What causes flabby strings on basses besides tension?

[shoulderpet]

Hi
Was just wondering what causes flabby strings on basses. To be more specific I have 3 short scale basses a Fender Mustang PJ, a Squier Jaguar ss and a Squier Mikey way Mustang, out of the 3 short scale basses the E string is absolutely fine on both the Squier Jaguar and the Fender Mustang PJ but the E string on the Mikey way Mustang is a little on the flabby side unless I use a heavy gauge E string. I know lack of tension is one thing that can make a string flabby but these basses all have the same brand and same gauge of strings on them so what is it that makes my Mikey Way Mustang sound and feel flabby on the E string and not my other basses, obviously it is more than just tension related.

 

[spade2you]

One hidden culprit can be a poorly reinforced neck. Some of the flop sound you hear is the neck flexing as you play a note. This gets more pronounced on low B strings.

 

[shoulderpet]

One hidden culprit can be a poorly reinforced neck. Some of the flop sound you hear is the neck flexing as you play a note. This gets more pronounced on low B strings.

Yowzers!! don't like the sound of that

 

[dabbler]

Whether there is noise or not, the amount of stiffness of the neck is a factor in the "feel" of floppiness in the strings.

 

[Gorn]

The E string is flabby every time you've changed it?

 

[Grumpynuts]

Whether there is noise or not, the amount of stiffness of the neck is a factor in the "feel" of floppiness in the strings.

A lot of guys know this unconsciously. Ever notice when you get a new bass, even if it is same scale/similar bridge/etc you go through strings trying to find that feel? I have had times where I spent just as much on strings as I did on the bass trying to get it right. Flats on a heavy metal setup, rounds on a jazz, it's all good if YOU like it. It helps to kinda nerd out a little on what materials go into the construction beyond what accoustic qualities they bring.

With that said, I prefer to play by feel, vs by targeting a sound. Judging by your bass selection I'm guessing you like a bit of pop punk, although I could be wrong, which I always like to play because it's more rockstar feeling vs super technical jazzy playing. So I would keep experimenting to get that feel right.

I like to go down a journey with my basses and find what sound comes out when I get the setup feeling good. I hate fighting a setup just so I can get a sound. So don't worry if your idols use a certain string and bass setup to make their sound, get that bass setup for how you like to play, so that you will.

EDIT: also string height can change your feel, higher feels tighter, lower feels floppier in my experience. But that is usually the last thing I try, since you have to play with intonation and truss rods to get it right after usually. The neck and the strings make the biggest impact in my experience. YMMV

 

[cardinal]

You could try shimming the neck so that you must raise the saddles to maintain the same action. The higher saddles cause a steeper break angle, which can make the strings feel stiffer.

 

[Nedmundo]

One hidden culprit can be a poorly reinforced neck. Some of the flop sound you hear is the neck flexing as you play a note. This gets more pronounced on low B strings.

Yes, and this is partly why I like the ultra-rigid quartersawn necks on two of my G&L basses. I feel this stiffness, especially when playing aggressively, and it seems to contribute to a slightly more focused, i.e., less flabby tone.

 

[TMARK]

Nut and saddle height play a role.

 

[Gravedigger Dav]

Short scale basses will be more prone to this than standard scale (34") or more.
Not dissing short scale, the the physics of producing a note on a string make it so.
Just a reminder - The three things that affect the pitch of a string are:

1. Thickness of the string
2. Length of the string
3. Tension of the string

If you reduce the length, the tension has to be reduced.

 

[Grumpynuts]

Short scale basses will be more prone to this than standard scale (34") or more.
Not dissing short scale, the the physics of producing a note on a string make it so.
Just a reminder - The three things that affect the pitch of a string are:

1. Thickness of the string
2. Length of the string
3. Tension of the string

If you reduce the length, the tension has to be reduced.

Yeah, I hate floppy strings myself, which is why I hate short scale basses. But if you are looking at all things being equal, remember materials could be that missing link.

 

[RED J]

Flabby playing.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

Downforce at the nut.

 

[davegt666]

I contribute it to the size of the neck and action of the strings.

Low action with a jazz neck has always felt a bit flabby to me. So it's always a battle of finding the right string height.

But on a P bass low action feels nice to me. I think the size of the neck just lets the string resonate more since there's more wood.

I may be talking out of butt here but that has just been my experience.

Still love playing a jazz neck, especially live, but at home I always practice with a P for that reason.

 

[George Himmel]

Nut and saddle height play a role.

I'd be willing to bet this is the culprit. Check that the necks are all at equal relief, then check the height of the E strings. Bet the floppiest is the lowest.

 

[tpaul]

In the world of Telecasters, top loaders are known to have a looser feel than string-through loaders. Some people don't like them and some do. The top loaders are often cited as better for those who bend a lot of notes, because the looser feel lends itself to bending strings.

I think this is due to the break angle over the bridge saddles. In the top loader you have a very shallow break angle, whereas on the through-body loaders the string wraps 1/4 around the saddle. More friction on the saddle and a sharper angle means the string feels firmer, less friction and a shallower angle means it feels floppier. At least that's my theory.

Not sure how this translates to your three basses, if at all.

it's also possible that the scale length isn't really the same on the three basses. Have you measured the E string length on each from nut to saddle?

 

[Big Hoss]

Poor diet, and lack of exercise.

Someone had to say it...

 

[DigitalMan]

Yeah, I hate floppy strings myself, which is why I hate short scale basses. But if you are looking at all things being equal, remember materials could be that missing link.

Agreed. I think instead of thickness alone it is the mass and tensile properties of the string.

 

[bridgecables]

This doesn't apply to your case, or to low E on most basses for that matter, but the amount of string between the nut and tuner also significantly affects the tension, because that's part of the string length for some purposes. It is more obvious on guitar, not only because an extra few inches is a greater % of the scale, but also because it is most noticable during bends, where the effective bendable string length is longer so the effort decreases. It is why bending the high E string on a strat doesn't require much force at all. It is probably a big part of why most string sets do not have mathematically balanced tensions. Some guitars have a reverse in-line headstock, resulting in the bass strings having the most extra length between nut and tuner instead of the normal treble configuration, and this gives a very different feel, sought after by some.

 

[MCS4]

I think any difference in setup can seem to effect this, even if only mentally. So, everything from overall bridge/saddle height, differences in height from one-string to another, neck relief, nut height (and where the string is properly seated in the nut), etc.