the amp makes into the speaker without issue - if I had a 200W (yes, I know YOU have a 300W amp, but the speaker I have here is only 200W) amp, it would need to be set at a bit higher frequency to be safe. The difference in sound is actually not as bad as you would think - it's worth trying if you have the opportunity. It loses some room-vibrating ability, but does not sound nearly as weak as you might think it would, and won't blow the speaker (or so says the simulation software...)

If you can do something like that, you might even get away with using an old high-fi speaker for a while (yes, yes, terrible idea for the purists, but I get that your speaker is blown and you are looking for _something_ that will work NOW, so see what you can find cheap and used even if it doesn't claim to be "a bass speaker"), and you could eventually add a sub if you felt the need to fill in the bottom. A PA speaker would be a more "musician approved" option in a similar vein.

In general, to get more use out of your amp, you'll want more speakers, period. If you use smallish ones, you might not need two roadies, though you will need two or three trips, or a cart to haul them. If you get 4 the same, you can wire them up to be the same impedance as one.

 

[Spanky123]

This is how I am thinking at the moment. The problem will get solved -- eventually. I will get another good speaker and if a junkyard subwoofer gets me through rehearsal until a more permanent solution comes along...my guitarist may have some ideas along those lines. I will speak to him tomorrow.

You could do worse than to look for a different, local speaker - either 8" or bigger in in a cabinet - but of course that's what you are doing, and you're finding refrigerators. Heck, a car audio subwooferish thing might work, and might be cheap at the automobile junkyard.

What I can tell you, from my own research into my inexpensive and very old-tech combo is that the route to making the next one survive will almost certainly be to crank your bass EQ way down, or (if you have it) your high-pass filter way up. I was somewhat less than enthralled to find that my "200W 1x15" speaker coupled to a 130W amp will die with anywhere from 25-40 watts (depending what box it's in - I was looking at the "build a better, lighter box for it" option) at 65-80 Hz. Fortunately, I haven't found that out by blowing it.

As it happens, it has a setup to split for bi-amping in the preamp section, and if I take the high part of that and set the crossover at about 125 hz, I can wail the full 130 watts the amp makes into the speaker without issue - if I had a 200W (yes, I know YOU have a 300W amp, but the speaker I have here is only 200W) amp, it would need to be set at a bit higher frequency to be safe. The difference in sound is actually not as bad as you would think - it's worth trying if you have the opportunity. It loses some room-vibrating ability, but does not sound nearly as weak as you might think it would, and won't blow the speaker (or so says the simulation software...)

If you can do something like that, you might even get away with using an old high-fi speaker for a while (yes, yes, terrible idea for the purists, but I get that your speaker is blown and you are looking for _something_ that will work NOW, so see what you can find cheap and used even if it doesn't claim to be "a bass speaker"), and you could eventually add a sub if you felt the need to fill in the bottom. A PA speaker would be a more "musician approved" option in a similar vein.

In general, to get more use out of your amp, you'll want more speakers, period. If you use smallish ones, you might not need two roadies, though you will need two or three trips, or a cart to haul them. If you get 4 the same, you can wire them up to be the same impedance as one.

 

[agedhorse]

Because of a couple of messages I received relating to both of Spanky's threads, I would like to clarify some important details that were left out as well as some factual errors and assumptions that some folks are making.

1. Since Spanky is located in Australia, he needs to go through the Australian service agent, which I have provided the contact information for. Being frustrated at the USA folks isn't productive because they do not handle service in Australia.

2. My understanding is that the amp was purchased used in Australia from a guy who purchased it from the USA. This means that any service must be paid for in Australia because the USA warranty can not apply in Australia. The Australian agent is only responsible for what they import and sell in the AU market.

3. The amp does NOT deliver 300 watts into the 8" speaker, it's 175 watts into the 8" combo's speaker and the amp has a suitable high order HPF as well as being a very robust driver with a substantial suspension and an edge wound specially vented voice coil. There are many, many of them out there without any problems.

4. It's possible that the cabinet got dropped (perhaps unknowingly) and the frame bent slightly. I do not think the problem was due to overpowering or being driven too hard. The smaller cabinets are pretty easy to mishandle... a friend trying to help has a minor accident that nobody sees, everything looks ok so nothing is said... for example.

5. It's unlikely that Spanky will find an off the shelf speaker that is going to work. This is a highly customized driver with some unique features that allows this performance in such a compact enclosure. A replacement speaker can be ordered from the Australian service agent, I already provided the proper part number to him.

6. Cost differences (in general) between countries are not directly comparable because the additional costs due to taxes, fees, duty and tarrifs are often offset by things like national healthcare, national pensions, higher wages and different work rules. In general, the trade-offs are pretty much even from what I have seen.

Hope this helps with everybody's understanding.

 

[Spanky123]

I tried....I really tried...

Actually, I omitted it [the brand name] on purpose. I am not in the mood to talk to the company, or their pundits at the moment. I will most likely be in a more resourceful state of mind in a day or two. No biggie, just a little cranky from an expensive disappointment. I posted this to get some advice that wasn't directly related to the brand.

Meanwhile, I really would be interested in how I can improvise a solution while I am getting this sorted.

 

[Spanky123]

Agedhorse,

--I am not sure I am entirely comfortable with you divulging the sales information -- information I gave you in a PM -- to the general population of the board. In the future, I will keep in mind that anything I PM you can and will be used to whatever purpose you deem to be fit.

--In this thread, I was searching for general information. I didn't even name the brand of the amplifier, and within hours I got your six-point rebuttal -- obviously more directed towards the board than me -- complete with a summary of socioeconomic differences between Australia and North America. You're thorough, at least, but again I am not sure that was entirely called for.

--The suggestion that the amp might have been dropped was not something I recall you telling me was a possibility in any of my communication with you. At least the rest of the board knows that now, as well. It has not had much of an opportunity of getting dropped in my living room.

--Pardon my saying so, but I get the impression that you are more interested in patrolling the brand's Public Image than you are in helping me out -- that is, if I was asking you to help me out in this thread. Clearly, I wasn't.

Because of a couple of messages I received relating to both of Spanky's threads, I would like to clarify some important details that were left out as well as some factual errors and assumptions that some folks are making.

1. Since Spanky is located in Australia, he needs to go through the Australian service agent, which I have provided the contact information for. Being frustrated at the USA folks isn't productive because they do not handle service in Australia.

2. My understanding is that the amp was purchased used in Australia from a guy who purchased it from the USA. This means that any service must be paid for in Australia because the USA warranty can not apply in Australia. The Australian agent is only responsible for what they import and sell in the AU market.

3. The amp does NOT deliver 300 watts into the 8" speaker, it's 175 watts into the 8" combo's speaker and the amp has a suitable high order HPF as well as being a very robust driver with a substantial suspension and an edge wound specially vented voice coil. There are many, many of them out there without any problems.

4. It's possible that the cabinet got dropped (perhaps unknowingly) and the frame bent slightly. I do not think the problem was due to overpowering or being driven too hard. The smaller cabinets are pretty easy to mishandle... a friend trying to help has a minor accident that nobody sees, everything looks ok so nothing is said... for example.

5. It's unlikely that Spanky will find an off the shelf speaker that is going to work. This is a highly customized driver with some unique features that allows this performance in such a compact enclosure. A replacement speaker can be ordered from the Australian service agent, I already provided the proper part number to him.

6. Cost differences (in general) between countries are not directly comparable because the additional costs due to taxes, fees, duty and tarrifs are often offset by things like national healthcare, national pensions, higher wages and different work rules. In general, the trade-offs are pretty much even from what I have seen.

Hope this helps with everybody's understanding.

 

[Downunderwonder]

The difference in price between USA and Australia is mostly greedy importer sole distributors, not taxes and fees or shipping.

As far as I know Australia has the same 15% sales tax as NZ. We have zero duty. So called distributors do not carry spare stock to distribute. They collect orders and then get a pallet of gear on said cheap slow boat.

Stuff 'em I say. We can get our stuff airmailed in a few days, costing a good chunk of the value, and it's still cheaper!

It's high time the likes of FMC, Eminence, Kaman etc reviewed the practices of their agents that lead to so much grey market importing.

 

[Spanky123]

The replacement speaker that I need is $139. I emailed the supplier. $89 for shipping. That brings it to $228 for one 8" speaker. My fear is that something I am unaware of caused it to blow, and if I replace it, the same thing might happen again. (I have not conclusively determined that it has blown). I need to take it to a service center that is not particularly close. the service center may have the speaker I need, but I strongly doubt it will be less $$ than what I can find online.

That being said, the darn thing does sound absolutely gorgeous.

The difference in price between USA and Australia is mostly greedy importer sole distributors, not taxes and fees or shipping.

As far as I know Australia has the same 15% sales tax as NZ. We have zero duty. So called distributors do not carry spare stock to distribute. They collect orders and then get a pallet of gear on said cheap slow boat.

Stuff 'em I say. We can get our stuff airmailed in a few days, costing a good chunk of the value, and it's still cheaper!

It's high time the likes of FMC, Eminence, Kaman etc reviewed the practices of their agents that lead to so much grey market importing.

 

[AtomicPunk]

Not to jump in something that's not my business, but after reading AgedHorse's post (whether or not you feel it's appropriate to post it here, that's another story) but it sounds like there have been significant efforts to "help you out". To be contacted by someone from the company "within hours" with the part number, where to order replacements, etc. is not going to happen with other manufacturers. And, no, I don't work for them, or endorse.

 

[lomo]

Bummer. I have had GB 3-8 combo for years, have used it a lot, even fairly loud, and have never had an issue. If that's the combo you're talking about, I'd just get another small cab and transfer the head and bracket.

 

[BogeyBass]

If it was bought used, it might have already been abused.

How big is this thing? would it support a 10" speaker that could be bought local without shipping

musical instrument speaker of course not some hodge podge home stereo/car thing

 

[JimmyM]

Agedhorse,

--I am not sure I am entirely comfortable with you divulging the sales information -- information I gave you in a PM -- to the general population of the board. In the future, I will keep in mind that anything I PM you can and will be used to whatever purpose you deem to be fit.

--In this thread, I was searching for general information. I didn't even name the brand of the amplifier, and within hours I got your six-point rebuttal -- obviously more directed towards the board than me -- complete with a summary of socioeconomic differences between Australia and North America. You're thorough, at least, but again I am not sure that was entirely called for.

--The suggestion that the amp might have been dropped was not something I recall you telling me was a possibility in any of my communication with you. At least the rest of the board knows that now, as well. It has not had much of an opportunity of getting dropped in my living room.

--Pardon my saying so, but I get the impression that you are more interested in patrolling the brand's Public Image than you are in helping me out -- that is, if I was asking you to help me out in this thread. Clearly, I wasn't.

Like we didn't already know what it was by the other thread you posted. You're kind of hostile to people trying to help you out.

 

[B-string]

I guess I missed the other thread? With two thread on the same problem I would guess that some potential damage control was warranted. Agedhorse has always made customer satisfaction his #1 goal and steps up for any owner.
If you are uncomfortable with info posted by him all I can say is one thread is enough. With two you make your problem more public?
Hope things turn out well for your problem anyway.

15% sales tax! Dang we complain about 8-9%

 

[agedhorse]

As jimmy said (and one of the comments that I received from a fellow Aussie member), it was pretty clear what and who you were talking about. What was not clear in this thread was that you were located outside of the US (how about updating location in your profile?), had bought the amp used, and that I had indeed provided very specific information about how to go about getting your amp repaired including the Australian contact info. and the part number that would be needed. Your comments in this thread did not accurately represent what occurred, I was factually correcting your inaccurate public comments about what happened and the specific help that I did provide to you. Public bashing of something while providing inaccurate information really is not cool IMO.

Since your amp was bought used, I brought up the possibility that there might have been something that happened before you owned it, this certainly is a possibility.

Regarding the cost of shipping (anything) into Australia, that's not anything that any of us have any control of, and it's brand and product independent.

I am sorry that the help that I provided was unacceptable to you.

 

[agedhorse]

Also, please note that my "socio-economic" comments had nothing to do with Australia, but were VERY general and occur between every single country throughout the world. I mentioned it as an example of why prices may appear to be significantly different, though when all factors are considered overall, the real differences may be very small indeed. This is basic macro-economic theory, something that affects everybody on this forum regardless of where they live.

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

The Faital Pro 8PR200 would be a good replacement for that stock speaker, and will provide wildly better performance. I'm using this one in the Crazy8 and Crazy88 cabs. Sounds wonderful.

http://www.usspeaker.com/faital pro 8pr200-1.htm

 

[Spanky123]

Well, as long as its cool to post stuff from people's private messages, here is the only diagnosis I received from agedhorse:


"Sounds like a defective speaker, sometimes this happens. You can take this to any Fender electronics service center and they can take care of it for you.*"

The only thing he has told me besides this was, in his last PM:

"I would certainly have a trusted tech look at your speaker to be sure it's really bad before going any farther. It's possible that it's nothing more than a loose screw or a wire touching the basket."

The other stuff about it possibly getting dropped or being damaged was not something agedhorse ever shared with me before he shared it with the board.

The disconnect here is that agedhorse has been telling me something in PM's that is much different than what he has told the board in this thread. Had I known that he thought it was dropped or abused previously, I would have followed up on those possibilities. (I doubt it, though. It was fine when I first received it. The only time I have transported it is between my living room and practice room. I haven't dropped it, so far).

Agedhorse, I am going to request that in the future you not post information I give in any private messages to you. I don't think that is too unreasonable. Meanwhile, now that you have told the board it may have been damaged as a result of being dropped, can you tell me how I might determine that myself?

If people don't like me posting about what to do, perhaps someone can tell me how I can get general bass info despite the fact that many people seem to know the brand of the amp I am having trouble with? I think I have a right to post bass-related concerns in a general manner, even if the manufacturer of my amplifier doesn't like it. I am unsure how to do that, now that the word is out concerning what brand of amplifier I own. I thought starting a new thread and not identifying the make and model would be acceptable. I guess smalltown gossip prevents that.

*[Note: Fender bought Genz Benz recently. When I emailed Genz Benz, I got a form reply telling me to call Fender. I attempted to get Fender on the phone over the course of several days and was never sucessful. ]

 

[B-string]

Just to add to confusion or clear it up some? The corporation that bought Genz-Benz and allowed it to operating as a separate company was bought by Fender and recently decided to incorporate Genz-Benz fully into Fender. Agedhorse is the only direct link I know of with G-B other than now going through Fender service (which was not the case previously).
Agedhorse is your best friend to Genz-Benz info that I know of currently (at least until or if Fender puts the clamps on him?). We (hope I am not over-stepping) have a great deal of respect for agedhorse's efforts here.

UB posted this http://www.usspeaker.com/faital pro 8pr200-1.htm which might be a good possibility if available to you?

Not jumping on you BTW. I fully understand the frustration you are probably feeling about this all.

 

[BassmanPaul]

The problem with purchasing an amplifier on the US market and importing it to another country means, in essence, that the warranty is void. Very often the unit itself cannot be changed to the local mains supply in the country, This is a thing that faces every importer.

As for GB, both Hasbeen and Agedhorse bend over backwards to help any GB user resolve their problems. We have all seen this happen time after time.

The OP has a USED amplifier that has a damaged driver. The guys at GB provided the information required to resolve the OP's issue. That's all they can do for someone on the opposite side of the world.

What does the OP expect?? That GB provide him with a replacement driver at no charge?? If so, that's pretty unreasonable.

 

[Dave W]

The disconnect here is that agedhorse has been telling me something in PM's that is much different than what he has told the board in this thread.

He said it might be a defective speaker, which basically means to me there could be anything at all wrong with the speaker. Whether it's a manufacturing defect, user error, or dropped on the ground the end result would still be the same. I fail to see how that's any different from the PM or the replies in the thread.

*[Note: Fender bought Genz Benz recently. When I emailed Genz Benz, I got a form reply telling me to call Fender. I attempted to get Fender on the phone over the course of several days and was never sucessful. ]

Did you call them during their normal business hours? I've called them on a few occasions and always got through to someone. I had to sit on hold for a little while, but that's to be expected for a large company like them.