Was this unprofessional by the gig organizer?

[Nephilymbass]

Two weekends ago, my band played for a Music Education fundraiser at a resturant in our hometown. This is great for us considering we're in high school. But because of our age it seems as though we got pushed aside for other adult friends of the gig organizer. Pretty ironic considering this was supposed to be for giving young people gig and learning experience...

Anyways, this goes back a while. My band was the first to email the organizer about the event. This is also our third year playing it. For this, the gig organizer promised he would give us a great spot since we were on our game and are "veterans" of the event. We check a couple weeks later at the slots. We were placed at 3:30 in the afternoon while other adult bands and friends of the organizer were placed at prime time spots for eating dinner like 6:30, 7, and 7:30. This seemed a little bogus with the promise he made. Also the fact this is a fundraiser for students. My drummer emails him back asking why we didn't get a better spot like he told us. This was kind of sketchy to me. He did make us a promise and 3:30 isn't that great of a spot. I don't know if it was worthy of a complaint by my drummer. But I also can't decide if we're right to complain.

I guess this turned him off from us because there's some more to the story. The next part needs some context. Our last song was fairly long and at the end had a psychedelic breakdown and drum solo, which we worked on for quite a long time. This will be important.

We get to the gig and find out it's running late which is no big deal. We go on and do our thing and we start to get into the breakdown. My guitar player pulls out a violin bow and starts playing with it.

Suddenly, the organizer comes on stage and says our band name and "let's give them a hand" signaling we're getting kicked off. We all end the song and start packing up. In a very annoyed voice the organizer says, "pack up fast guys".

Now, we weren't running late. Since the gig was running late before us, the organizer cut off five minutes of our set without telling us beforehand. That sucked. It seems like he blatantly did not want us to play. I wasn't too concerned because this type of stuff happens when you're in a local band, but my drummer was furious.

In general, was the organizer a professional guy? Is this just local band craziness or really unprofessional?

The time slot thing would have irritated my band to the point where we possibly might even have said forget that show if we knew about it far enough in advance to warn our fans.

Cutting you guys off could have been handled better. The better way to have done it would have been to tell you that you had 5 minutes left instead of saying nothing and then cutting you off like that.

The "pack up fast" thing is kind of typical. In fact if that's exactly how he put it he actually said it nicely. We've opened for a lot of national acts over the years and I've heard the same thing said much more crudely. I remember holding our singer back to keep him from beating the hell out of powerman 5000s crew members because of how rude they were. The real professional way to handle that situation though is to have a show schedule posted in several locations and have a clock that's visible to the band on the stage and for the show to stay on schedule. A lot of times when shows run behind schedule it's not necessary the promoters fault, sometimes it's just the bands that played before you not giving a damn about anyone but themselves and running over their set time or dragging their butts turning over the stage. The professional thing for your band to do is to cut a song and turnover the stage quickly to help get things back on schedule. Otherwise the show will continue to be behind schedule and every band will be pissed.

 

[LBS-bass]

Cutting a band off by jumping on-stage is IMO a dickmove. If they needed the set to be cut down, it should be communicated to the band before it hits the stage.

I don't know about that.

The image I have in my head is band playing a ten minute psychedelic number at the end of a set that's already teetering on going over time while organizer is glancing at his watch. Dude has been waiting for ten minutes and he thought five minutes ago that he might have a chance to tell them "ok, you have time for one more," but now realizes he should have stepped up ten minutes earlier. Then when he thinks the already-long song is over, "psychedelic breakdown with long drum solo" starts, dude whips out the violin bow to start banging on the guitar with it, and organizer decides he has no clue how much longer this is going to go on, so it's time to pull the plug.

He absolutely should have communicated to the band that the set needed to be shortened beforehand, but if they were already over their allotted amount of time by this point (or close to it) I don't see how this guy would have thought waiting another ten minutes to find a proper time to tell them to wrap it up in some other way would have been a good idea.

 

[bassliner50]

Anyone or anything that is most likely to provide the most economic benefit will be featured first and foremost 99% of the time.

 

[rocu]

Cutting you off without warning was not a good way to handle the situation. I would think twice about playing this event again.

The time slot thing is another story. Bands made up of donors who draw crowds who make donations should get the best slots. Are you a donor? Do your friends donate large sums?

Was the slot you got better than previous years?

 

[RustyAxe]

Might as well learn this now .... "fundraiser" means it's not about YOU or your band. It's about getting attendees to dig into their pockets and cough up some green for the cause.

 

[JohnnyBottom]

A stage manager should have been keeping things on schedule. 5 minutes, no
big deal, BUT getting cut off mid stream is totally lame. With some warning certainly
wouldve cut the drum solo and self indulgent jamming a benefit crowd probably had
no interest in.

 

[dtsamples]

Last five minutes of a half-hour set at fundraising event is not the time for a big psychedelic break down with a violin bow on guitar. I'm not even sure "filling the time in a 3-hour headliner set on a national tour" is the appropriate time for a big psychedelic break down with a violin bow on guitar, but if it isn't, it's certainly closer to the right context.

Sorry to be a bit harsh, but if you take your hard lessons young you'll be ahead of the pack in your early 20s.

 

[LBS-bass]

Did everyone miss the fact that he said their last song was really long?

 

[Hurricane Jimmie]

So Anyway, I think trying to put a benefit in a 'professional' category is missing the mark... unless it's a big corporate event. This doesn't sound like it. The organizer probably doesn't do this for a living.
Although I don't do a lot of these events, I always believe 'Leave Your Ego At The Door' is the best practice. Some possibilities for cutting your band off mid-song:

• The organizer was trying to push bands through.... probably didn't factor in or care about the effort your band had put into the last song.
• Maybe he thought the song wasn't working for the crowd.
• There could have been a band that he needed to get in & out because they had a gig later that evening...He might have been desperate to get the next band going and try to get back on schedule.
• Perhaps some of the later bands were graduates of your music program and also demonstrated the value of music education.
• One of the bands had made a big donation.

His job of organizing the event had a much broader scope that the performance of any one band. Hard to tell without talking to him... which you probably should. It might help you understand what he's looking for and give you another insight into the music business. And it might help him too.

Another thing to consider is the donations generated from a benefit. Perhaps some groups got better spots because they could draw an audience with better donation records or generate higher bar/dining tabs. Hopefully, the event received a portion of the receipts.

Sorry to sound like your Dad/Grandpa... but I do wish you good luck and hope you're not too discouraged. Just look through the Band Management threads... these things happen all the time.

 

[Mushroo]

Not sure what you are on about, I was getting paid to play professionally in high school. Ageism is B.S. and professionalism is how you act. Seems to me the OP handled it like a pro, unlike the promoter.

Obviously there are teenage professional musicians. But I didn't see any mention in the original post that this was a paying gig (or that the event was organized by a paid professional promoter). Sounds to me like this is more of a "volunteer for a good cause" type of situation.

 

[micguy]

I play in churches. When the guy talking can't keep his part to the agreed upon duration, we lose a tune - it happens. The guy who cut you off may not have been the person that made the decision to cut your time, it could be someone else. So don't get angry with anyone in particular.

Use it as inspiration - write your own tune about the experience. "Welcome to the Machine" Earned Pink Floyd an awful lot of money; if you listen to the lyrics, it's about how they were treated not so well, by people that didn't value them all that well.

 

[Beej]

Lots of good points made already. I'll add that we typically have three strong songs at the end of our sets, and that way we can end the set on any of them, in case things run short. We also have another couple of strong ones as backups in case the promoter says, "keep going!".

 

[Cliff Colton]

The audience was ready to start drinking and you underage guys were holding it up.

As they say in the promotion world: "Violin bowing bakes no bread."

 

[D.A.R.K.]

Obviously there are teenage professional musicians. But I didn't see any mention in the original post that this was a paying gig (or that the event was organized by a paid professional promoter). Sounds to me like this is more of a "volunteer for a good cause" type of situation.

Lots of professionals do fund raisers. It's a big part of being a successful professional, actually.

 

[Diamond_Dave]

What happened after the guitarist hit the promoter with his telecaster?

He did hit him with his telecaster, right?

Has Keith Richards taught this generation nothing about prosperity and longevity?

 

[RichardW]

You lost me at "psychedelic breakdown and drum solo."

Seriously though, this is why communication is so important. There should be frank discussion up front with the organizer. For example, what does a "good slot" really mean? (Your definition may vary from the organizer's). Who will be in the audience? Is it the right crowd for psychedelic breakdowns and drum solos? (remember, your job as a band is to entertain the audience, not to indulge yourself). You should discuss in advance time expectations and what will happen if things start falling behind schedule.

All that said, I think the onus was on the organizer--he's the adult (presumably) and he's dealing with high school kids. And let's face it--we're not talking about Live Aid. Cutting you off without warning is pretty shabby in my book.

But, hey, as others have said: welcome to the music business. I'd chalk this up as a learning experience for you. After you hit it big you'll be able to tell a great story about the jerk who cut you off right before you got into your psychedelic breakdown and drum solo. Keep at it.

 

[twinjet]

Two weekends ago, my band played for a Music Education fundraiser at a resturant in our hometown. This is great for us considering we're in high school. But because of our age it seems as though we got pushed aside for other adult friends of the gig organizer. Pretty ironic considering this was supposed to be for giving young people gig and learning experience...

Anyways, this goes back a while. My band was the first to email the organizer about the event. This is also our third year playing it. For this, the gig organizer promised he would give us a great spot since we were on our game and are "veterans" of the event. We check a couple weeks later at the slots. We were placed at 3:30 in the afternoon while other adult bands and friends of the organizer were placed at prime time spots for eating dinner like 6:30, 7, and 7:30. This seemed a little bogus with the promise he made. Also the fact this is a fundraiser for students. My drummer emails him back asking why we didn't get a better spot like he told us. This was kind of sketchy to me. He did make us a promise and 3:30 isn't that great of a spot. I don't know if it was worthy of a complaint by my drummer. But I also can't decide if we're right to complain.

I guess this turned him off from us because there's some more to the story. The next part needs some context. Our last song was fairly long and at the end had a psychedelic breakdown and drum solo, which we worked on for quite a long time. This will be important.

We get to the gig and find out it's running late which is no big deal. We go on and do our thing and we start to get into the breakdown. My guitar player pulls out a violin bow and starts playing with it.

Suddenly, the organizer comes on stage and says our band name and "let's give them a hand" signaling we're getting kicked off. We all end the song and start packing up. In a very annoyed voice the organizer says, "pack up fast guys".

Now, we weren't running late. Since the gig was running late before us, the organizer cut off five minutes of our set without telling us beforehand. That sucked. It seems like he blatantly did not want us to play. I wasn't too concerned because this type of stuff happens when you're in a local band, but my drummer was furious.

In general, was the organizer a professional guy? Is this just local band craziness or really unprofessional?

Unfortunately, part of the learning experience is that your sets may be pushed and pulled, and often. You, as entertainers, are there to help make the restaurant money. Fundraiser or not, if seats are emptying faster than they're filling, it may cause panic.

The music business can be tough. I wish I could say it, but this probably won't be your last bad experience.

 

[Hasty]

For example, what does a "good slot" really mean? (Your definition may vary from the organizer's).

Man this x 1,000,000! At this point in my life a 3 PM slot would be awesome! One of my all time favorite gigs was a Sunday Afternoon 3-6 pm slot we did a while back. I really don't like staying up late like I used to...

 

[edro]

Welcome to 'festival' type gigs... Just is....

I am NOT excusing how he cut you off, that sucked. He could have said earlier, drop a tune or two to slide back toward the schedule.

In a Fest format, you do what stageboss says. Granted this was a local deal but there is a reason there should be a stageboss...

Most everybody in here that have played fest gigs have experienced similar a time or two...
Most everybody in here that have played fest gigs have experienced an incompetent stageboss...
Most everybody in here that have played fest gigs have experienced an efficient stageboss...
A good stageboss doesn't play, he is paid to be a badass, control the stagemunkys, and watch the clock.
He can hurt your feelings if you take things personal...

Most of us have been there.... Just let it go and move on. It wasn't personal.

You can rationalize, bitch and moan to no end, but it will accomplish nothing.
If you continue to gig, you will see worse...far worse.....
Trust me on that. Most folks in here have seen stuff...dark and scary stuff....
You will too....

 

[arbiterusa]

Trick question. Promoters are never "professional"

That sarcasm out of the way, well, it could have been worse. I've been soundguy/stage manager for shows where I've had to do a "hard cutoff" by killing the stage power. Some bands - and a good friend of mine was in one of them at the time - had people who WOULD NOT STOP ON TIME, trying to get more playing time and pulling a dominance move on the other bands playing. That band was the first, but not the last, that I've done a power cut on.

If I'm in charge, everyone WILL start and stop on time. I'm running stagehands, lighting guys, and firm deadlines for being packed and loaded out of a clean building. And if some meathead succeeds in running over, well, then that comes out of everyone else's time. And I tell everyone who is responsible for it and why.